Target Shooting Advice For Novices

dre1x · February 2, 2012, 02:37 PM

Hi all,

I am new to handgun shooting. I am fairly skilled with long guns, both shotgun and rifle, but have never really shot a handgun, except in impromptu scenarios with my buddies.

Recently, I purchased a couple of S&W 22A’s for my wife and I and we joined a local shooting league. Mine has the 5 ½” barrel and hers has the 4” barrel. Both guns have open sights with adjustable rears. She’s a small women and the balance of the short barrel felt better to her. She has virtually no experience in shooting of any kind.

With that bit of background, I need some advice regarding technique and expected results. We shoot weekly at a distance of 50’ at an indoor range rented by the hour by the gun club. Targets have a 4” black circle, 8” outer ring on 12” square paper. We shoot 3 segments, 10 rounds per segment. They are Slow-Fire (10 rounds/10 min), Timed-Fire (5 rounds/20 seconds, reload, repeat) and Rapid-Fire (5 rounds/10 seconds, reload, repeat). A perfect score would be 30 rounds in the 10 circle for a total of 300. We are in our 3rd week of shooting. My cousin and his daughter routinely shoot scores from 210 to 250, and they are by no means the best.

To be honest, I am disappointed in my performance (shooting scores of 100 to 150). My wife has been shooting scores less than that. We are both in our 50’s. I seem to score better on the timed and rapid fire, while my wife seems to do better on the slow timed portion. I have bore sighted both guns at 50’ (the sight rail is part of the barrel and the barrel is removable).

I guess the questions I have are:

Should a different technique be used to sight in the pistols? (It is cold now, up in north and no outdoor open shoot ranges are open and if they were, methodical sighting in 20 degree weather would not be enjoyable)

Should we be sticking to open sights or go to some sort of optics, such as red dots or scopes?

If the guns are sighted properly, should a person stick with open sights and work on technique?

My original intent here was to get us more proficient with handguns and to eventually acquire our Carry Permits. Which is why, I thought, maybe learning to shoot accurately with open sights would be better. Sorry this is bit long, but I wanted to give pertinent background information.

Any thoughts, advice and ideas would be welcomed. I am a firm believer in taking advice from people who have ‘been there, done that’!

Thanks, in advance!

glenncal1 · February 2, 2012, 03:28 PM

Since you said you are both in your 50's, how is your vision. You might ask around and see if anybody can recommend an eye doctor that is a shooter or has worked with shooters in the past. I did this and got some glasses that help although my eyes aren't what they were (nor is anything else) when I was young. If your league allows it, some sort of optical sighting device may help.

Practice and practice with a purpose, you may even want to pay for some lessons.

sgms · February 2, 2012, 04:26 PM

As a new competitive pistol shooter low scores are not uncommon but are very frustrating. Just remember that 10 ring is only 3/4 of an inch across and, it is 50 feet away. Learning how to correctly use the iron sights on you pistol is a must do, even more so if you plan to use the training for a carry gun. However once learned the use of a red dot sight, if allowed by your club, will help you scores because it removes the problems with having rear sight, front sight, and target in focus, this allows you to concentrate on dot placement on the target. This clarity of focus however is not nearly as important in a S.D. gun. Here you will be shooting center of mass at a target at lest 10 inches across from a probable distance of 7 to 11 feet so a slightly blurred view is not as critical. Getting lessons if you can is a good idea, as for technique see if one of the people in your club who is a good match shooter (preferably in the master class) will give you help and pointers to keep from gaining bad habits and ideas of what to practice. Most important, practice, as glenncal 1 stated practice with a purpose.

dre1x · February 2, 2012, 05:02 PM

thx for the advice, we are getting to know a few of the guys, some are excellent shooters and a couple offer shooting courses. I have done a lot of research regarding good/bad habits. But, that being said, even the pros in various sports hire trainers and coaches. I will take your advice to heart. Thx

GlenF · February 2, 2012, 05:20 PM

Well dre1x, I think you have made it very hard on yourself. Consider shooting at a target 5 yards away. Once you can get the holes in a small area, move the target further away. Keep practicing and moving the target further as you improve.

I didn't come up with that idea. My wife has had a bunch of shooting instruction, and this is what got her up and running.

By the way, 50 yards is not something lots of pistol shooters are good at.

dre1x · February 2, 2012, 05:26 PM

We are shooting at 50' (ft) not 50 yards. Yes, when the weather gets nicer here in the north we can try some shorter distances at the outdoor range!
Thx

g.willikers · February 2, 2012, 06:03 PM

Once a week isn't all that much practice.
Maybe a good quality airgun for home use would help.
Find one that is a close match to your firearms.
Trigger time is trigger time.
Pyramydair.com is a good place to look for airguns.
http://www.pyramydair.com/

kraigwy · February 2, 2012, 07:30 PM

dre1x

If you are serious about learning to shoot a pistol, PM me with your e-mail address and I'll send you the USAMU Service Pistol Guide in .pdf format,

It will get you started right, with the proper fundamentals of pistol shooting. Then you can move on to any type of pistol shooting you desire.

Fundamentals are fundamentals, this guide is put out by the Army Marksmanship Unit, the best shooters in the world.

MrBorland · February 2, 2012, 08:50 PM

Quote:

Fundamentals are fundamentals

kraigwy's right.

Theoretically, there's not much to shooting well: Just get a good sight picture and break the shot without disturbing that picture. But doing that well is another matter entirely, and the Devil's in the details: Even if we know the fundamentals, we can trick ourselves into thinking we're applying them well, so we get confused and frustrated when we shoot poorly. The target's the recording device, though, and tells the real story, so we have to be very honest with ourselves about where we might not be doing so well at applying the fundamentals. Did I watch...really watch...that front sight? Did I really watch it as the trigger broke? What was going on in my head as I prepared to break the shot? Was I thinking about having to make a good shot, rather than on the execution itself?

My advice, then, is to be patient with yourself, read up on the fundamentals, practice daily at home via dry fire (a good air pistol's not a bad suggestion, either), and focus on the process of executing the fundamentals well, rather than the goal of a good score. Execute the fundamentals well, and your score will take care of itself.

SauerGrapes · February 2, 2012, 09:37 PM

You might want to take a look @ www.bullseyepistol.com. They have some interesting reading there.
One of the guys that shoots once in a while at our club is one of the contributors with tips on shooting. I watched him shoot a 2662 in a 2700 match. It was really something to watch!
I shoot a fair amount of pistol, but found shooting one handed takes a good bit of practice. It took quite a bit of time for me to reduce my wobble.

Boncrayon · February 3, 2012, 03:40 PM

Target shooting is all about stance, breathing, grip, trigger sqeeze, and follow through. Ask your Range Officer for suggestions.

Your feet stance should not exceed your shoulder width.

Do not cross your thumbs....rather, parallel them to the side, and don't use your thumbs as part of your grip.

Don't forget to take a full breath each time you shoot, releasing your breath slowly as you squeeze the trigger. Hold your breath only before your discharge.

Do NOT fire the firearm. Let the firearm do the firing. Do not force a quick click at the end of the squeeze.

If you are right handed, keep your right arm twisted inward and fully extended.

Lean slightly into the target.

Ronbert · February 3, 2012, 05:30 PM

That's the routine I ran as the RSO at my range.

If you can't focus so intently on the front sight as to be able to see if someone might have put a slight pencil mark across the black paint of the blade then you aren't seeing the front sight adequately.

I had to switch to using my computer glasses several years ago to be able to focus like that.

If you CAN see that well, then you still have to work on all those other fundamentals.

It ain't as easy to shoot precisely as it looks.

TxFlyFish · February 3, 2012, 05:37 PM

I'd have to second the advice from boncrayon. Some platforms are best left alone ie let it fire and let it recoil by itself. Your follow up times will suffer but when you need accuracy foremost you just need to let the pistol do its thing. I shoot many many pistols in a single trip and it takes time to reacquaint with every platform. But if you break some of the "shooting rules" and think yourself as a rest that all it does is pull the trigger you will have very good results across platform

**Frank Ettin** · February 3, 2012, 07:28 PM

Here's kind of the long form of my discussion on trigger control. It's one of the things we emphasize at the monthly NRA Basic Handgun classes I and a group of others teach together. We know this works because (1) it's how we learned ourselves; and (2) most importantly, our students, most of whom have never held a gun before, when drilled this way can hit the target consistently (even with some powerful guns -- although we do start them with .22s).

The first principle of accurate shooting is trigger control: a smooth, press straight back on the trigger with only the trigger finger moving. Maintain your focus on the front sight as you press the trigger, increasing pressure on the trigger until the shot breaks. Don't try to predict exactly when the gun will go off nor try to cause the shot to break at a particular moment. This is what Jeff Cooper called the "surprise break."  (This is where the mantra, Front Sight Press, comes from.)

The position of the trigger finger on the trigger will help to make sure you push the trigger straight back. Ideally you want to contact the trigger at the center of the first part of your finger, mid way between the tip and first joint; and this first part of your finger should be perpendicular to the direction the trigger travels. (However, with some double action guns, one might need to contact the trigger with the first joint to get enough leverage.) Note that if the gun is too big for you, you might not be able to properly reach the trigger; you want to find a gun that's better size for you.

By keeping focus on the front sight and increasing pressure on the trigger until the gun essentially shoots itself, you don’t anticipate the shot breaking. But if you try to make the shot break at that one instant in time when everything seem steady and aligned, you usually wind up jerking the trigger. Of course the gun will wobble some on the target. Try not to worry about the wobble and don’t worry about trying to keep the sight aligned on a single point. Just let the front sight be somewhere in a small, imaginary box in the center of the target.

Also, work on follow through. Be aware of where on the target the front sight is as the shot breaks and watch the front sight lift off that point as the gun recoils – all the time maintaining focus on the front sight.

Also, while practice in very important, remember that practice doesn’t make perfect. It’s “PERFECT practice makes perfect.” More frequent practice shooting fewer rounds, but concentrating hard on what you’re doing, will be more productive than less frequent, higher round count practice.

 Practice deliberately, making every shot count, to program good habits and muscle memory. Dry practice is very helpful. You just want to triple check that the gun is not loaded, and there should be no ammunition anywhere around. When engaging in dry practice, religiously follow Rule 2 - Never Let Your Muzzle Cover Anything You Are Not Willing To Destroy." As you dry fire, you want to reach the point where you can't see any movement of the sight as the sear releases and the hammer falls.

Finally, some instruction is always a good idea. I try to take classes from time to time; and I always learn something new.

Think: front sight, press, surprise.

February 2, 2012, 02:37 PM	#1
dre1x Junior Member Join Date: January 5, 2012 Posts: 6	Target Shooting Advice For Novices Hi all, I am new to handgun shooting. I am fairly skilled with long guns, both shotgun and rifle, but have never really shot a handgun, except in impromptu scenarios with my buddies. Recently, I purchased a couple of S&W 22A’s for my wife and I and we joined a local shooting league. Mine has the 5 ½” barrel and hers has the 4” barrel. Both guns have open sights with adjustable rears. She’s a small women and the balance of the short barrel felt better to her. She has virtually no experience in shooting of any kind. With that bit of background, I need some advice regarding technique and expected results. We shoot weekly at a distance of 50’ at an indoor range rented by the hour by the gun club. Targets have a 4” black circle, 8” outer ring on 12” square paper. We shoot 3 segments, 10 rounds per segment. They are Slow-Fire (10 rounds/10 min), Timed-Fire (5 rounds/20 seconds, reload, repeat) and Rapid-Fire (5 rounds/10 seconds, reload, repeat). A perfect score would be 30 rounds in the 10 circle for a total of 300. We are in our 3rd week of shooting. My cousin and his daughter routinely shoot scores from 210 to 250, and they are by no means the best. To be honest, I am disappointed in my performance (shooting scores of 100 to 150). My wife has been shooting scores less than that. We are both in our 50’s. I seem to score better on the timed and rapid fire, while my wife seems to do better on the slow timed portion. I have bore sighted both guns at 50’ (the sight rail is part of the barrel and the barrel is removable). I guess the questions I have are: Should a different technique be used to sight in the pistols? (It is cold now, up in north and no outdoor open shoot ranges are open and if they were, methodical sighting in 20 degree weather would not be enjoyable) Should we be sticking to open sights or go to some sort of optics, such as red dots or scopes? If the guns are sighted properly, should a person stick with open sights and work on technique? My original intent here was to get us more proficient with handguns and to eventually acquire our Carry Permits. Which is why, I thought, maybe learning to shoot accurately with open sights would be better. Sorry this is bit long, but I wanted to give pertinent background information. Any thoughts, advice and ideas would be welcomed. I am a firm believer in taking advice from people who have ‘been there, done that’! Thanks, in advance!

February 2, 2012, 03:28 PM	#2
glenncal1 Senior Member Join Date: April 21, 2009 Location: Denver area Posts: 504	Since you said you are both in your 50's, how is your vision. You might ask around and see if anybody can recommend an eye doctor that is a shooter or has worked with shooters in the past. I did this and got some glasses that help although my eyes aren't what they were (nor is anything else) when I was young. If your league allows it, some sort of optical sighting device may help. Practice and practice with a purpose, you may even want to pay for some lessons. __________________ Jim Many K and N Frames

February 2, 2012, 06:03 PM	#7
g.willikers Senior Member Join Date: September 28, 2008 Posts: 10,442	Once a week isn't all that much practice. Maybe a good quality airgun for home use would help. Find one that is a close match to your firearms. Trigger time is trigger time. Pyramydair.com is a good place to look for airguns. http://www.pyramydair.com/ __________________ Walt Kelly, alias Pogo, sez: “Don't take life so serious, son, it ain't nohow permanent.”

February 2, 2012, 07:30 PM	#8
kraigwy Senior Member Join Date: June 16, 2008 Location: Wyoming Posts: 11,061	dre1x If you are serious about learning to shoot a pistol, PM me with your e-mail address and I'll send you the USAMU Service Pistol Guide in .pdf format, It will get you started right, with the proper fundamentals of pistol shooting. Then you can move on to any type of pistol shooting you desire. Fundamentals are fundamentals, this guide is put out by the Army Marksmanship Unit, the best shooters in the world. __________________ Kraig Stuart CPT USAR Ret USAMU Sniper School Distinguished Rifle Badge 1071

February 2, 2012, 09:37 PM	#10
SauerGrapes Senior Member Join Date: March 22, 2009 Location: S.E.PA. Posts: 920	You might want to take a look @ www.bullseyepistol.com. They have some interesting reading there. One of the guys that shoots once in a while at our club is one of the contributors with tips on shooting. I watched him shoot a 2662 in a 2700 match. It was really something to watch! I shoot a fair amount of pistol, but found shooting one handed takes a good bit of practice. It took quite a bit of time for me to reduce my wobble. __________________ NRA member, DCF&S member, PAFOA member, USPSA member, NSCA member R.I.P.____Murphy

February 2, 2012, 04:26 PM	#3
sgms Senior Member Join Date: May 30, 2010 Location: Arizona or Ohio depending Posts: 1,021	As a new competitive pistol shooter low scores are not uncommon but are very frustrating. Just remember that 10 ring is only 3/4 of an inch across and, it is 50 feet away. Learning how to correctly use the iron sights on you pistol is a must do, even more so if you plan to use the training for a carry gun. However once learned the use of a red dot sight, if allowed by your club, will help you scores because it removes the problems with having rear sight, front sight, and target in focus, this allows you to concentrate on dot placement on the target. This clarity of focus however is not nearly as important in a S.D. gun. Here you will be shooting center of mass at a target at lest 10 inches across from a probable distance of 7 to 11 feet so a slightly blurred view is not as critical. Getting lessons if you can is a good idea, as for technique see if one of the people in your club who is a good match shooter (preferably in the master class) will give you help and pointers to keep from gaining bad habits and ideas of what to practice. Most important, practice, as glenncal 1 stated practice with a purpose.

February 2, 2012, 05:02 PM	#4
dre1x Junior Member Join Date: January 5, 2012 Posts: 6	thx for the advice, we are getting to know a few of the guys, some are excellent shooters and a couple offer shooting courses. I have done a lot of research regarding good/bad habits. But, that being said, even the pros in various sports hire trainers and coaches. I will take your advice to heart. Thx

February 2, 2012, 05:20 PM	#5
GlenF Member Join Date: April 4, 2011 Location: Monett, Missouri Posts: 98	Well dre1x, I think you have made it very hard on yourself. Consider shooting at a target 5 yards away. Once you can get the holes in a small area, move the target further away. Keep practicing and moving the target further as you improve. I didn't come up with that idea. My wife has had a bunch of shooting instruction, and this is what got her up and running. By the way, 50 yards is not something lots of pistol shooters are good at.

February 2, 2012, 05:26 PM	#6
dre1x Junior Member Join Date: January 5, 2012 Posts: 6	We are shooting at 50' (ft) not 50 yards. Yes, when the weather gets nicer here in the north we can try some shorter distances at the outdoor range! Thx

February 3, 2012, 03:40 PM	#11
Boncrayon Senior Member Join Date: March 24, 2008 Posts: 920	Target Shooting Advice For Novices Target shooting is all about stance, breathing, grip, trigger sqeeze, and follow through. Ask your Range Officer for suggestions. Your feet stance should not exceed your shoulder width. Do not cross your thumbs....rather, parallel them to the side, and don't use your thumbs as part of your grip. Don't forget to take a full breath each time you shoot, releasing your breath slowly as you squeeze the trigger. Hold your breath only before your discharge. Do NOT fire the firearm. Let the firearm do the firing. Do not force a quick click at the end of the squeeze. If you are right handed, keep your right arm twisted inward and fully extended. Lean slightly into the target.

February 3, 2012, 05:30 PM	#12
Ronbert Senior Member Join Date: September 23, 2009 Location: Ft. Collins, CO. Posts: 398	That's the routine I ran as the RSO at my range. If you can't focus so intently on the front sight as to be able to see if someone might have put a slight pencil mark across the black paint of the blade then you aren't seeing the front sight adequately. I had to switch to using my computer glasses several years ago to be able to focus like that. If you CAN see that well, then you still have to work on all those other fundamentals. It ain't as easy to shoot precisely as it looks.

February 3, 2012, 05:37 PM	#13
TxFlyFish Senior Member Join Date: October 18, 2011 Posts: 1,246	I'd have to second the advice from boncrayon. Some platforms are best left alone ie let it fire and let it recoil by itself. Your follow up times will suffer but when you need accuracy foremost you just need to let the pistol do its thing. I shoot many many pistols in a single trip and it takes time to reacquaint with every platform. But if you break some of the "shooting rules" and think yourself as a rest that all it does is pull the trigger you will have very good results across platform

February 3, 2012, 07:28 PM	#14
Frank Ettin Staff Join Date: November 23, 2005 Location: California - San Francisco Posts: 9,471	Here's kind of the long form of my discussion on trigger control. It's one of the things we emphasize at the monthly NRA Basic Handgun classes I and a group of others teach together. We know this works because (1) it's how we learned ourselves; and (2) most importantly, our students, most of whom have never held a gun before, when drilled this way can hit the target consistently (even with some powerful guns -- although we do start them with .22s). The first principle of accurate shooting is trigger control: a smooth, press straight back on the trigger with only the trigger finger moving. Maintain your focus on the front sight as you press the trigger, increasing pressure on the trigger until the shot breaks. Don't try to predict exactly when the gun will go off nor try to cause the shot to break at a particular moment. This is what Jeff Cooper called the "surprise break."  (This is where the mantra, Front Sight Press, comes from.) The position of the trigger finger on the trigger will help to make sure you push the trigger straight back. Ideally you want to contact the trigger at the center of the first part of your finger, mid way between the tip and first joint; and this first part of your finger should be perpendicular to the direction the trigger travels. (However, with some double action guns, one might need to contact the trigger with the first joint to get enough leverage.) Note that if the gun is too big for you, you might not be able to properly reach the trigger; you want to find a gun that's better size for you. By keeping focus on the front sight and increasing pressure on the trigger until the gun essentially shoots itself, you don’t anticipate the shot breaking. But if you try to make the shot break at that one instant in time when everything seem steady and aligned, you usually wind up jerking the trigger. Of course the gun will wobble some on the target. Try not to worry about the wobble and don’t worry about trying to keep the sight aligned on a single point. Just let the front sight be somewhere in a small, imaginary box in the center of the target. Also, work on follow through. Be aware of where on the target the front sight is as the shot breaks and watch the front sight lift off that point as the gun recoils – all the time maintaining focus on the front sight. Also, while practice in very important, remember that practice doesn’t make perfect. It’s “PERFECT practice makes perfect.” More frequent practice shooting fewer rounds, but concentrating hard on what you’re doing, will be more productive than less frequent, higher round count practice.  Practice deliberately, making every shot count, to program good habits and muscle memory. Dry practice is very helpful. You just want to triple check that the gun is not loaded, and there should be no ammunition anywhere around. When engaging in dry practice, religiously follow Rule 2 - Never Let Your Muzzle Cover Anything You Are Not Willing To Destroy." As you dry fire, you want to reach the point where you can't see any movement of the sight as the sear releases and the hammer falls. Finally, some instruction is always a good idea. I try to take classes from time to time; and I always learn something new. Think: front sight, press, surprise.