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Old September 23, 2008, 02:16 PM   #1
SPUSCG
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.44 black powder for defense?

im buying an 1851 in 44 soon since A. I want one B. I need a hunting sidearm. is there any expanding ammo or hunting rounds i can use or just the regular old round ball?
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Old September 23, 2008, 02:42 PM   #2
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There used to be Buffalo Balletts that were 180gr. that was an improvement in striking energy but I don't think they are available anymore.

I don't have the mold at the moment but the 200gr. Lee cast RN conical will work in that Pistol & also improve the striking energy but at the moment it would have to be hand cast by either you or some one willing to do it for you.

I've made a thread in the sales area of here for those Lee bullets but I'd have to get the 200gr. mold since my old one is out of commision ATM.
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Old September 23, 2008, 03:17 PM   #3
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From my understaning and research, you will have better accuracy with round ball anyway. You may want to pick up a conversion cylinder for it so you can shoot 45LC cowboy action ammo (as long as the frame isn't brass). I did that with my 1858 NMA and load my own 45LC rounds with black powder or smokeless (loaded to cowboy action specs) and press in a 250gr LRN bullet. Only problem is that the conversion cylinder runs around 240 bucks.
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Old September 23, 2008, 08:13 PM   #4
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If you are talking about defense from a wild critter you need a conical slug.
For defense from a human, the round ball is what you want.
One torso shot will put 'em down for the count.
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Old September 23, 2008, 08:33 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by simonkenton
If you are talking about defense from a wild critter you need a conical slug.
For defense from a human, the round ball is what you want.
One torso shot will put 'em down for the count.
Agreed a ball is quite an effective projectile within a resonable distance but I'm thinking of more twords the 4 legged creatures than 2, a more modern design weapon would be better suited for 2 legged critters today but if all he had was a C&B revolver then a conical bullet would be an equalizer for either.
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Old September 23, 2008, 09:40 PM   #6
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On the issue of expansion, with soft lead balls, it really isn't an issue. They expand anyway and deform upon impact.
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Old September 24, 2008, 02:48 AM   #7
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I'd opt for the 137-143 gr Round ball myself...that's all I use in soft lead form.

And I do still keep a .44 1858 Rem or 2 loaded for home Defence, close at hand. They worked before the 1911 .45 Autos were around, so I guess it's jus' how much faith you have in your Rev, thumb, and Finger.

Yup there is a loaded 12ga Ithica Police D.S. in the safe and a Ruger .357mag also both loaded...but it's a Rem that sleeps with one eye open within arms reach.

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Old September 24, 2008, 04:15 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Smokin_Gun
I'd opt for the 137-143 gr Round ball myself...that's all I use in soft lead form.

And I do still keep a .44 1858 Rem or 2 loaded for home Defence, close at hand. They worked before the 1911 .45 Autos were around, so I guess it's jus' how much faith you have in your Rev, thumb, and Finger.

Yup there is a loaded 12ga Ithica Police D.S. in the safe and a Ruger .357mag also both loaded...but it's a Rem that sleeps with one eye open within arms reach.

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Old September 24, 2008, 04:55 AM   #9
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Man we must be brothers or something because we do seem to think alike
Born and raised a Country Boy...I had the privilage of shuckin' peas from the garden...I can remember seein' two like peas in a pod. And I shucked alot a peas...HeeHee!

I take that as acompliment commin' from you,
Thanks Raider 2000,

SG
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Old September 24, 2008, 12:23 PM   #10
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Wild Bill Hickok killed a man with a single shot to the chest from an 1851 Navy, .36 caliber round ball.

I have a couple of cap and ball .44s around for household defense.
I have read reports from the Civil War and the troopers said the round ball worked better than the conical slug on humans.
Foraging for cattle, they preferred the elongated slug.
They said that a single shot with the round ball would knock the enemy trooper out of the saddle, and out of the fight.
Whether he died or not they didn't say, I doubt they went back and checked his pulse.
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Old September 24, 2008, 03:38 PM   #11
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im not allowed to have guns in my house anyway...ill move out after "a" school though and the reminton will be under my bed where it belongs, the revolver will be a fun gun and a hunting sidearm, black powder is fun
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Old September 24, 2008, 06:29 PM   #12
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Quote Raider2000
Quote:
There used to be Buffalo Balletts that were 180gr. that was an improvement in striking energy but I don't think they are available anymore.
Cabelas still has em.

Slick Silver Conical Pistol Bullets, Buffalo Bullet Company. 180 grain ,451 hollow based, pure lead, round-nose bullets. Silver Slick dry-lubricated to reduce fouling and increase velocity. Reduced bullet heel aids loading. Per 50 bullets. Available: .36, .44, .45.
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Old September 25, 2008, 07:19 AM   #13
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Hmmm... I wonder if I could seat them in a 45lc case over about 30 to 35 gr of BP? I've been known to seat a round ball in a 45lc case with a lubed felt patch and 35gr BP under it. This probably wouldn't need the patch, and might shoot pretty good from my conversion cylinder. Would be easier to crimp as well.
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Old September 25, 2008, 10:49 AM   #14
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I use the Lee .45 caliber 200 grain REAL bullets on top of a lubed wad. They load straight and easy in the Remingtons, 1860's, Dragoons, and Walkers, and they hit the target with a real good THWACK. With the flat nose, and cast out of pure lead, they are going to make a real mess out of whatever you shoot it at. They are, after all, designed as a hunting bullet.
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Old October 4, 2008, 09:04 PM   #15
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44 is a Good C&B Choice

The 44 will be a great choice. I have been carrying Second Generation .36 calibre Colts since the early 80s. I have more modern guns, and depending on what I am doing (and feeling like) on a particular day determines what I have with me. Yep - that is pre-ban elephant ivory. I started tricking my old friends out a few years back.
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Old October 5, 2008, 10:26 AM   #16
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my favorites

i still like a snubnose with the option of putting a conversion cylinder it,makes a good under the pillow ,nite table,etc... type guns



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Old October 5, 2008, 11:43 AM   #17
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You surely could do a lot worse than a .44 roundball! I know I've never seen armadillos explode like they do when a .54cal roundball at 1850fps hits `em!

This one is really cool and sets some wheels a turnin'!
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Old October 5, 2008, 12:01 PM   #18
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its an 1860 colt,with a vaquero thunderer grip frame



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Old October 5, 2008, 04:24 PM   #19
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I was just thinking that a feller could procure a used 1860 rather inexpensively and I think the grip frame is not much more than a hundred bucks. A plug could be turned on my lathe for the rammer and held in place with a setscrew. Chop the barrel and install a dovetail front sight. Do either an original finish or have somebody like Accurate Plating refinish it in something interesting.

Then the long Army grip frame could be used on something else.
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Old October 5, 2008, 04:50 PM   #20
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thats a great idea my friend i'm a remmi lover but i fell for this lil guy,i would like to make this as a project myself,keep me posted on it or everyone else.



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Old October 6, 2008, 11:12 AM   #21
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A point seldom brought up with respect to using a cap&ball revolver for home defense: black powder short guns are blowtorches! Anything flammable within ten feet of the muzzle is at risk. This will include loose clothing, drapes, bedclothes, carpet, the family cat, etc. And, if in protecting your life and goodies a fire results, insurance companies tend to be truculent with clients who use black powder inside the house.

So, are cap&ballers effective defense weapons? Yup. Are they a good substitute for a smokeless handgun of comparable caliber? Only if ya don't mind the possibility of making a complete ash of yourself fending off the goblins...

Just a thought...

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Old October 6, 2008, 11:18 AM   #22
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than ks mousegun

me myself would have a conversion cylinder in place of BP,to prevent such happenings.



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Old October 6, 2008, 12:31 PM   #23
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My '58 Remington plays a HD role, but currently sports an R&D .45 Colt cylinder, loaded with Hornady 255 Grain Lead Flat Nose cowboy ammunition. But I don't think I'd worry unduly, if it were loaded with round ball over 35gr BP instead.
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Old October 6, 2008, 01:54 PM   #24
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If using c&b for home defense, don't use a felt wad in there anywhere. They come out smoking and burning. Better chance of starting a fire than without it.
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Old October 6, 2008, 03:39 PM   #25
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actual useful info

thank you sir, thank you!!!

Respectfully,


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