those old goose guns... how do they fare today ???

Magnum Wheel Man · February 19, 2015, 03:39 PM

with the ever increasing numbers of Canada geese in my area during the fall, I'm considering for the 1st time, trying to goose hunt...

... we live on a farm, & the 160 acres south of us, is a drained slough & creek... been that way since I've lived there, but seems like during seasonal migration, several large flocks pick that area to over night for about a week or so there are heavy numbers of geese on the ground, & flying in directly over my shooting range

I've been looking at those Marlin ( I think model 55's ) bolt action 34-36" barrel shotguns in 12 ga with 3" chambers... which seem to be for sale super cheap

how do these guns fare in comparison to the newer guns... I know they are not semi auto, but if I could get one or two a day ( or less if that is the limit )

I assume that steel shot still needs to be used, even though it's not hunted over or around water...

what kind of range would this type of gun have & what would be the better shell / shot size to use for geese???

98 220 swift · February 19, 2015, 04:20 PM

These shotguns where never meant for steel shot. It would be hard on the choke to shot steel through them. A better choice would be a Mossberg 835 or Remington 870 mag with 3.5" chamber. Canadians are hard to put down.

Magnum Wheel Man · February 19, 2015, 04:28 PM

would bismuth be better on the choke ??? ( not sure if its available in 3" goose shells )

Doyle · February 19, 2015, 04:47 PM

Those have absolutely zero more range than a shorter barreled shotgun of the same gauge and choke. It is the choke that determines the pattern not the length of the barrel.

Magnum Wheel Man · February 19, 2015, 04:49 PM

ok... little more velocity ???

Chaz88 · February 19, 2015, 05:22 PM

Quote:

would bismuth be better on the choke ???

I looked into bismuth for my old 10g. I could not find loaded rounds that would fit my chamber. I can hand load it in brass shells but it is expensive. I will probably do it sooner or later just to say I got to hunt with it.

EDIT: Yes it is better for the choke. About the only thing I know of to use in old guns to replace lead.

SPEMack618 · February 19, 2015, 06:20 PM

Also, taking down a Canadian is hard. Like way hard. I'm sitting trying to think of when I didn't shoot one twice to bring it down.

Shooting a bolt shotgun makes that follow up shot pretty dang tough.

Just a thought.

For goose in general, BB or BBB. I shoot a 3" shell, Black Cloud by Federal and Blind Side by Winchester or good loadings.

I know one fellow who shoots T shot, but I've never actually used T shot.

I bought a box once. And tell everyone that 'T shot is for pterodactyl ducks"

My suggestion for getting into waterfowl hunting cheap is to look around for a used 870 in a pawn shop.

Snyper · February 19, 2015, 06:40 PM

Quote:

ok... little more velocity ???

Nope

Those long barrels were a hold-over from black powder shells that needed them

Modern shotshells will reach Max velocity in any barrel over about 20"

One of those old guns could work well if you cut the barrel and installed choke tubes for "non-toxic" shot, but automatics are far more popular due to less recoil and fast follow up shots

Virginian · February 19, 2015, 08:13 PM

There is a good reason why ALL those guns went away, and why they are available cheap today.
Get a 3" pump and shoot premium non toxic shells like Hevi-Shoot Goose or Kent Impact, or get a 3-1/2" pump and shoot steel.

jmr40 · February 19, 2015, 10:29 PM

Bismuth would work, but the cost of ammo would negate the savings on the gun. Steel is the cheaper alternative and is not going to work with that gun.

rcase1234 · February 19, 2015, 10:41 PM

I shoot 3" Winchester BB (about $13 a box or so) with a Mossberg 535 no issues knocking down geese. Highly recommend giving the 535 a look too.

Creek Henry · February 19, 2015, 10:46 PM

I have used 2 versions of bolt action shotguns. Forget good follow up shots. They are for turkey and slugs, imo.

upstate81 · February 20, 2015, 12:43 AM

Um I've never considered a canadian goose "way hard " to put down..... I just use 3 inch BB. If you know what your doing and have a decent set up they come right in. In all honesty the 3.5 inch shell is totally useless. It only adds a little more range, which is mostly unnecessary. Not needed for any turkey hunting either.

mete · February 20, 2015, 01:45 AM

Yes ,3" 12 ga is all you need , with BB steel . Range is 25-45 yds !!! My Benelli gives a very tight choke so I thought I should think turkey and just use the head as an aim point .So I got mostly head and neck hits no need to hunt for shot in the body.
That shooting distance was what I thought and confirmed by the maker,Federal. ! Forget the long range stuff it won't work !

HiBC · February 20, 2015, 02:17 AM

Its kind of funny how dumb we can be as kids.I had an old Chicopee falls stevens 530A ST 20 ga side by side.It was my one and only shotgun.

A couple old game wardens,Gurney Crawford and sig Palm,worked at making the Ft Collins area of northern Colorado friendly to waterfowl.

So we had lots of ducks and geese.this was late 60's,early 70's.

I loaded that 20 ga with 2 3/4 in Mag #2 shot.It was lead,back then.

I got plenty of geese,no problem.I pulled of an occasional double.

Back then,you got a limited number of carcass tags for the season,six or eight? I forget.

I had a simple guideline.Be able to clearly see their feet.

I would pass shoot at edges of fields,lakes,canals.Low crawl irrigation ditches.

Just don't sky bust,they aren't that hard.

Snyper · February 20, 2015, 05:31 AM

Geese aren't harder to kill than any other birds as long as you know your range limits, and aim for the head

The trick is using large enough shot, and finding where they are feeding to get the close shots

AllenJ · February 20, 2015, 10:08 AM

In my area back in the day when those Marlin's were "THE" goose gun to have it was because many thought the long barrel made them capable of holding a tighter pattern and being able to really reach out and kill birds. The truth is the longer barrel only served to give the shooter a better sight plane, and when patterned on paper or shot over a chronograph they had no advantage over a shorter barrel shotgun.

If you really want one then yes, you should use Bismuth so as not to wreck the barrel. If it were me I would look for a used Remington 870.

Virginian · February 20, 2015, 11:08 AM

My first shotgun was a Mossberg bolt action, and over 50 years later you still couldn't give me another bolt gun of any description for any wingshooting.
I for one DO think geese are harder to kill. I remember one Canada that fell after six shots of #2 steel at about 25 yards and still gave the dog a run for the money. You could hold him up in the aluminum boat and shake and pellets would rain in the bottom of the boat. Thereafter I went to copper plated T shot before I eventually went to tungsten. I chased a downed Snow about a mile across a cut corn field in Manitoba, and it looked like someone was pouring blood out of a pitcher the whole way. When I finally caught up to him he was more red than white. The key is you have to put enough pellets into the vitals area, and they have to be big enough to get through all those feathers and fat. I had a friend who was an excellent shot, and he decided he was going to exclusively head shoot them with #4 or maybe #5 shot. After going about oh-for-six on goose hunting trips, he went back to more conventional wisdom.

Magnum Wheel Man · February 20, 2015, 12:26 PM

I have an 870... it's set up for deer, but there is likely a couple other barrels around here ( inherited from my FIL ) I just assumed those long barrels would be "better" ( hold a tighter pattern, or increase velocity of the shot ) if that's not the case... that just means I already have what I need, or just need a new choke or barrel at most...

I think I could hunt from my shooting bench shack ( during the week that they seem to want to over night a couple 100 yards from it )

the floor of the shack is about 6 ft off the ground, bench at 8.5 ft...so I can shoot rifles at all distances through a long shallow valley out to my back stop several 100 yards down the line fence... it has 4ft tall plywood siding walls, & a tin roof over the top for shade & rain protection... I'd think it would make an acceptable blind, the tops of the walls all have a 6" ledge on top, & would make a good rest... was thinking for slug hunting... but maybe for geese as well???

is it legal to shoot them on the ground??? if so, I assume I can't use a rifle for ground birds???

we had thought of raising a few geese... we already raise the big white chickens for meat birds... however goslings are $18 - $20 each at day old... it wouldn't take much to equal out the cost of hunting Canada geese at the price of domestic goslings, if I wanted 8 or 10 for the freezer... & Canada goose numbers are extremely high right now, they are often at pest levels in most cities at parks & golf courses... & I've noticed a lot of them on our place, over the course of a week or so, during fall migration

**44 AMP** · February 20, 2015, 04:16 PM

Quote:

Those long barrels were a hold-over from black powder shells that needed them

While this is essentially true, there is one real benefit from the long (36") goose gun barrels, and that is the extra weight on the end of the barrel adds to the ease of a proper follow through when pass shooting. Get them swinging, the want to stay swinging!

Is this enough to outweigh the other drawbacks? Your call on that.

Snyper · February 20, 2015, 05:11 PM

Quote:

is it legal to shoot them on the ground??? if so, I assume I can't use a rifle for ground birds???

I know of no law that prohibits shooting them on the ground as long as you can do it without killing over your limit with one shot

Rifles are illegal for most migratory game birds under Federal law and most state laws

mete · February 20, 2015, 06:10 PM

Many of the techniques I used were considered illegal or unsporting even though the Indians in the old days used them !! On the water or ground is fair game !

**44 AMP** · February 20, 2015, 09:28 PM

Check local and Fed laws both. Local laws can be ..complex. I know of a place where geese can only be taken in certain areas, on certain days of the week, during season.

Taking them on the ground, or in the water is not "sporting". (when you are doing it to survive, sporting doesn't count, but that is more than rare these days)

I don't KNOW of any law that says you can't take them on the ground, but that doesn't mean that there isn't any, somewhere.

mattL46 · February 20, 2015, 11:33 PM

I'm pretty sure here in logan county oklahoma, you can't take any migratory bird on the ground. It must be coming in or going out. I'm not a hunter. I could be wrong.

Snyper · February 21, 2015, 01:31 AM

Quote:

Taking them on the ground, or in the water is not "sporting".

People shoot Turkeys on the ground without reservations

I don't see a difference as long as you're not "flock shooting"

February 19, 2015, 03:39 PM	#1
Magnum Wheel Man Senior Member Join Date: July 26, 2006 Location: Southern Minnesota Posts: 9,333	those old goose guns... how do they fare today ??? with the ever increasing numbers of Canada geese in my area during the fall, I'm considering for the 1st time, trying to goose hunt... ... we live on a farm, & the 160 acres south of us, is a drained slough & creek... been that way since I've lived there, but seems like during seasonal migration, several large flocks pick that area to over night for about a week or so there are heavy numbers of geese on the ground, & flying in directly over my shooting range I've been looking at those Marlin ( I think model 55's ) bolt action 34-36" barrel shotguns in 12 ga with 3" chambers... which seem to be for sale super cheap how do these guns fare in comparison to the newer guns... I know they are not semi auto, but if I could get one or two a day ( or less if that is the limit ) I assume that steel shot still needs to be used, even though it's not hunted over or around water... what kind of range would this type of gun have & what would be the better shell / shot size to use for geese??? __________________ In life you either make dust or eat dust...

February 19, 2015, 04:28 PM	#3
Magnum Wheel Man Senior Member Join Date: July 26, 2006 Location: Southern Minnesota Posts: 9,333	would bismuth be better on the choke ??? ( not sure if its available in 3" goose shells ) __________________ In life you either make dust or eat dust...

February 19, 2015, 06:20 PM	#7
SPEMack618 Senior Member Join Date: June 21, 2010 Location: Central Georgia Posts: 1,863	Also, taking down a Canadian is hard. Like way hard. I'm sitting trying to think of when I didn't shoot one twice to bring it down. Shooting a bolt shotgun makes that follow up shot pretty dang tough. Just a thought. For goose in general, BB or BBB. I shoot a 3" shell, Black Cloud by Federal and Blind Side by Winchester or good loadings. I know one fellow who shoots T shot, but I've never actually used T shot. I bought a box once. And tell everyone that 'T shot is for pterodactyl ducks" My suggestion for getting into waterfowl hunting cheap is to look around for a used 870 in a pawn shop. __________________ NRA Life Member Read my blog! "The answer to any caliber debate is going to be .38 Super, 10mm, .357 Sig or .41 Magnum!"

February 19, 2015, 08:13 PM	#9
Virginian Senior Member Join Date: February 11, 2012 Location: Williamsburg, Va. Posts: 1,528	There is a good reason why ALL those guns went away, and why they are available cheap today. Get a 3" pump and shoot premium non toxic shells like Hevi-Shoot Goose or Kent Impact, or get a 3-1/2" pump and shoot steel. __________________ What could have happened... did.

February 20, 2015, 12:43 AM	#13
upstate81 Senior Member Join Date: October 20, 2011 Location: NY Posts: 801	Um I've never considered a canadian goose "way hard " to put down..... I just use 3 inch BB. If you know what your doing and have a decent set up they come right in. In all honesty the 3.5 inch shell is totally useless. It only adds a little more range, which is mostly unnecessary. Not needed for any turkey hunting either. Last edited by upstate81; February 20, 2015 at 04:50 AM.

February 19, 2015, 04:20 PM	#2
98 220 swift Senior Member Join Date: January 4, 2015 Location: Perryville MO Posts: 426	These shotguns where never meant for steel shot. It would be hard on the choke to shot steel through them. A better choice would be a Mossberg 835 or Remington 870 mag with 3.5" chamber. Canadians are hard to put down.

February 19, 2015, 04:47 PM	#4
Doyle Senior Member Join Date: June 20, 2007 Location: Rainbow City, Alabama Posts: 7,167	Those have absolutely zero more range than a shorter barreled shotgun of the same gauge and choke. It is the choke that determines the pattern not the length of the barrel.

February 19, 2015, 04:49 PM	#5
Magnum Wheel Man Senior Member Join Date: July 26, 2006 Location: Southern Minnesota Posts: 9,333	ok... little more velocity ??? __________________ In life you either make dust or eat dust...

February 19, 2015, 10:29 PM	#10
jmr40 Senior Member Join Date: June 15, 2008 Location: Georgia Posts: 10,805	Bismuth would work, but the cost of ammo would negate the savings on the gun. Steel is the cheaper alternative and is not going to work with that gun.

February 19, 2015, 10:41 PM	#11
rcase1234 Senior Member Join Date: September 6, 2012 Location: Michigan Posts: 407	I shoot 3" Winchester BB (about $13 a box or so) with a Mossberg 535 no issues knocking down geese. Highly recommend giving the 535 a look too.

February 19, 2015, 10:46 PM	#12
Creek Henry Senior Member Join Date: October 23, 2009 Location: Dallas Posts: 514	I have used 2 versions of bolt action shotguns. Forget good follow up shots. They are for turkey and slugs, imo.

February 20, 2015, 01:45 AM	#14
mete Senior Member Join Date: June 14, 2004 Location: NY State Posts: 6,575	Yes ,3" 12 ga is all you need , with BB steel . Range is 25-45 yds !!! My Benelli gives a very tight choke so I thought I should think turkey and just use the head as an aim point .So I got mostly head and neck hits no need to hunt for shot in the body. That shooting distance was what I thought and confirmed by the maker,Federal. ! Forget the long range stuff it won't work ! __________________ And Watson , bring your revolver !

February 20, 2015, 02:17 AM	#15
HiBC Senior Member Join Date: November 13, 2006 Posts: 8,283	Its kind of funny how dumb we can be as kids.I had an old Chicopee falls stevens 530A ST 20 ga side by side.It was my one and only shotgun. A couple old game wardens,Gurney Crawford and sig Palm,worked at making the Ft Collins area of northern Colorado friendly to waterfowl. So we had lots of ducks and geese.this was late 60's,early 70's. I loaded that 20 ga with 2 3/4 in Mag #2 shot.It was lead,back then. I got plenty of geese,no problem.I pulled of an occasional double. Back then,you got a limited number of carcass tags for the season,six or eight? I forget. I had a simple guideline.Be able to clearly see their feet. I would pass shoot at edges of fields,lakes,canals.Low crawl irrigation ditches. Just don't sky bust,they aren't that hard.

February 20, 2015, 05:31 AM	#16
Snyper Senior Member Join Date: December 16, 2013 Location: Eastern NC Posts: 3,047	Geese aren't harder to kill than any other birds as long as you know your range limits, and aim for the head The trick is using large enough shot, and finding where they are feeding to get the close shots __________________ One shot, one kill

February 20, 2015, 10:08 AM	#17
AllenJ Senior Member Join Date: December 11, 2009 Location: Northern California Posts: 1,766	In my area back in the day when those Marlin's were "THE" goose gun to have it was because many thought the long barrel made them capable of holding a tighter pattern and being able to really reach out and kill birds. The truth is the longer barrel only served to give the shooter a better sight plane, and when patterned on paper or shot over a chronograph they had no advantage over a shorter barrel shotgun. If you really want one then yes, you should use Bismuth so as not to wreck the barrel. If it were me I would look for a used Remington 870.

February 20, 2015, 11:08 AM	#18
Virginian Senior Member Join Date: February 11, 2012 Location: Williamsburg, Va. Posts: 1,528	My first shotgun was a Mossberg bolt action, and over 50 years later you still couldn't give me another bolt gun of any description for any wingshooting. I for one DO think geese are harder to kill. I remember one Canada that fell after six shots of #2 steel at about 25 yards and still gave the dog a run for the money. You could hold him up in the aluminum boat and shake and pellets would rain in the bottom of the boat. Thereafter I went to copper plated T shot before I eventually went to tungsten. I chased a downed Snow about a mile across a cut corn field in Manitoba, and it looked like someone was pouring blood out of a pitcher the whole way. When I finally caught up to him he was more red than white. The key is you have to put enough pellets into the vitals area, and they have to be big enough to get through all those feathers and fat. I had a friend who was an excellent shot, and he decided he was going to exclusively head shoot them with #4 or maybe #5 shot. After going about oh-for-six on goose hunting trips, he went back to more conventional wisdom. __________________ What could have happened... did.

February 20, 2015, 12:26 PM	#19
Magnum Wheel Man Senior Member Join Date: July 26, 2006 Location: Southern Minnesota Posts: 9,333	I have an 870... it's set up for deer, but there is likely a couple other barrels around here ( inherited from my FIL ) I just assumed those long barrels would be "better" ( hold a tighter pattern, or increase velocity of the shot ) if that's not the case... that just means I already have what I need, or just need a new choke or barrel at most... I think I could hunt from my shooting bench shack ( during the week that they seem to want to over night a couple 100 yards from it ) the floor of the shack is about 6 ft off the ground, bench at 8.5 ft...so I can shoot rifles at all distances through a long shallow valley out to my back stop several 100 yards down the line fence... it has 4ft tall plywood siding walls, & a tin roof over the top for shade & rain protection... I'd think it would make an acceptable blind, the tops of the walls all have a 6" ledge on top, & would make a good rest... was thinking for slug hunting... but maybe for geese as well??? is it legal to shoot them on the ground??? if so, I assume I can't use a rifle for ground birds??? we had thought of raising a few geese... we already raise the big white chickens for meat birds... however goslings are $18 - $20 each at day old... it wouldn't take much to equal out the cost of hunting Canada geese at the price of domestic goslings, if I wanted 8 or 10 for the freezer... & Canada goose numbers are extremely high right now, they are often at pest levels in most cities at parks & golf courses... & I've noticed a lot of them on our place, over the course of a week or so, during fall migration __________________ In life you either make dust or eat dust...

February 20, 2015, 06:10 PM	#22
mete Senior Member Join Date: June 14, 2004 Location: NY State Posts: 6,575	Many of the techniques I used were considered illegal or unsporting even though the Indians in the old days used them !! On the water or ground is fair game ! __________________ And Watson , bring your revolver !

February 20, 2015, 09:28 PM	#23
44 AMP Staff Join Date: March 11, 2006 Location: Upper US Posts: 28,820	Check local and Fed laws both. Local laws can be ..complex. I know of a place where geese can only be taken in certain areas, on certain days of the week, during season. Taking them on the ground, or in the water is not "sporting". (when you are doing it to survive, sporting doesn't count, but that is more than rare these days) I don't KNOW of any law that says you can't take them on the ground, but that doesn't mean that there isn't any, somewhere. __________________ All else being equal (and it almost never is) bigger bullets tend to work better.

February 20, 2015, 11:33 PM	#24
mattL46 Senior Member Join Date: February 9, 2013 Posts: 656	I'm pretty sure here in logan county oklahoma, you can't take any migratory bird on the ground. It must be coming in or going out. I'm not a hunter. I could be wrong.