Daly won't go into battery

Coinneach · December 27, 1999, 03:32 PM

Welp, I'm about fed up with my Daly 1911A1. It takes a good smack on the slide to go into battery, regardless of ammo or mags. It drags and hangs up about 1/2" before lockup. Here's what I've done to it thus far:

-Stoned the barrel lugs
-Stoned the slide rails
-Stoned the sear
-Stoned the barrel bushing
-Replaced the guide rod
-Replaced the stock recoil spring with a 24# Ed Brown jobbie

And the blasted thing *still* won't go. Of course, all this work has voided the warranty.

George, please help me before I lose what little sanity I have left...

------------------
"The evils of tyranny are rarely seen but by him who resists it."
-- John Hay, 1872

James K · December 27, 1999, 05:15 PM

Hi, Coinneach,

By the time the gun is 1/2 inch out of battery, the round should be lined up with the barrel, with its rim under the extractor. If it is not, we talk magazine or rough breech face or rough extractor, or smoothing the barrel throat.

If the round is lined up, check the firing pin stop to make sure it is not hanging up on the hammer. Then check the barrel skirt to see if it is forcing the barrel up before the lugs are in place. This is a timing problem and easily solved.

You have worked over a few things that could not possibly be the problem (sear?) but you seem to have gotten the areas where some stoning would help.

Maybe George has some better ideas.

Jim

Coinneach · December 27, 1999, 05:30 PM

Jim, the cart is lined up and going into the chamber. I did the feed ramp and throat as well as the other stuff I mentioned. I did the sear because it was mentioned in another thread about a 1911 with battery problems. No 1911 expert am I.

I replaced the firing pin stop with one from an ancient Gov't, no joy.

I may just turn it over to a guy I know who sneers at my Combat Tupperware, and see what he can do with it.

------------------
"The evils of tyranny are rarely seen but by him who resists it."
-- John Hay, 1872

George Stringer · December 27, 1999, 09:20 PM

Coinneach, there are usually three things that cause a slide not to go into battery and you've covered two completely. The third, barrel fit, you touched on but I think you'll find that this is where the problem lies. Coat the complete locking area of the barrel with dykem blue, assemble and cycle the slide a couple of times. This will show you where the lugs need attention. Also check your to see that your barrel hood is fit correctly. George

Coinneach · December 27, 1999, 09:31 PM

Thanks, George. The hood fits appears to be OK; I tried 4 different carts in the chamber, and all ended up about 0.5mm below the hood.

Stupid question: what's dykem blue, and where can I get it?

------------------
"The evils of tyranny are rarely seen but by him who resists it."
-- John Hay, 1872

Jim V · December 28, 1999, 01:54 AM

If you have a machine tool supply shop near you, they should have the Dykem Blue. it is used to paint metal before laying out lines for machining. It can be used as a wear point marker. Paint one part and cycle the two parts, where there is no blue after cycling the parts there is the high point that needs attention.

If there is no machine tool supply place near you and you know where there is a tool and die shop, stop by. You may be able to get some from them. As I remember the stuff comes in pints, quarts and gallons. A pint will last the average home gun smith YEARS. Watch the fumes, a lot of alcohol in the dye.

------------------
Ne Conjuge Nobiscum
"If there be treachery, let there be jehad!"

[This message has been edited by Jim V (edited December 28, 1999).]

Coinneach · December 28, 1999, 01:45 PM

Cool. Thanks, Jim V. I'll try that next week (gonna be *way* too busy until then).

------------------
"The evils of tyranny are rarely seen but by him who resists it."
-- John Hay, 1872

Coinneach · December 29, 1999, 03:21 PM

Update: I called several machine and tool shops about Dykem Blue. None of them had any clue what I was talking about.

Asked my dealer about it. She knows what it is, but doesn't have it.

Another regular was there, and asked what I wanted to do. I told him about the problems I'm having. He suggested a black marking pen, or candle soot. Said he's done both in a pinch.

Got home and did the candle thing. The locking area on the barrel (both upper and lower lugs) and the slide rails sooted up nicely. Reassembled, racked the slide a few times... and no joy. No rub marks. Still binding.

Time to give up?

------------------
"The evils of tyranny are rarely seen but by him who resists it."
-- John Hay, 1872

Oleg Volk · December 29, 1999, 11:29 PM

WHile I am not sure how 1911 really works, I'd try two things: different recoil spring and, if that doesn't work, see if you can drop the hammer out of battery. If you can, see what it does. I have a hunch the results might prove instructive...

George Stringer · December 29, 1999, 11:54 PM

Coinneach, I'm not sure you understood about the hood fit. Does it rub on the sides of its notch in the slide and when the slide is closed, but still not in battery, is it touching at the rear? You might need to smoke the muzzle end and see if your bushing is giving you a problem. I don't recommend a heavier recoil spring as a solution. That may possibly cure the symptom but not the problem. George

Big George · December 31, 1999, 04:01 PM

I have a brand new Charles Daly and two anomolies stand out:

1. The firing pin stop is searching for a home (at least until today, I stoned a new EGW oversize stop into the slot and the extractor has stopped clocking.)

2. The barrel bushing is a storefront decoration! My barrel OD is .570...the bushing's inside diameter is .610...At least I don't have to worry about it binding up! I think the one the Marine Corps gave me in 1956 had a tighter fit!

I have also had a few fail to go into battery, but mine have been faulty reload cases.

I bought the Daly (my second one, the first was a disaster) as a winter project. I'm learning!!!!

James K · December 31, 1999, 04:12 PM

Hi, Coinneach.

Try asking about Prussian Blue. That is what it is often called.

Have you checked the barrel foot for possible interference if the link is not dimensioned properly? You can do this with the slide off, just by putting in the barrel and inserting the slide stop through the link. A too short or too long link can cause interference either at the barrel foot or at the locking lugs.

Many of those 1911 clones have a lot of handwork and selective fitting so that kind of thing is not uncommon.

Jim

HS · January 2, 2000, 09:05 AM

Coinneach, go & buy Jerry Kuhnhausens' book "The Colt 1911 - A Workshop Manual" Parts 1 & 2.
A picture is worth a 1000 words

Is the barrel link free or binding ?
Has the hood of the barrel been STAMPED .45ACP/Charles Daly making it slightly oval shaped instead of round ?

------------------
"The Gun from Down Under !"
http://www.para1911fanclub.w3.to/
E-mail [email protected]
Alternate E-mail
[email protected]

Coinneach · January 2, 2000, 04:13 PM

The barrel link flops about freely. My dealer said I could send it back even with all the hackwork.

What I'll probably do is send it back, sell it, and put the money towards a Springfield Loaded.

------------------
"The evils of tyranny are rarely seen but by him who resists it."
-- John Hay, 1872

sholling · January 2, 2000, 06:11 PM

Jim Keenan,

Prussian Blue is a completely different animal. Dykem Blue dries and is used for marking parts and checking for high spots.

Prussian Blue is like an oil paint but doesn't dry.

Coinneach,

For what you are trying to do a black felt marker will usually work best.

December 27, 1999, 03:32 PM	#1
Coinneach Staff Alumnus Join Date: February 23, 1999 Location: Denver, CO Posts: 4,272	Welp, I'm about fed up with my Daly 1911A1. It takes a good smack on the slide to go into battery, regardless of ammo or mags. It drags and hangs up about 1/2" before lockup. Here's what I've done to it thus far: -Stoned the barrel lugs -Stoned the slide rails -Stoned the sear -Stoned the barrel bushing -Replaced the guide rod -Replaced the stock recoil spring with a 24# Ed Brown jobbie And the blasted thing still won't go. Of course, all this work has voided the warranty. George, please help me before I lose what little sanity I have left... ------------------ "The evils of tyranny are rarely seen but by him who resists it." -- John Hay, 1872

December 27, 1999, 05:15 PM	#2
James K Member In Memoriam Join Date: March 17, 1999 Posts: 24,383	Hi, Coinneach, By the time the gun is 1/2 inch out of battery, the round should be lined up with the barrel, with its rim under the extractor. If it is not, we talk magazine or rough breech face or rough extractor, or smoothing the barrel throat. If the round is lined up, check the firing pin stop to make sure it is not hanging up on the hammer. Then check the barrel skirt to see if it is forcing the barrel up before the lugs are in place. This is a timing problem and easily solved. You have worked over a few things that could not possibly be the problem (sear?) but you seem to have gotten the areas where some stoning would help. Maybe George has some better ideas. Jim

December 27, 1999, 05:30 PM	#3
Coinneach Staff Alumnus Join Date: February 23, 1999 Location: Denver, CO Posts: 4,272	Jim, the cart is lined up and going into the chamber. I did the feed ramp and throat as well as the other stuff I mentioned. I did the sear because it was mentioned in another thread about a 1911 with battery problems. No 1911 expert am I. I replaced the firing pin stop with one from an ancient Gov't, no joy. I may just turn it over to a guy I know who sneers at my Combat Tupperware, and see what he can do with it. ------------------ "The evils of tyranny are rarely seen but by him who resists it." -- John Hay, 1872

December 27, 1999, 09:20 PM	#4
George Stringer Staff Alumnus Join Date: October 12, 1998 Location: Earlington KY Posts: 2,299	Coinneach, there are usually three things that cause a slide not to go into battery and you've covered two completely. The third, barrel fit, you touched on but I think you'll find that this is where the problem lies. Coat the complete locking area of the barrel with dykem blue, assemble and cycle the slide a couple of times. This will show you where the lugs need attention. Also check your to see that your barrel hood is fit correctly. George

December 27, 1999, 09:31 PM	#5
Coinneach Staff Alumnus Join Date: February 23, 1999 Location: Denver, CO Posts: 4,272	Thanks, George. The hood fits appears to be OK; I tried 4 different carts in the chamber, and all ended up about 0.5mm below the hood. Stupid question: what's dykem blue, and where can I get it? ------------------ "The evils of tyranny are rarely seen but by him who resists it." -- John Hay, 1872

December 28, 1999, 01:54 AM	#6
Jim V Senior Member Join Date: January 31, 1999 Location: SE Michigan - USA Posts: 4,038	If you have a machine tool supply shop near you, they should have the Dykem Blue. it is used to paint metal before laying out lines for machining. It can be used as a wear point marker. Paint one part and cycle the two parts, where there is no blue after cycling the parts there is the high point that needs attention. If there is no machine tool supply place near you and you know where there is a tool and die shop, stop by. You may be able to get some from them. As I remember the stuff comes in pints, quarts and gallons. A pint will last the average home gun smith YEARS. Watch the fumes, a lot of alcohol in the dye. ------------------ *Ne Conjuge Nobiscum* "If there be treachery, let there be jehad!" [This message has been edited by Jim V (edited December 28, 1999).]

December 28, 1999, 01:45 PM	#7
Coinneach Staff Alumnus Join Date: February 23, 1999 Location: Denver, CO Posts: 4,272	Cool. Thanks, Jim V. I'll try that next week (gonna be way too busy until then). ------------------ "The evils of tyranny are rarely seen but by him who resists it." -- John Hay, 1872

December 29, 1999, 03:21 PM	#8
Coinneach Staff Alumnus Join Date: February 23, 1999 Location: Denver, CO Posts: 4,272	Update: I called several machine and tool shops about Dykem Blue. None of them had any clue what I was talking about. Asked my dealer about it. She knows what it is, but doesn't have it. Another regular was there, and asked what I wanted to do. I told him about the problems I'm having. He suggested a black marking pen, or candle soot. Said he's done both in a pinch. Got home and did the candle thing. The locking area on the barrel (both upper and lower lugs) and the slide rails sooted up nicely. Reassembled, racked the slide a few times... and no joy. No rub marks. Still binding. Time to give up? ------------------ "The evils of tyranny are rarely seen but by him who resists it." -- John Hay, 1872

December 29, 1999, 11:29 PM	#9
Oleg Volk Staff Alumnus Join Date: December 6, 1999 Location: Nashville, TN Posts: 7,022	WHile I am not sure how 1911 really works, I'd try two things: different recoil spring and, if that doesn't work, see if you can drop the hammer out of battery. If you can, see what it does. I have a hunch the results might prove instructive...

December 29, 1999, 11:54 PM	#10
George Stringer Staff Alumnus Join Date: October 12, 1998 Location: Earlington KY Posts: 2,299	Coinneach, I'm not sure you understood about the hood fit. Does it rub on the sides of its notch in the slide and when the slide is closed, but still not in battery, is it touching at the rear? You might need to smoke the muzzle end and see if your bushing is giving you a problem. I don't recommend a heavier recoil spring as a solution. That may possibly cure the symptom but not the problem. George

December 31, 1999, 04:01 PM	#11
Big George Senior Member Join Date: November 9, 1999 Location: Lynchburg, Va Posts: 125	I have a brand new Charles Daly and two anomolies stand out: 1. The firing pin stop is searching for a home (at least until today, I stoned a new EGW oversize stop into the slot and the extractor has stopped clocking.) 2. The barrel bushing is a storefront decoration! My barrel OD is .570...the bushing's inside diameter is .610...At least I don't have to worry about it binding up! I think the one the Marine Corps gave me in 1956 had a tighter fit! I have also had a few fail to go into battery, but mine have been faulty reload cases. I bought the Daly (my second one, the first was a disaster) as a winter project. I'm learning!!!!

December 31, 1999, 04:12 PM	#12
James K Member In Memoriam Join Date: March 17, 1999 Posts: 24,383	Hi, Coinneach. Try asking about Prussian Blue. That is what it is often called. Have you checked the barrel foot for possible interference if the link is not dimensioned properly? You can do this with the slide off, just by putting in the barrel and inserting the slide stop through the link. A too short or too long link can cause interference either at the barrel foot or at the locking lugs. Many of those 1911 clones have a lot of handwork and selective fitting so that kind of thing is not uncommon. Jim

January 2, 2000, 09:05 AM	#13
HS Senior Member Join Date: October 11, 1998 Location: Brisbane.....Australia Posts: 1,258	Coinneach, go & buy Jerry Kuhnhausens' book "The Colt 1911 - A Workshop Manual" Parts 1 & 2. A picture is worth a 1000 words Is the barrel link free or binding ? Has the hood of the barrel been STAMPED .45ACP/Charles Daly making it slightly oval shaped instead of round ? ------------------ "The Gun from Down Under !" http://www.para1911fanclub.w3.to/ E-mail [email protected] Alternate E-mail [email protected]

January 2, 2000, 04:13 PM	#14
Coinneach Staff Alumnus Join Date: February 23, 1999 Location: Denver, CO Posts: 4,272	The barrel link flops about freely. My dealer said I could send it back even with all the hackwork. What I'll probably do is send it back, sell it, and put the money towards a Springfield Loaded. ------------------ "The evils of tyranny are rarely seen but by him who resists it." -- John Hay, 1872

January 2, 2000, 06:11 PM	#15
sholling Senior Member Join Date: May 18, 1999 Location: Hemet (middle of nowhere) California Posts: 4,261	Jim Keenan, Prussian Blue is a completely different animal. Dykem Blue dries and is used for marking parts and checking for high spots. Prussian Blue is like an oil paint but doesn't dry. Coinneach, For what you are trying to do a black felt marker will usually work best.