Pick a gun from inventory for my Mom to take CCW

j357 · June 13, 2012, 10:20 PM

My mother is finally planning on getting her CCW license. Thankfully we both have a number of guns to choose from (except the Ruger MkIII possibility which I have been considering purchasing). I am interested in personal insight and feedback on picking one of our pistols/revolvers for her to use in during her class.

She is 66 years old, has some arthritis and lack of muscle strength issues, with what I would consider a typical (for her age) concern about being able to shoot 100 rounds over the course of two hours. She currently has two .38 revolvers (Det Spl and SP101) for protection in her house and can shoot them both well for a few cylinders worth. Extended use in the class is her primary concern in the form of becoming recoil adverse and fatigued from holding the firearm at arms length.

Colt Detective Spl, .38, = 21 oz
Colt Model 1903 .32 = 22 oz (easy to chamber, but may become tiresome)
Makarov .380 = 25 oz (tight on racking the slide for her as I recall)
Ruger SP101 .38 = 25 oz - I gave this one to her as a Mother’s day present many years ago

Ruger MKIII .22 = 32 oz
SW Model 10 .38 = 32 oz

My initial thought was the Colt M1903 or the Makarov , but dealing with loading the magazines and chambering rounds may wear her out as she is less familiar with autoloaders. The Ruger MKIII 22 is a good thought but the overall weight and being an auto may be a no go. After typing this out I am considering suggesting the Detective Spl or SP101 as I am a reloader and could supply her with a 100 rounds of 148 grn wad cutters over 3 grns of Universal that have little recoil in my larger 38s.

I plan to have her shoot each of the possible guns but would like to give her the best chance of success from the start and make the most of our range time prior to the class. Anyone have any recent similar experience or thoughts on which of the six might be best for her?

willmc33 · June 13, 2012, 10:24 PM

Colt Detective Special with standard pressure .38 Special.

ScottRiqui · June 13, 2012, 10:39 PM

Is the class an "official" part of the testing/licensing procedure, or is it just for learning & practice? I'm wondering if there are any minimum caliber requirements, or if the type of gun (semiauto vs. revolver) matters in your state.

In Texas, you have to use a .32 caliber or greater handgun on the qualification test. Also, if you want to carry a semiauto with your CHL, you must qualify with a semiauto on the test.

sgms · June 13, 2012, 10:40 PM

My mother was telling me that she was having trouble pulling the slide on her pistol and wanted to get something she could handle better. We went through the safe and she selected what she though felt good in her hand and off to the range we went. After a couple of hours she started to narrow the list, we did the range with her short list several time always narrowing it until she found what she was most comfortable handling and shooting. Now she and a couple of her friends(all in there late 70's early 80's) go to the range 2 or 3 times a month and shoot. (I lost my S&W model 36 with a 3 inch barrel but now have her fathers 1911 service pistol resting in it's place.)
You might try the same thing, let mom shoot what ever she want and let her decide what will work best for her.

danez71 · June 13, 2012, 11:07 PM

Id pick the one that SHE picks since she is the one thats going to be shooting it.

j357 · June 13, 2012, 11:12 PM

Good questions Scott. She is in KY, with no caliber requirement or license what you carry limit. However, she will be required to clean (and perhaps field strip, which may limit her to revolvers depending on instructors). Thanks for the question.

j357 · June 13, 2012, 11:18 PM

Thanks danez71, I edited the original post to add highlight to the obvious, just so there is no confusion, as that is exactly what I plan to do.

Dragline45 · June 13, 2012, 11:20 PM

Excessive loading of magazines for 2 hours would be hell on her fingers if she has arthritis. Seeing as she has two revolvers of her own it seems that's what she prefers, get her a good set of shooting gloves so the excessive range session wont be too bad on her hands. Also she can wrap a bandaid around her trigger finger if that's a concern.

danez71 · June 14, 2012, 08:46 PM

What are the chances of getting (for example) 10 mags fully loaded for the Ruger MKIII .22 with the intent that all she'll have to do change mags in the gun and not have to reload mags with rounds?

Or maybe 5 mags?

Can she use that concept to her advantage?

Just trying to explore options.......

j357 · June 14, 2012, 09:13 PM

Dragline, thanks the thought on the shooting gloves, that is a +1^.
Thanks to Danez71 for the though of preloaded mags. I agree that loading the mags would be tough for her as well, as I'm rubbing lotion on two "paper" cuts on my right thumb from shucking and reloading one Makarov mag right now.

The thought of loading up multiple MkIII mags is interesting. She will only have to qualify with shooting 11 shots of 20 in the outline of a B21 target at 7 yards. I'm thinking 7 mags would be good and get her through 20 or 30 practice rounds then qualify with 2 mags and a leftover 2 if a retest is required.

None of that would be feasible with the Model 1903 due to lack of mags at a reasonable price.

Leaning toward the MkIII and the Det Spl more today.

Al Den · June 14, 2012, 09:42 PM

A 1 lb. 2" .32 Mag 5-shot stainless Charter Arms Undercoverette could be inexpensive enough and she could practice mostly with regular .32's. Low weight (they even have 12-oz. ones in pink and lavender). Manageable recoil. Enough power when you really need it to matter.

aarondhgraham · June 15, 2012, 08:12 AM

In my state if you test with a revolver,,,
You may only carry a revolver or derringer.

If you test with a semi-auto,,,
You may carry any of the three.

Aarond

.

Grant D · June 15, 2012, 08:49 AM

My wife took the test with a auto,and all she had to do was load the first round in the magazine and they finished it for her, and racked the slide for her if she needed help.

She carrys a Walther PPK/S with a round in the chamber and the safety on with her in the car, and a S&W Model 637 in her purse.

In Texas you have to take the test with a automatic, if you want to carry both.
(she is partial to revolvers though)

dcobler · June 15, 2012, 09:15 AM

I would definitely get her some trigger time prior to the class so she could better decide but if the instructors dont have a problem with the pre-loaded mags, then the MKIII sounds like it has it's advantages.

EdInk · June 15, 2012, 09:37 AM

That's alot of shooting for a simple CCW test. Most places seem to require 50rds or less to qualify. I would go with the .22 if they allow it and there is no restriction on using whatever you want to actually carry.

Webleymkv · June 17, 2012, 09:20 AM

It sounds as though she's already fairly comfortable with a revolver, so it would probably be best for her to stick with that platform. Of the three revolvers you listed, the S&W M10 will probably be the easiest to shoot for extended periods because of its trigger and weight.

S&W K-Frames have larger, heavier hammers than Colt D-Frames or Ruger SP101's do which makes it possible to use a lighter mainspring, and thus get a lighter trigger pull, without sacrificing reliable primer ignition. Also, the 30+ oz weight of the K-Frame will dampen recoil the most of the three revolvers making it the most pleasant to shoot. While lighter recoiling guns do exist, I've yet to meet anyone who could not handle the recoil of a S&W K-Frame loaded with standard pressure .38 Special ammunition.

cerberus65 · June 17, 2012, 09:35 AM

My wife used a 6 shot .22LR revolver (a Model 34 snub nose). She doesn't have the hand strength to rack a slide so it had to be a revolver. Once we got her in the groove she was thumb-cocking the hammer and then nailing the target. 4 shots at 7 yards were just shy of being in one hole!

And for those that are interested, in SC the test is 50 shots. And there are no restrictions on your carry gun based on what you qualified with.

Master Blaster 2 · June 17, 2012, 10:42 AM

Colt Detective Spl, .38 with wadcutters

Dragline45 · June 17, 2012, 11:23 AM

Quote:

The thought of loading up multiple MkIII mags is interesting. She will only have to qualify with shooting 11 shots of 20 in the outline of a B21 target at 7 yards. I'm thinking 7 mags would be good and get her through 20 or 30 practice rounds then qualify with 2 mags and a leftover 2 if a retest is required.

http://www.gunblast.com/Cliploader.htm

This thing makes loading MKIII and 22/45 mags a breeze.

Kreyzhorse · June 17, 2012, 11:24 AM

Quote:

Good questions Scott. She is in KY, with no caliber requirement or license what you carry limit. However, she will be required to clean (and perhaps field strip, which may limit her to revolvers depending on instructors). Thanks for the question.

I have my Kentucky CCW. I don't believe she will have to field strip or clean her gun in class. The instructor will exam her gun to make sure it is in good working order and discuss cleaning them but that should be it.

As far as the range exam, I believe she will shoot something like 20 rounds and have to hit her target 10 to 15 times out of those 20 shots to "pass". The target is a full sized silhouette at 7 yards. Nothing too difficult.

So long as she is familiar with the revolver and can reload it, she will be fine. She can shoot in either SA or DA if one suites her over the other.

willr · June 18, 2012, 04:31 PM

When I took my course, the instructor, retired policewoman, herself suggested .22lr. Easy to use and control, minimal recoil. So I used my Ruger22/45.

willr

10-96 · June 18, 2012, 07:52 PM

Hope she doesn't have to go the full 100. Either way, I agree with the suggestions of one of the .38's. Cowboy Action type ammo (it's available in .38 SPL) is often loaded milder than target wadcutter ammo which is harder to find, and should be quite easy on her.

microman · June 18, 2012, 08:39 PM

Quote:

Ruger SP101 .38

My Vote

medalguy · June 18, 2012, 10:48 PM

Load her up some light .38 wadcutter loads and that should help a lot.

My 32 year old daughter wanted to get her CHL in Texas but she had trouble racking the slide on the 9mm Beretta I had given her. We shopped my vault a bit and she picked out a Colt Government Pocketlite .380 to use. The advantage is there's not a powerful blowback spring, but a lighter spring in association with the locking lugs on the barrel, and it took a lot less strength to pull back the slide. That worked well for her.

BusGunner007 · June 19, 2012, 07:02 PM

COLT = 6-shots. 1 more round. 4 less oz.
Extra round, less weight to absorb recoil or carry. Slightly bigger gun. Still have to 'pull back' on the cylinder release latch ( and the cylinder goes around the 'wrong way'

)

RUGER = 5-shots. 1 less round. + 4 oz.
Is it really 'less' when it comes to holding steady?
Nice to have the very slightly less 'bulk' dimensionally.
Easier to 'press the button' when releasing the cylinder latch.
( cylinder rotates...really doesn't matter which way, that was a joke

)

I have owned a RUGER SP-101 and can tell you there is a certain 'heft' to the gun that just FEELS GOOD...confidence inspiring, if you will.
HOT .38's would be a great choice, if MOM wants to try that.

Of what you listed, I'd pick the RUGER.

June 13, 2012, 10:20 PM	#1
j357 Senior Member Join Date: January 25, 2009 Location: Liberty Twp, OH Posts: 283	Pick a gun from inventory for my Mom to take CCW My mother is finally planning on getting her CCW license. Thankfully we both have a number of guns to choose from (except the Ruger MkIII possibility which I have been considering purchasing). I am interested in personal insight and feedback on picking one of our pistols/revolvers for her to use in during her class. She is 66 years old, has some arthritis and lack of muscle strength issues, with what I would consider a typical (for her age) concern about being able to shoot 100 rounds over the course of two hours. She currently has two .38 revolvers (Det Spl and SP101) for protection in her house and can shoot them both well for a few cylinders worth. Extended use in the class is her primary concern in the form of becoming recoil adverse and fatigued from holding the firearm at arms length. Colt Detective Spl, .38, = 21 oz Colt Model 1903 .32 = 22 oz (easy to chamber, but may become tiresome) Makarov .380 = 25 oz (tight on racking the slide for her as I recall) Ruger SP101 .38 = 25 oz - I gave this one to her as a Mother’s day present many years ago Ruger MKIII .22 = 32 oz SW Model 10 .38 = 32 oz My initial thought was the Colt M1903 or the Makarov , but dealing with loading the magazines and chambering rounds may wear her out as she is less familiar with autoloaders. The Ruger MKIII 22 is a good thought but the overall weight and being an auto may be a no go. After typing this out I am considering suggesting the Detective Spl or SP101 as I am a reloader and could supply her with a 100 rounds of 148 grn wad cutters over 3 grns of Universal that have little recoil in my larger 38s. I plan to have her shoot each of the possible guns but would like to give her the best chance of success from the start and make the most of our range time prior to the class. Anyone have any recent similar experience or thoughts on which of the six might be best for her? Last edited by j357; June 13, 2012 at 11:16 PM.

June 13, 2012, 10:24 PM	#2
willmc33 Senior Member Join Date: May 25, 2012 Location: Mobile,Al Posts: 473	Colt Detective Special with standard pressure .38 Special. __________________ "Perfection is the enemy of good enough"

June 15, 2012, 08:12 AM	#12
aarondhgraham Senior Member Join Date: December 1, 2009 Location: Stillwater, OKlahoma Posts: 8,638	The semi-auto,,, In my state if you test with a revolver,,, You may only carry a revolver or derringer. If you test with a semi-auto,,, You may carry any of the three. Aarond . __________________ Never ever give an enemy the advantage of a verbal threat. Caje: The coward dies a thousand times, the brave only once. Kirby: That's about all it takes, ain't it? Aarond is good,,, Aarond is wise,,, Always trust Aarond! (most of the time)

June 15, 2012, 09:15 AM	#14
dcobler Senior Member Join Date: December 30, 2008 Location: Oklahoma, America Posts: 286	I would definitely get her some trigger time prior to the class so she could better decide but if the instructors dont have a problem with the pre-loaded mags, then the MKIII sounds like it has it's advantages. __________________ "Be kind, be courteous, and have a plan to kill everybody you meet."

June 15, 2012, 09:37 AM	#15
EdInk Senior Member Join Date: May 27, 2009 Posts: 3,968	That's alot of shooting for a simple CCW test. Most places seem to require 50rds or less to qualify. I would go with the .22 if they allow it and there is no restriction on using whatever you want to actually carry. __________________ Sic Semper Tyrannis

June 13, 2012, 10:39 PM	#3
ScottRiqui Senior Member Join Date: January 27, 2010 Location: Norfolk, VA Posts: 2,905	Is the class an "official" part of the testing/licensing procedure, or is it just for learning & practice? I'm wondering if there are any minimum caliber requirements, or if the type of gun (semiauto vs. revolver) matters in your state. In Texas, you have to use a .32 caliber or greater handgun on the qualification test. Also, if you want to carry a semiauto with your CHL, you must qualify with a semiauto on the test.

June 13, 2012, 10:40 PM	#4
sgms Senior Member Join Date: May 30, 2010 Location: Arizona or Ohio depending Posts: 1,021	My mother was telling me that she was having trouble pulling the slide on her pistol and wanted to get something she could handle better. We went through the safe and she selected what she though felt good in her hand and off to the range we went. After a couple of hours she started to narrow the list, we did the range with her short list several time always narrowing it until she found what she was most comfortable handling and shooting. Now she and a couple of her friends(all in there late 70's early 80's) go to the range 2 or 3 times a month and shoot. (I lost my S&W model 36 with a 3 inch barrel but now have her fathers 1911 service pistol resting in it's place.) You might try the same thing, let mom shoot what ever she want and let her decide what will work best for her.

June 13, 2012, 11:07 PM	#5
danez71 Senior Member Join Date: June 2, 2009 Posts: 438	Id pick the one that SHE picks since she is the one thats going to be shooting it.

June 13, 2012, 11:12 PM	#6
j357 Senior Member Join Date: January 25, 2009 Location: Liberty Twp, OH Posts: 283	Good questions Scott. She is in KY, with no caliber requirement or license what you carry limit. However, she will be required to clean (and perhaps field strip, which may limit her to revolvers depending on instructors). Thanks for the question.

June 13, 2012, 11:18 PM	#7
j357 Senior Member Join Date: January 25, 2009 Location: Liberty Twp, OH Posts: 283	Thanks danez71, I edited the original post to add highlight to the obvious, just so there is no confusion, as that is exactly what I plan to do.

June 13, 2012, 11:20 PM	#8
Dragline45 Senior Member Join Date: November 30, 2010 Posts: 3,513	Excessive loading of magazines for 2 hours would be hell on her fingers if she has arthritis. Seeing as she has two revolvers of her own it seems that's what she prefers, get her a good set of shooting gloves so the excessive range session wont be too bad on her hands. Also she can wrap a bandaid around her trigger finger if that's a concern.

June 14, 2012, 08:46 PM	#9
danez71 Senior Member Join Date: June 2, 2009 Posts: 438	What are the chances of getting (for example) 10 mags fully loaded for the Ruger MKIII .22 with the intent that all she'll have to do change mags in the gun and not have to reload mags with rounds? Or maybe 5 mags? Can she use that concept to her advantage? Just trying to explore options.......

June 14, 2012, 09:13 PM	#10
j357 Senior Member Join Date: January 25, 2009 Location: Liberty Twp, OH Posts: 283	Dragline, thanks the thought on the shooting gloves, that is a +1^. Thanks to Danez71 for the though of preloaded mags. I agree that loading the mags would be tough for her as well, as I'm rubbing lotion on two "paper" cuts on my right thumb from shucking and reloading one Makarov mag right now. The thought of loading up multiple MkIII mags is interesting. She will only have to qualify with shooting 11 shots of 20 in the outline of a B21 target at 7 yards. I'm thinking 7 mags would be good and get her through 20 or 30 practice rounds then qualify with 2 mags and a leftover 2 if a retest is required. None of that would be feasible with the Model 1903 due to lack of mags at a reasonable price. Leaning toward the MkIII and the Det Spl more today.

June 15, 2012, 08:49 AM	#13
Grant D Senior Member Join Date: August 14, 2011 Location: Brazos County, Texas Posts: 1,038	My wife took the test with a auto,and all she had to do was load the first round in the magazine and they finished it for her, and racked the slide for her if she needed help. She carrys a Walther PPK/S with a round in the chamber and the safety on with her in the car, and a S&W Model 637 in her purse. In Texas you have to take the test with a automatic, if you want to carry both. (she is partial to revolvers though)

June 17, 2012, 09:20 AM	#16
Webleymkv Senior Member Join Date: July 20, 2005 Location: Indiana Posts: 10,446	It sounds as though she's already fairly comfortable with a revolver, so it would probably be best for her to stick with that platform. Of the three revolvers you listed, the S&W M10 will probably be the easiest to shoot for extended periods because of its trigger and weight. S&W K-Frames have larger, heavier hammers than Colt D-Frames or Ruger SP101's do which makes it possible to use a lighter mainspring, and thus get a lighter trigger pull, without sacrificing reliable primer ignition. Also, the 30+ oz weight of the K-Frame will dampen recoil the most of the three revolvers making it the most pleasant to shoot. While lighter recoiling guns do exist, I've yet to meet anyone who could not handle the recoil of a S&W K-Frame loaded with standard pressure .38 Special ammunition.

June 17, 2012, 09:35 AM	#17
cerberus65 Senior Member Join Date: April 30, 2008 Posts: 384	My wife used a 6 shot .22LR revolver (a Model 34 snub nose). She doesn't have the hand strength to rack a slide so it had to be a revolver. Once we got her in the groove she was thumb-cocking the hammer and then nailing the target. 4 shots at 7 yards were just shy of being in one hole! And for those that are interested, in SC the test is 50 shots. And there are no restrictions on your carry gun based on what you qualified with.

June 17, 2012, 10:42 AM	#18
Master Blaster 2 Junior member Join Date: May 29, 2011 Posts: 895	Colt Detective Spl, .38 with wadcutters

June 18, 2012, 04:31 PM	#21
willr Senior Member Join Date: July 23, 2006 Posts: 356	When I took my course, the instructor, retired policewoman, herself suggested .22lr. Easy to use and control, minimal recoil. So I used my Ruger22/45. willr

June 18, 2012, 07:52 PM	#22
10-96 Senior Member Join Date: October 19, 2005 Location: Tx Panhandle Territory Posts: 4,159	Hope she doesn't have to go the full 100. Either way, I agree with the suggestions of one of the .38's. Cowboy Action type ammo (it's available in .38 SPL) is often loaded milder than target wadcutter ammo which is harder to find, and should be quite easy on her. __________________ Rednecks... Keeping the woods critter-free since March 2, 1836. (TX Independence Day) I suspect a thing or two... because I've seen a thing or two.

June 18, 2012, 10:48 PM	#24
medalguy Senior Member Join Date: August 31, 2009 Location: New Mexico Posts: 1,033	Load her up some light .38 wadcutter loads and that should help a lot. My 32 year old daughter wanted to get her CHL in Texas but she had trouble racking the slide on the 9mm Beretta I had given her. We shopped my vault a bit and she picked out a Colt Government Pocketlite .380 to use. The advantage is there's not a powerful blowback spring, but a lighter spring in association with the locking lugs on the barrel, and it took a lot less strength to pull back the slide. That worked well for her.

June 19, 2012, 07:02 PM	#25
BusGunner007 Senior Member Join Date: December 14, 2001 Location: Upper Left Coast Posts: 2,116	Down to the .38's... COLT = 6-shots. 1 more round. 4 less oz. Extra round, less weight to absorb recoil or carry. Slightly bigger gun. Still have to 'pull back' on the cylinder release latch ( and the cylinder goes around the 'wrong way' ) RUGER = 5-shots. 1 less round. + 4 oz. Is it really 'less' when it comes to holding steady? Nice to have the very slightly less 'bulk' dimensionally. Easier to 'press the button' when releasing the cylinder latch. ( cylinder rotates...really doesn't matter which way, that was a joke ) I have owned a RUGER SP-101 and can tell you there is a certain 'heft' to the gun that just FEELS GOOD...confidence inspiring, if you will. *HOT* .38's would be a great choice, if MOM wants to try that. Of what you listed, I'd pick the RUGER. __________________ "...if you're not havin' fun, you're workin'..."