Raging Bull got me Raging

paknheat · March 21, 2010, 05:18 PM

I have a Taurus Raging Bull chambered in .454 Casull. It has a 6.5 barrell. I am intrested in finding a load that it will like. So far i have tried the Hornady 250gn XTP ,26- 30gn H-110, both Win mag pistol & small rifle primers. At 25yds my attempts have been less than sucessful

. So, do any of y'all who have a R.B. and load for it have a recipie you feel like sharing? I am going on a hog hunt in May and would love to whack a bigun with this thing.

Newton24b · March 21, 2010, 11:40 PM

what factory rounds have been working correctly in your weapon?

mrawesome22 · March 22, 2010, 09:11 AM

Could be the bullet. The XTP-Mag is recommended for Casull velocities. I don't have a R.B. but a 240gr XTP-Mag over 37gr H110 and a SRM primer works very well for me out of a Super Redhawk.

WESHOOT2 · March 22, 2010, 09:12 AM

First, how readily/easily do those XTPs pass through the cylinder's throats?

Second, you might consider a 300g version, or some other bullet.

Have you tried accuracy testing with any 'mild' loadings?

paknheat · March 22, 2010, 07:45 PM

Thanks alot for the response,I have tried lighter loadings in the RB 26gn of H-110 on up to 30 no signifigant results,@ 25 yds the groups are all over the place. 26.5 gn of H-110 in my .45 Colt has been a real accurate rnd in my old .45 BlackHawk, but not in my RB.Never tried any factory loads. Been loading for quite a while, don't think i have bought a box of factory ammo for any of my guns in about 17 yrs.Bullets pass through the cylinder just fine, and i had a buddy , who is a gunsmith, mike the barrell and cylinder just to make sure. Maybe i need to up the charge. My old nosler manual qouted 30gn of H-110 as a accuracy load, but it isn't proven to be this time.
mrawesome i appreciate you sharing your "pet load" with me, and i may give it a try.
WESHOOT2, i am curious as to your train of thought?

**Unclenick** · March 22, 2010, 08:05 PM

How did the measurements come out? Also, did he try slugging the barrel to see if it has a bad constriction where it screws into the frame? Not uncommon in revolvers. It usually only bothers cast bullets, but if it's bad enough, even jacketed ones won't like it, especially at less-than-maximum loads where there isn't a lot of pressure to bump the bullet back up after passing through the constriction.

50 shooter · March 22, 2010, 10:37 PM

Most of the loads that I've used for my RB I've picked up from www.loadswap.com. I use mostly 300+ gr bullets and push them on the warm side.

I don't really keep track of accuracy but when you hit bowling pins and other small targets at 50-100 yards w/o any problems then I would say it's good enough.

Just remember that if you plan on shooting the heavy stuff to use a heavy crimp. I've had some 405 gr bullets pull out of the cases due to the heavy recoil. I prefer to use H110 with small rifle primers.

WESHOOT2 · March 23, 2010, 08:46 AM

IME some guns do not perform, or sometimes at all, with a specific bullet.
So I try a different bullet.
First.

Maybe your RB doesn't 'like' 250g XTPs.
Might like a 300g Swift A-Frame, or a Speer or a Cast Performance 335g or who knows?

Old Grump · March 23, 2010, 02:27 PM

300 gr JHP with 26.0 gr of No. 9 and CCI 400, about 1650 fps and it should be accurate. I didn't get mine like I thought I was but this is the load my buddy uses in his Rossi Puma Carbine and its powder I have so would be my choice if I ever get it. I assume the difference in velocity between his 20" barrel and your 6 1/2" would get you somewhere in the 1600fps mark but thats a guess. I do know he makes a large jagged hole with 5 shots at 50 yards.

paknheat · March 24, 2010, 06:27 AM

Thanks alot folks,WESHOOT2, i had the same thought. but i have a few hundred of the hornady bullets and was hoping to make them work.My friend did'nt slug the barrell, but i may have to use a heavier bullet. I did check some load info from Hornady, and their starting load is 34.1 gn of H-110. So i may have been too light indeed. back to the loading bench i go.

Mike / Tx · March 24, 2010, 06:54 PM

While I have the RB in the 8.375" barrel, I have found that it likes the 260gr bullets and up. I started out using the start loads listed on the Freedom Arms site for 296 and 2400 since I had the most of those two powders. I also used the Hodgdon site as a reference for the 260gr bullets. I have also shot the 265gr Cast Performance gas checked bullets as well with their load recommendations for 296.

Personally I have not found a need to use anything heavier for even the biggest hogs we have come across with this caliber. The Cast Performance loads shot completely through a 250# sow lengthwise, from snout to tail, making mush of everything in between. The 260gr mag jacketed bullets, I got from Lock Stock and Barrel a while back have works out wonderfully even at MY top end velocities, which are pushing 1850fps, and are a bit much for plinking.

I would look over the data on those two sites, and possibly up your charges a bit, use the SM Rifle primers exclusively, and look at possibly another bullet designed expressly for the magnum velocities capable with this round. The two listed above easily shoot 1" from a rest at 50yds, if I can keep the fat sight centered on the orange paster. I wish you the best with yours as I have had a great time with mine.

Hope this helps.

paknheat · March 25, 2010, 05:44 AM

Mike/TX, i will look into the info you posted . Thanx alot.

Doodlebugger45 · March 25, 2010, 10:03 AM

Regular jacketed bullets, whether Speer, Hornady, Sierra, etc were not designed to be shot over 1400 fps. That's why Speer and Hornady both came up with things like the XTP-Mag for instance. They claim the jackets on the lighter jacket bullets can deform as they exit the muzzle at extreme velocities. I have used some regular XTPs in my BFR but keep the velocity low and they are OK. My best results have been with hardcast gas checks in the 300 gr range.

paknheat · March 30, 2010, 06:28 AM

Thax for all the input. I tried out a new load of 34.5 gn H-110 & the mentioned 250 gn bullet. Better results. about a 4'' group and a little low @ 25 yds. I'm going to bump it a grain or 2 and see what i get. May get my moneys worth from those bullets yet.

paknheat · April 5, 2010, 08:57 PM

Update, for those intrested. I used 35.7 gn H-110 , the Hornady 250gn XTP bullet, Winchester small rifle primer and Starline case. This resulted in a very decent group including a couple of certer x's at 25 yds. So apparently my RB does'nt respond well to light loading. Intresting enough, i tried the exact same load recipie,and substituted W-296 for the H-110 and got the same results. I guess H-110 and W-296 are the same powder in different cans.

Mike / Tx · April 6, 2010, 04:54 AM

Quote:

Update, for those intrested. I used 35.7 gn H-110 , the Hornady 250gn XTP bullet, Winchester small rifle primer and Starline case. This resulted in a very decent group including a couple of certer x's at 25 yds. So apparently my RB does'nt respond well to light loading. Intresting enough, i tried the exact same load recipie,and substituted W-296 for the H-110 and got the same results. I guess H-110 and W-296 are the same powder in different cans.

Once upon a time they were a bit different, nowadays however they are the same.

Glad to see your's is coming around for you. They are a hoot, and you will have a ball with the hogs using it. Just be sure whats behind them as most bullets will just keep on trucking.

Lost Sheep · April 7, 2010, 03:23 AM

Just for grins and giggles, try this:

Mark your cylinder to you can identify each chamber.

Set up a target with 6 bullseyes (the Raging Bull is a Six-shootier, right?)

Load all chambers and index the gun to fire chamber #1 and shoot bullseye #1, then 32, then #3.... and so forth. (and make sure the cylinder stop hand is locked up in the cylinder for each round).

Load up again and repeat. Chamber #1 going to bullseye #1 and so forth.

In this way, each chamber is producing its own group on its own bullseye, independent of the other chambers.

This process just eliminates one variable from a world of variables.

You could also put the gun through this examination, paying particular attention to the cylinder lock-up.
http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=57816

I may be particularly sensitive to the cylinder lockup because I had a SUPREMELY accurate Dan Wesson revolver which locked up in double action OK and in single action if the hammer were cocked quickly, but if cocked slowly, the advancing hand did not rotate the cylinder far enough for the locking hand (cylinder stop) to drop into the locking notch, leaving the chamber close, but not quite, fully lined up with the barrel. Accuracy may have suffered. DW fixed it quickly with no charge, but I didn't have the foresight to test it to see if it actually did affect accuracy.

Lost Sheep

March 22, 2010, 09:12 AM	#4
WESHOOT2 Senior Member Join Date: February 20, 1999 Location: home on the range; Vermont (Caspian country) Posts: 14,324	uh-oh First, how readily/easily do those XTPs pass through the cylinder's throats? Second, you might consider a 300g version, or some other bullet. Have you tried accuracy testing with any 'mild' loadings? __________________ . "all my ammo is mostly retired factory ammo"

March 22, 2010, 08:05 PM	#6
Unclenick Staff Join Date: March 4, 2005 Location: Ohio Posts: 21,063	How did the measurements come out? Also, did he try slugging the barrel to see if it has a bad constriction where it screws into the frame? Not uncommon in revolvers. It usually only bothers cast bullets, but if it's bad enough, even jacketed ones won't like it, especially at less-than-maximum loads where there isn't a lot of pressure to bump the bullet back up after passing through the constriction. __________________ Gunsite Orange Hat Family Member CMP Certified GSM Master Instructor NRA Certified Rifle Instructor NRA Benefactor Member and Golden Eagle

March 22, 2010, 10:37 PM	#7
50 shooter Senior Member Join Date: August 6, 2002 Location: SoCal PRK Posts: 986	Most of the loads that I've used for my RB I've picked up from www.loadswap.com. I use mostly 300+ gr bullets and push them on the warm side. I don't really keep track of accuracy but when you hit bowling pins and other small targets at 50-100 yards w/o any problems then I would say it's good enough. Just remember that if you plan on shooting the heavy stuff to use a heavy crimp. I've had some 405 gr bullets pull out of the cases due to the heavy recoil. I prefer to use H110 with small rifle primers. __________________ I see the world thru bloodshot eyes Streets filled with blood from distant lies The dogs of war never compromise, No time for rearranging.

March 23, 2010, 08:46 AM	#8
WESHOOT2 Senior Member Join Date: February 20, 1999 Location: home on the range; Vermont (Caspian country) Posts: 14,324	derailed IME some guns do not perform, or sometimes at all, with a specific bullet. So I try a different bullet. First. Maybe your RB doesn't 'like' 250g XTPs. Might like a 300g Swift A-Frame, or a Speer or a Cast Performance 335g or who knows? __________________ . "all my ammo is mostly retired factory ammo"

March 23, 2010, 02:27 PM	#9
Old Grump Member in memoriam Join Date: April 9, 2009 Location: Blue River Wisconsin, in Posts: 3,144	300 gr JHP with 26.0 gr of No. 9 and CCI 400, about 1650 fps and it should be accurate. I didn't get mine like I thought I was but this is the load my buddy uses in his Rossi Puma Carbine and its powder I have so would be my choice if I ever get it. I assume the difference in velocity between his 20" barrel and your 6 1/2" would get you somewhere in the 1600fps mark but thats a guess. I do know he makes a large jagged hole with 5 shots at 50 yards. __________________ Good intentions will always be pleaded for any assumption of power. The Constitution was made to guard the people against the dangers of good intentions. There are men in all ages who mean to govern will, but they mean to govern. They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters. --Daniel Webster--

March 21, 2010, 05:18 PM	#1
paknheat Senior Member Join Date: October 17, 2006 Location: East Texas Posts: 334	Raging Bull got me Raging I have a Taurus Raging Bull chambered in .454 Casull. It has a 6.5 barrell. I am intrested in finding a load that it will like. So far i have tried the Hornady 250gn XTP ,26- 30gn H-110, both Win mag pistol & small rifle primers. At 25yds my attempts have been less than sucessful. So, do any of y'all who have a R.B. and load for it have a recipie you feel like sharing? I am going on a hog hunt in May and would love to whack a bigun with this thing.

March 21, 2010, 11:40 PM	#2
Newton24b Junior member Join Date: February 10, 2009 Posts: 974	what factory rounds have been working correctly in your weapon?

March 22, 2010, 09:11 AM	#3
mrawesome22 Senior Member Join Date: November 9, 2005 Location: Ohio, Appalachia's foothills. Posts: 3,779	Could be the bullet. The XTP-Mag is recommended for Casull velocities. I don't have a R.B. but a 240gr XTP-Mag over 37gr H110 and a SRM primer works very well for me out of a Super Redhawk.

March 22, 2010, 07:45 PM	#5
paknheat Senior Member Join Date: October 17, 2006 Location: East Texas Posts: 334	Thanks alot for the response,I have tried lighter loadings in the RB 26gn of H-110 on up to 30 no signifigant results,@ 25 yds the groups are all over the place. 26.5 gn of H-110 in my .45 Colt has been a real accurate rnd in my old .45 BlackHawk, but not in my RB.Never tried any factory loads. Been loading for quite a while, don't think i have bought a box of factory ammo for any of my guns in about 17 yrs.Bullets pass through the cylinder just fine, and i had a buddy , who is a gunsmith, mike the barrell and cylinder just to make sure. Maybe i need to up the charge. My old nosler manual qouted 30gn of H-110 as a accuracy load, but it isn't proven to be this time. mrawesome i appreciate you sharing your "pet load" with me, and i may give it a try. WESHOOT2, i am curious as to your train of thought?

March 24, 2010, 06:27 AM	#10
paknheat Senior Member Join Date: October 17, 2006 Location: East Texas Posts: 334	Thanks alot folks,WESHOOT2, i had the same thought. but i have a few hundred of the hornady bullets and was hoping to make them work.My friend did'nt slug the barrell, but i may have to use a heavier bullet. I did check some load info from Hornady, and their starting load is 34.1 gn of H-110. So i may have been too light indeed. back to the loading bench i go.

March 24, 2010, 06:54 PM	#11
Mike / Tx Senior Member Join Date: April 8, 2000 Posts: 2,101	While I have the RB in the 8.375" barrel, I have found that it likes the 260gr bullets and up. I started out using the start loads listed on the Freedom Arms site for 296 and 2400 since I had the most of those two powders. I also used the Hodgdon site as a reference for the 260gr bullets. I have also shot the 265gr Cast Performance gas checked bullets as well with their load recommendations for 296. Personally I have not found a need to use anything heavier for even the biggest hogs we have come across with this caliber. The Cast Performance loads shot completely through a 250# sow lengthwise, from snout to tail, making mush of everything in between. The 260gr mag jacketed bullets, I got from Lock Stock and Barrel a while back have works out wonderfully even at MY top end velocities, which are pushing 1850fps, and are a bit much for plinking. I would look over the data on those two sites, and possibly up your charges a bit, use the SM Rifle primers exclusively, and look at possibly another bullet designed expressly for the magnum velocities capable with this round. The two listed above easily shoot 1" from a rest at 50yds, if I can keep the fat sight centered on the orange paster. I wish you the best with yours as I have had a great time with mine. Hope this helps.

March 25, 2010, 05:44 AM	#12
paknheat Senior Member Join Date: October 17, 2006 Location: East Texas Posts: 334	Mike/TX, i will look into the info you posted . Thanx alot.

March 25, 2010, 10:03 AM	#13
Doodlebugger45 Senior Member Join Date: April 15, 2009 Location: Wyoming Posts: 1,717	Regular jacketed bullets, whether Speer, Hornady, Sierra, etc were not designed to be shot over 1400 fps. That's why Speer and Hornady both came up with things like the XTP-Mag for instance. They claim the jackets on the lighter jacket bullets can deform as they exit the muzzle at extreme velocities. I have used some regular XTPs in my BFR but keep the velocity low and they are OK. My best results have been with hardcast gas checks in the 300 gr range.

March 30, 2010, 06:28 AM	#14
paknheat Senior Member Join Date: October 17, 2006 Location: East Texas Posts: 334	Thax for all the input. I tried out a new load of 34.5 gn H-110 & the mentioned 250 gn bullet. Better results. about a 4'' group and a little low @ 25 yds. I'm going to bump it a grain or 2 and see what i get. May get my moneys worth from those bullets yet.

April 5, 2010, 08:57 PM	#15
paknheat Senior Member Join Date: October 17, 2006 Location: East Texas Posts: 334	Update, for those intrested. I used 35.7 gn H-110 , the Hornady 250gn XTP bullet, Winchester small rifle primer and Starline case. This resulted in a very decent group including a couple of certer x's at 25 yds. So apparently my RB does'nt respond well to light loading. Intresting enough, i tried the exact same load recipie,and substituted W-296 for the H-110 and got the same results. I guess H-110 and W-296 are the same powder in different cans.

April 7, 2010, 03:23 AM	#17
Lost Sheep Senior Member Join Date: January 24, 2009 Location: Anchorage Alaska Posts: 3,341	Try this: Just for grins and giggles, try this: Mark your cylinder to you can identify each chamber. Set up a target with 6 bullseyes (the Raging Bull is a Six-shootier, right?) Load all chambers and index the gun to fire chamber #1 and shoot bullseye #1, then 32, then #3.... and so forth. (and make sure the cylinder stop hand is locked up in the cylinder for each round). Load up again and repeat. Chamber #1 going to bullseye #1 and so forth. In this way, each chamber is producing its own group on its own bullseye, independent of the other chambers. This process just eliminates one variable from a world of variables. You could also put the gun through this examination, paying particular attention to the cylinder lock-up. http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=57816 I may be particularly sensitive to the cylinder lockup because I had a SUPREMELY accurate Dan Wesson revolver which locked up in double action OK and in single action if the hammer were cocked quickly, but if cocked slowly, the advancing hand did not rotate the cylinder far enough for the locking hand (cylinder stop) to drop into the locking notch, leaving the chamber close, but not quite, fully lined up with the barrel. Accuracy may have suffered. DW fixed it quickly with no charge, but I didn't have the foresight to test it to see if it actually did affect accuracy. Lost Sheep