Reloading .223 - a few questions

[kargo27]

Hello all, I'm new here but looks like there are quite a few veteran reloaders here.

I am brand new to reloading and have some 5.56 and .223 brass.

Will magnum small rifle primers work in the .223? I don't plan on loading to 5.56 pressure.

I have a Lyman T-Mag press and it came with a Lyman reloading manual. I will shoot these reloads at the range only. No hunting. I bought some 55 gr. Remington 224 PSP bullets as well as some Winchester 224 55 gr. FMJBT.

My manual doesn't state which powder to use for these bullets but it does give me a recipe for 55 gr. PSP Hornady or Speer (I think. I don't have the manual in front of me). How can I figure out the best powder to use for these bullets?

I did go to Hodgdon's website and tried to cross reference my bullets but wasn't very successful.

Thanks for any tips.

[PCJim]

Welcome to TFL!

Since you are "green" as a reloader, the answer to using those magnum primers will be a conditional "no". Unless the reloading recipe you are using calls for a magnum primer, stay with the standard primer or one specifically designated for .223.

As to the powder to use with those bullets you have on hand, you can use a recipe for a different manufacture bullet of the same composition, weight and bullet design to begin working up a load, beginning with the stated starting powder load and COL. As an example, a 55gr FMJBT made by Hornady, Speer, Sierra, Zero, Winchester, etc would all be so similar in composition and design that they can be interchanged when working up a load. Notice I said working up a load -if you change any components, you should start back at a reduced charge and work up. Remember also that jacketed load recipes are not interchangable with lead bullets (which I know you don't have at present).

It's always good to ask questions when starting reloading, and you're approaching it correctly. There's a wealth of information to be gained from members here.

[SwampYankee]

Normally I would agree and say "no" but I suspect that SRM primers are all you have been able to get your hands on.

In that case, I have to say "yes", you can use them, but there are some caveats. Firstly, always start your charges low. This is especially important if you are using magnum primers and you have no load data for them. Magnum primers can increase the charge to the equivalent of 0.1 to 1.0 extra grains of powder. This depends on a lot of factors and there is no steadfast rule. However, if you start at the lowest labelled charge and work up, you should be fine. If the difference between the lowest and highest labelled charge is less than 1.0 grain, however, it may be a little more risky. In that case, I typically drop the amount of powder below the published amount. The typical recommendation is to drop charges 10% below max and start there, for any new recipe you use.

Secondly, look for over pressure signs. I won't list them all here, but they are easy to find with the search feature. If you are getting these signs, you'll need to back the charge down.

Having said all this, I admit I have never used SRM primers. I use LRM primers exclusively and SPM primers extensively, but the charge windows for .223 are usually pretty narrow so I stick to standard primers. I also don't use Magnum primers in .40 S&W because this caliber develops pressure way too fast and I'm not comfortable monkeying around with it. I have no problems with .38, .357 Mag and .45 Colt and Magnum primers, but I shoot mostly Ruger's anyway. And I always check my loads with Quickload to get an idea of how close they are to max pressure, with an eye towards staying well away from it.

[Sport45]

There's at least one exception to every rule... Don't use Remington 6-1/2 for .223 or Wolf SR primers in an AR. Wolf recommends using their SRM primers for the harder cups. (Now they market a SR223 and SR556 which are supposed to be purpose-built for .223 and 5.56 but I suspect they are SRM's)

You won't know the best powder for your bullets until you've tried a few. People have good luck with many powders, Varget, RL-15, H335, IMR (or H)4895, AA2230, and Ramshot TAC to name a few.

[QBall45]

Welcome.

You have received good info thus far.

I'll add a few powder choices.

H335
H322
Reloader 15
Reloader 10X
Reloader 7
Varget
TAC

There are many good choices for 223. Best advice is start at the min listed charge and work up to max. Very often the most accuracy is found near or at the max listed charge.

A friendly tip: generally it is helpful to add rifle type, barrel length, and twist rate.

An educated guess says your talking about an AR15 w/ a 16" or 20" barrel and 1:9 twist.

Happy shooting!

[kargo27]

Thanks guys for all the tips!

I should have added that my rifle is an AR15 with a 1:9 twist, 16" barrel.

The SRM primers I have on order are Wolf because that was all I could find. The only reason I ordered the SRM was because on the Weidner's website they said to use SRM for 5.56. At the time, I was thinking 5.56/.223 interchangeably. I do have both brass, the 5.56 is Lake City and .223 is Remington and PMC.

I then realized that I didn't have a recipe for 5.56 in my Lyman manual and primers they used for the data were Remington 7 1/2.

Hmmmm, I may cancel the order for those primers since they haven't shipped yet.

Can I load the 5.56 brass as .223 then? That way I can keep all the charges the same.

Again, thanks for the tips, you have been very helpful! Especially with the powder suggestions and primer info.

BTW, I would never load a charge on the high end of the scale. I'd be too scared to shoot it.

[dsv424]

Just a heads up at my range it is not allowed to use FMJ. Only SP and HP bullets. Not sure if this a rule at other ranges just wanted to warn you.
Also if you have a Bass Pro in your area you may find some Rem. 7 1/2 BR primers. I know the one in Dallas they have the shelves full of them as of 2 days ago.

[QBall45]

Don't cancle that order. Your fine.

Wolff SRM will work just fine for ya. They have the harder cup for use in your AR. Note: I've found no difference using standard SRP vs an arsenel (milspec) primer.

5.56 will become 223 rem when you full length size them. This is what ya want.

You found no data on 5.56 loads because its n/a. Lots of guys get real close to LC/milspec 5.56 specs. I've found no need to get that hot as I get better accuracy at lower speed than milspec.

Hope this helps.

[medalguy]

I load lots of 223 and have had great results with H335 powder on top of Remington SRBR primers. They give very consistent ignition and I don't find any differences in pressure, just possibly better accuracy.

My suggestion would be to look at the various powder manufacturers' web sites and check out what they recommend. Start with some of those recommendations on the low side and work your way up slowly. You might want to take a list of good powders with you when you shop for powder and get whatever's available. Just be sure to document your combinations for future reference, and remember whenever you change ANY component, including a new lot of primers or powder, to start over and work back up. A change of lot can make a difference, and that's why I would recommend buying primers in good lot sizes, at least 1,000 primers or more if you plan to do much reloading.

[kargo27]

Thanks guys again for all the tips.

I spoke with Chris at Wiedner's this morning after I posted and he told me that I had, indeed ordered the correct primer. He said that Wolf for some reason, calls their primers "magnum" but they have the same amount of powder as their SRP's. He said that they spoke to Wolf directly and told them that it's confusing to the consumers. He also said what QBall said and that's that the "magnum" primers have a harder cap. He said he uses and loads these himself and that they are an excellent, quality primer and he's had no issues with them. He said he's a match shooter and avid reloader.

He told me to go with Varget powder and that's what my Lyman manual recommends as the best load. But I wouldn't mind trying some H335 either. Lyman has that listed, too and I think it might be easier to find.

[QBall45]

You should not have much trouble finding the powder you want at this point.

Take your powder list with ya when ya go shopping.

I can't help w/varget.

H335. Start at the min charge listed. For 55gr FMJ's you are likely to find your sweet spot around 24.5gr - 25gr.

You should be able to see MOA at 100 yards w/your gun.

[McClintock]

I've used Varget with 36 gr. Barnes Varmint Grenades and regular Winchester SR primers, and it works good for me. Sweet spot was 26.0 gr Varget, resulted in a 3300fps velocity, and grouped at 1.06" at 100 yards (I think I may have flinched on the flyer that caused the group to be that large). I've been pretty happy with this load, and would definitely use Varget again.

I'm going to try H335 for my next batch of .223 ammo, since the Varget is almost gone. The tinkerer in me just can't leave well enough alone.

Cheers!
McClintock

[jepp2]

To properly resize your brass for your AR15, I have found a cartridge gauge absolutely essential:

http://www.midwayusa.com/viewproduct...tnumber=268983

While I was able to get by loading for my bolt action rifles without the gauges, for AR15's the gauge allows you to check to insure you are getting the proper setback on the shoulder to allow proper chambering. I have never found the need to go to small base dies. You can also use the gauge to check to see if the brass needs trimmed and if they will chamber properly after loading. Just something to consider.

[jepp2]

Forgot to add, make sure your primers are properly seated (not high) to prevent slam fires.

A very good reference:

http://www.exteriorballistics.com/re...sgunreload.cfm

[A_Gamehog]

Very good place to start for infomation.

http://accurateshooter.net/Downloads/sierra223ar.pdf


Ramshot Tac is great Powder in Bulk
AA2230 also for .223
Reloader 10X or <50 grain loads
Too many to list.

The 1-9 twist shoots all of them up to 73 grains. Accurate loads are obtainable with 40-73 grain bullets, you will like the Barnes Varmit Grenades @ 50 grains and 24 +/- grains of H322, Lake City Brass. I stumbled upon this load by accident when my 1-12 Weatherby would not shoot them.
He shot them in his DPMS AR-15 Heavy Bull 1-9 twist like John Wayne at the Alamo!

Welcome to the Forum and good reading.

[kargo27]

Another big thanks!

I've bookmarked posted sites and put them in my "Reloading Info" folder.

Since I have a lot of LC and PMC brass, I also ordered the Dillon Super Swage 600 as well as the cartridge gauge. I think I should be good to go. Just waiting on those primers.

I forgot to ask yall about this. I got a Lee 3-piece Delux die setup. It has the case resizing die, a collet neck resizing die and then the bullet seating die. Do I use all three? I read about the collet neck sizing die and if I understand correctly it's used to clamp the cannelure tighter or less for accuracy?

[PCJim]

The neck sizing die is used mainly for bolt action guns where the brass will be used in a specific rifle chamber. The brass will have already been "sized" for a particular chamber once shot in that chamber and will only need it's neck sized so that it can properly grip the new bullet, thus the neck sizer. The regular FL sizing die will be required for any auto feeding weapon, especially an AR.

[QBall45]

Use the full length sizeing die, bullet seating die. Stick your other die in your spare parts drawer.

Order a Lee factory crimp die. You'll be happy with this.

[kargo27]

Jim-thank you for the clarification, makes sense now.

QBall-the factory crimping die doesn't take the place of the seating die, correct? More like the icing on the cake? I ordered one tonight.