BFR users - 45-70 load questions.

[P95Carry]

Ok - I have looked around but haven't yet found what I am after. This is all to do with loads for my new BFR which is badgerin the hell outa me to go shoot! I have 20 rounds of Rem factory but must load some.

OK so ... have browsed all load data .. as ever with 45-70 Gov't .. three sorta categories ... trapdoor (not too hot) ..... lever action (warm!) ... and then for Ruger #1 and #3 .. ''smokin''!!

Well .. I want ''substantial loads'' ... and intend to play pretty safe but .... would relish input from other BFR users ..... even lever users.

I want from choice to probably go with RL7 ... or 2400 (not too good i feel) .... or Varget maybe. I do NOT want to go buying more powder . I have way too many types already! I also have N-133 .. another possible, even N-140.

So - feedback if you please. Bear in mind I will NOT take anything mentioned as gospel so I make my own liability disclaimer. I am just after opinions and experience.

(I'll post this over on THR too)

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Small caveat prior to any input. After much reading thru load data my first handload will be a straight 40 grains RL7 . under the 405 Lasercast. This is pretty much a ''lever load'' ... far from top whack. We'll see what it does - will load 10 and see, and chrono too if I remember!!

[steelbuster]

I have a Browning 1885 Highwall that I like to load for. This gun is rated for the same pressure as the Ruger #1. I don't know how the loads will transfer to the BFR due to the LARGE difference in barrel length, but these are some favorites of mine....I always start with published data and never knowingly exceed them.
In general my Browning is very sensitive to C.O.L.. The closer I get the bullet to the leade the better it usally shoots. About .010" off is usually best.

I have never had any luck with any of the lead bullets I have tried in this gun so these are all jacketed bullets.

I've had good luck with two powders, Viht N133 and AA 2495BR. Since I use N133 for several other calibers, I have pretty much settled on that powder and it works very well in my 14" 30/30 Contender.
I never crimp these rounds but the bullets fit tight in the case. All rounds use WLR primers in Win Cases.
I have found N133 to be very tolerant of small powder charges in large cases if you wish to experiment with reduced loads.

Hornady 300gr JHP: 63 gr N133, 2.580"COL, 2266fps, (listed Pressure =28000psi)

Sierra 300gr JHP: 62gr N133, 2.570" COL , 2236fps. This is the load I use for Hunting Deer.

Remington Surplus 405gr JSP: 47gr N133, 2.635" COL, 1700fps. Mild recoil, very accuate.

Remington Surplus 300gr JHP: 50gr N133, 2.570" COL, 1775fps. Very low pressure, Low recoil,and very accurate in my rifle. A pleasant load for a day at the range.

Lots of other loads if your interested.
Have fun

[44and45]

Hello, Chris.

Didn't know you were into self mutilation, .45-70 is a bruiser so they say.

Have no experience with it so can't help you there on the loads, but Mike Venterino guy from Shooting Times may be able to help with some good loads, try contacting him.

Best regards, Jim

aka 44and45

[P95Carry]

Thx Steelbuster ...... well, I am hoping to stick to cast bullets so need to tailor loads to suit .... plus, I do consider I need a fair crimp to avoid bullet movement in the case - the last round will be subjected to four smart inertial tugs!!

Jim ... ''self-mutilation'' ... hahaha! It's called masochism! Ahh ... '' Mike Venterino guy from Shooting Times'' .... I must see if I can get some contact info .. in fact I have a few more web sites yet to peruse. Tracking down the load data I want will I think take a while.

[steelbuster]

I understand about the crimp Big recoil and BIG bullets are a bad combo. Give N133 a try. It might be fast enough for the short barrel. By the way, what length? 10"?

Here's a couple of Lead Bullet loads for the Contender from an old Lyman book. Should work for you. (velocity from 10" Contender, MAX Load)

405gr #457193 ,(#2 Alloy) 2.550" OAL
IMR-4198 ,Start 21.5gr - Max 28.5gr---1009fps
RX7 ,Start 33.0gr - Max 41.0gr - *Max load was most accur.--1447fps
IMR-3031 ,Start 34.0gr - Max 38.5gr---1163fps

292gr #457191 , (#2 Alloy) 2.550" OAL
SR4759 , Start 26.0gr - Max 30.0gr---1187fps
IMR-4198 , Start 28.5gr - Max 34.5gr - *Max load was most accur.-1194fps
IMR3031 , Start 34.0gr - Max 44.0gr---1237fps

Enjoy......I guess

[Tommy gunn]

*click here*

[P95Carry]

Tommy - thx for the link .... I must explore that further - tho am not thinking of BP loads per se.

steelbuster ........

RX7 ,Start 33.0gr - Max 41.0gr - *Max load was most accurate

Interesting ....... my load today when I did first BFR Range Test was 40 grains RL7 ... and it felt as tho it was near hot enough .... and could prove quite useful. Need to evaluate it further. The pressures from that will be well under what the gun will take .... I think ''wrist fatigue'' probably comes higher on the list!

My neck tension is good and the crimp also .... no apparent upsets when inspecting round #5 after four shots.

I might try some N-133 . I use that for .223 loads, and do have some figures/data. But Vhit powder is so danged pricey!!

Oh - barrel length?? Well, they call it 7 1/2" but .. what I measure from forcing cone to muzzle is 8"!!! My SRH's are 9 1/2" but this tube length on BFR seems about right.

Thx for posting the info - appreciated.

[steelbuster]

I think ''wrist fatigue'' probably comes higher on the list!

There was a time everyone thought my 10" 30/30 Contender was a killer...now its just a little pop gun.... no 'MACHO' value at all.

Looked in the Lyman book after seeing your test range..They were getting 1447fps with 41 gr RX7 from a 10" Contender, so 1300 fps from the revolver is pretty darn good I think.

Added Lyman Velocity to loads given above

[P95Carry]

Well .. yeah I am pretty pleased with vel figures. I can now add that it looks like grouping is gonna be pretty fair too.

I am getting used to the gun and this helps. Buddy came over this evening and we slipped down to range. Whilst he drove over I loaded another ten rounds of same ''brew'' ... my five were way tighter than yesterday and got sights pretty much set. My buddy (first time with gun), shot lower but probably with practice would tighten up.

I will very likely stay with this load, but will try a 41 grain just to see - I know the gun will munch on those with no trouble .. more a case of my shooting ''comfort'' and whether group tightens or loosens.

[MADISON]

My favorite 45-70 load for a #3 Ruger is:
300 grain Hornady HP
20.0 to 22.0 grains of 2400

[moredes]

I used 27.5gr of 2400 with a 405, buffered with corn meal. That's pretty much a 'middle-of-the-road' load; stout, but not objectionably so. Never chrony'd it, so I dunno what the MV was. Good enough for silhouettes.

By the way, I called MRI before reloading for the BFR; they said the gun was built to take Ruger loads, but they didn't recommend it as a steady diet. That's not to criticize Madison's load; his is pretty light compared to full blown book loads for Ruger 1's and 3's.

[P95Carry]

morodes . I think I'd steer clear of the top Ruger #1 and #3 loads anyways. They will be up there for pressure and whilst gun would take the 35,000 or plus pressures I think it would be just way too uncomforrtable!!

I have yet to try 2400 loads but ... to be honest - my current 40 grains RL7 is doin just great. Having tried ten more rounds it seems this is pretty tight grouping after all ... and is about a limit on comfort. I'd expect these to be generous on 30,000 psi ..... so safe but effective! 1500 or so ft lbs is useful!

Many thx for your input.

[10hasteeth]

I'm a newbie here. but I just have to tell you that I love my BFR 45/70.I use 51.4 gr. of AA#2015 with[I know this sounds strange]either a 300gr.jsp or a 405gr.jsp. It sounds insane but my gun loves it both ways. Yes they are stout loads, but they don't hurt in that big old 10" barrel.I'm sure you know this, but make sure you have a round in every chamber when you shoot. The recoil is so strong that it will bend the loading gate if you don't. The cast bullets tend to come out of the crimp, no matter how I crimp them, so I don't use them except for light loads. I hope you enjoy yours as much as I do mine. By the way I use the same loads in my H&R 45/70 Bufal classic, and they hurt a lot more in that big old boy than the BFR.
I hope this helps. Mike
p.s. the AA#2015 changes names a lot. It may be benchrest 2015 or another name .I had to contact AA 2x over the last 2 years to make sure it was the same.The wrong powder at these pressures could cause an earhquake!

[P95Carry]

Welcome Mike

The recoil is so strong that it will bend the loading gate if you don't.

Not with you on this one I gotta say ... you meaning that if you load only one round it'll distort the gate?? Can't find that easy to believe .. what's the rationale??

The cast bullets tend to come out of the crimp, no matter how I crimp them, so I don't use them except for light loads.

My cast 405's do shift just a bit - by #5 there is a just perceptibel shift ... but I use a factrory crimp die and that seems to do pretty well.

Of course my 40 grains Reloader 7 might well be a wuss load compared to yours! Do you have chrono figures for your loads? And - am I gettin this right .. that one powder charge for both bullet weights??

Be interested to have some more data.

[10hasteeth]

I think it was John Taffin that first wrote about this happening. It seems that the loading gate wouild not have a forward support, and would, under sever recoil bend.I called Magnum Research and they agreed. I am just trying to play it safe with something this powerful. Thanks for the welcome. Mike

[10hasteeth]

Sorry, I didn't read the rest of your message.I did chrono them, but don't have the figures where I am now. I will try to post them later. Yes, I know it sounds crazy, but the same loads for both bullet weights are what works best in my gun.The 300 is obviously easier to shoot, but that 405 looks like a truck wreck when it hits the dirt.The commercial ammo is like shootin a hot .44 mag. Not much excitment in that big of a platform.

[P95Carry]

Mike - thx for the feedback ... I wasn't rying to seem to skeptical! It does sound like I should load five then at a time ... but I still reckon your loads ... the 405 in particular --- are way hotter than mine!

yeah .... if you have the chrono data ... be great to see. Thx.