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Old October 10, 2007, 10:19 PM   #1
Sigma 40 Blaster
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COAL Suddenly Decreased...for no reason

Guys,

At or near the end of my reloading marathon my cartridge length decreased from 1.125 to 1.080 for my .40 cal. No one fooled with any of the dies or the press, the die is clean...it was a very sudden change.

This ever happen to someone...any idea what contributed to it?

I'm still under the recommended starting load about about 5.0 grains...these guys still are safe to shoot right????
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Old October 10, 2007, 10:37 PM   #2
rwilson452
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It sure sound like you got something stuck up in the die. did you remove and disassemble the die to check it or it could be that whatever was in there fell out while you were checking it.
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Old October 10, 2007, 11:51 PM   #3
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I have had that problem. It was caused by me having the crimp too tight and brass shavings from the case getting into the die. The result was an intermittent COL problem (The shavings fell out when I took out the die.) that confused the hell out of me until I figured it out.

Are you using Jacketed or lead bullets? If the crimp is too tight, lead will get shaved as well.
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Old October 11, 2007, 06:34 AM   #4
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What brand of die is it ?
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Old October 11, 2007, 08:00 AM   #5
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I am using lead bullets and the dies are Lee.

I worked for a while to set up the crimp so the cartridges would fit into a case gauge or barrel of the gun I'll be shooting them in. I removed the entire turret with dies and all and saw nothing inside the die that would've caused it.

I'll do it again this morning in better light to see if there's any lead or brass stuck in the die...thanks for the ideas.

Would you guys still feel good about shooting those bullets with a small COAL if the charge isn't near max load? I'm thinking NO but surely one of the gurus here can shed some insight on that. I don't want to shoot any over pressure .40 cal...this is just plinking stuff anyway, hate to screw up a gun and myself for about 50 short bullets.
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Old October 11, 2007, 08:02 AM   #6
Alleykat
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I wouldn't reload .40s on a bet, regardless of o.a.l.
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Old October 11, 2007, 08:08 AM   #7
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common problem. if you're loading lead bullets, you've got a lead buildup on your seating die.
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Old October 11, 2007, 11:16 AM   #8
Dave P
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I'm still under the recommended starting load about about 5.0 grains..


Why so low??? I think you can get very bad results (detonation) from this alone. That's why they give you min data.

In a more normal load you would be increasing the pressure by about 5000 PSI due to the shorter length. Fairly significant.
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Old October 11, 2007, 02:35 PM   #9
UGH
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I had a the same problem with my seating die. Take the die apart and take a look at the top of the seating stem and make sure it is smooth on top. Take a look inside of the threaded end. The one I had had a burr on it and drove me nuts. If thats the case Lee will replace it. Also you said your using lead so make sure that there is no lead shavings in the die also. I am assuming that you are seating and crimping separately. If not I would as that could give you issues as well IMHO.Personally I would not shoot the shorter COL because the 1.125 to 1.080 you described can cause higher than normal pressure depending on how close to the max load you are and type of powder.
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Old October 11, 2007, 07:25 PM   #10
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Dave P

I load em up at 5.0 grains because the Lee Auto Disk isn't the most consistent in the world, if I go to the next hole that puts me up almost at max load...throw in a .2 grain variance and I'm at or a little over max load. In the manuals I've seen a 180 grain lead bullet starting load is 5.2 grains, max of 5.5.


Last night I looked into the die and didn't see anything abnormal. I checked out my new 9mm die and noticed that the seater has a "recessed" top. My .40 was straight across. I got in good lighting and found that I had about 1/4" of lead stuck in the top of the die, and a good bit accumulated around where the crimping takes place.

I soaked it in lead cleaner and used my .40 cal nylon brush to clean it out...what a difference lol. I've loaded approx 5,000 bullets through this thing and never thought once about cleaning it...I clean/lube my sizing and expanding die regularly but. That's why I love this forum, thanks for the advice to the newbie who temporarily forgot he was a newbie.
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Old October 13, 2007, 04:05 PM   #11
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Buller lube and other crap, crud and corruption can collect on the seater die, causing the bullets to be seated too far...take your dies apart frequently and clean each of them, good practice for us all!
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Old October 20, 2007, 12:53 AM   #12
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The way I understand it, lead bullets get a lighter load to prevent leading up the barrel. If I had done that (assuming your load data is correct) I would just shoot them off, and expect a little more leading in the barrel. There is NO FRIGGING WAY you are gonna get a compressed load with the fine grain powder you must be using, with a change of .045". You must be using #2 or something. I load plated 180 grain (same load data as lead) with #5 and use 6.3 grains.
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Old October 20, 2007, 03:48 PM   #13
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I have been a fan of LEE Dies for years. Lately I have been watching my OAL's closer and found variances like you described. The LEE seater die uses an O-Ring as a lock and it doesn't do a very good job. I finally replaced my seater die for 9mm with a Dillon and my .223 with a Redding. No more variations. Dillon Dies have a reversable seating plug for round nosed or flat pointed bullets. The LEE Seater Plug is a compromise at best and does fill with crap easily.
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