Riddle me this Riddle me That

BigBlack · October 20, 2008, 10:32 AM

Okay new reloader still learning as much as possible. I have been working on my 243 loads and am getting MOA groups at 100 yards pretty consistently now. Preparing it for hunting I fine tuned the scope adjustments and then popped off a few groups at 200 yards. Surprisingly my groups were only about 1.25" to 1.5" consistently. So at 100 yards I am about 1 MOA consistently then at 200 yards .6 to .7 MOA, why not closer to 2 MOA. I was under the impression (remember new reloader here) that if my group size was 1" at 100 yards I could expect 2" at 200 yards and 3" at 300 yards and so on.

Wind was relatively nonexistent this trip.

Not looking for flames only instruction or enlightenment.

Thanks
BB

Whisper 300 · October 20, 2008, 10:53 AM

Paul,

Far be it from me to give the complete explanation but perhaps it has something to do with the bullet "going to sleep" at ranges over the 100 yd mark.

Rotational forces may actually improve stability once it is a bit downrange and this may explain better groupings at further ranges. What "boolit" are you using? BC / SD of bullet? Flat base or BT? Lead core or monometal?
I am sure others will chime in with better answers but your findings are not all that unusual.

Gary

Jim Watson · October 20, 2008, 11:51 AM

Shoot a hundred targets at each range and call back.

I do not subscribe to the "sleepy bullet" getting more accurate the farther it goes theory. There was a guy on the benchrest board who set up one of the Oehler accoustic targets at 100 yards and a paper target at 300+ so he could plot every shot at two ranges. He said he never had a single group smaller in proportion at the longer range than at the shorter.

BigBlack · October 20, 2008, 11:55 AM

100gr Sierra Game King Boat Tails

mkg · October 20, 2008, 12:30 PM

BigBlack ,

What is the twist rate for the rifle? I shoot berger bullets , they recommend an 8 or 9 twist for that weight bullet. If your twist rate is greater than that you may indeed maybe having instability problems. Long, heavy for caliber, high BC bullets do in my experiance take longer to stabilize.
My 300WSM shooting 185 grain VLD's shoots 1 MOA at 200 , At 300 it prints 1/3 MOA consistantly.

Mike

Don H · October 20, 2008, 01:30 PM

The person pullin' the trigger is a factor, also; a 100-yard MOA shooter may not necessarily be a 500-yard MOA shooter.

Hylander · October 20, 2008, 07:33 PM

It is the Shooter:
Your scope magnification will have alot to do with it.
At high power and close range you will get more movement on the part of the Shooter.
Say your shooting a Dot 1.5" and the scope is set at 12X,
at 100yds., getting the crosshairs to stay fixed on center of target will be harder than getting them to stay fixed at 200yds. because you are focusing on a target twice the size at 100yds.

jamaica · October 20, 2008, 10:17 PM

Quote:

I was under the impression (remember new reloader here) that if my group size was 1" at 100 yards I could expect 2" at 200 yards and 3" at 300 yards and so on.

First, are you using sandbags to remove as much shooter shakin as possible?

Next, you have to be aware that as the target moves further out you don't see as good of detail on the target as you do when closer. At 200 yards you are shooting at a target that is only half as large in the scope. (assuming you use the same target) It is simply going to be harder to repeat the same sight pattern on each shot.

I would re-run that test.

The Lovemaster · October 21, 2008, 12:53 AM

But the good news is, you have a fine bullet. Sierras are definitely me preferred bullet in my rifles, even more so than Hornadys - also very fine bullets. I just seem to get better results with Sierras.

October 20, 2008, 10:32 AM	#1
BigBlack Member Join Date: February 20, 2008 Location: Lyons, GA Posts: 46	Riddle me this Riddle me That Okay new reloader still learning as much as possible. I have been working on my 243 loads and am getting MOA groups at 100 yards pretty consistently now. Preparing it for hunting I fine tuned the scope adjustments and then popped off a few groups at 200 yards. Surprisingly my groups were only about 1.25" to 1.5" consistently. So at 100 yards I am about 1 MOA consistently then at 200 yards .6 to .7 MOA, why not closer to 2 MOA. I was under the impression (remember new reloader here) that if my group size was 1" at 100 yards I could expect 2" at 200 yards and 3" at 300 yards and so on. Wind was relatively nonexistent this trip. Not looking for flames only instruction or enlightenment. Thanks BB __________________ Paul Graham Clean-um, Prep-um, Pack-um, Load-um, Bang-um

October 20, 2008, 11:55 AM	#4
BigBlack Member Join Date: February 20, 2008 Location: Lyons, GA Posts: 46	100gr Sierra Game King Boat Tails __________________ Paul Graham Clean-um, Prep-um, Pack-um, Load-um, Bang-um

October 20, 2008, 07:33 PM	#7
Hylander Senior Member Join Date: August 13, 2008 Location: California Posts: 128	It is the Shooter: Your scope magnification will have alot to do with it. At high power and close range you will get more movement on the part of the Shooter. Say your shooting a Dot 1.5" and the scope is set at 12X, at 100yds., getting the crosshairs to stay fixed on center of target will be harder than getting them to stay fixed at 200yds. because you are focusing on a target twice the size at 100yds. __________________ Today is my Best Day. Lincoln, Ca.

October 20, 2008, 10:53 AM	#2
Whisper 300 Senior Member Join Date: December 29, 2006 Posts: 155	Paul, Far be it from me to give the complete explanation but perhaps it has something to do with the bullet "going to sleep" at ranges over the 100 yd mark. Rotational forces may actually improve stability once it is a bit downrange and this may explain better groupings at further ranges. What "boolit" are you using? BC / SD of bullet? Flat base or BT? Lead core or monometal? I am sure others will chime in with better answers but your findings are not all that unusual. Gary

October 20, 2008, 11:51 AM	#3
Jim Watson Senior Member Join Date: October 25, 2001 Location: Alabama Posts: 18,539	Shoot a hundred targets at each range and call back. I do not subscribe to the "sleepy bullet" getting more accurate the farther it goes theory. There was a guy on the benchrest board who set up one of the Oehler accoustic targets at 100 yards and a paper target at 300+ so he could plot every shot at two ranges. He said he never had a single group smaller in proportion at the longer range than at the shorter.

October 20, 2008, 12:30 PM	#5
mkg Senior Member Join Date: September 15, 2008 Location: NE TN Posts: 188	BigBlack , What is the twist rate for the rifle? I shoot berger bullets , they recommend an 8 or 9 twist for that weight bullet. If your twist rate is greater than that you may indeed maybe having instability problems. Long, heavy for caliber, high BC bullets do in my experiance take longer to stabilize. My 300WSM shooting 185 grain VLD's shoots 1 MOA at 200 , At 300 it prints 1/3 MOA consistantly. Mike

October 20, 2008, 01:30 PM	#6
Don H Senior Member Join Date: May 8, 2000 Location: SLC,Utah Posts: 2,704	The person pullin' the trigger is a factor, also; a 100-yard MOA shooter may not necessarily be a 500-yard MOA shooter.

October 21, 2008, 12:53 AM	#9
The Lovemaster Senior Member Join Date: December 29, 2007 Location: Arizona Posts: 416	But the good news is, you have a fine bullet. Sierras are definitely me preferred bullet in my rifles, even more so than Hornadys - also very fine bullets. I just seem to get better results with Sierras.