What dies for my .308 loads?

imq707s · June 7, 2007, 12:13 AM

I just got my new CZ 550 Varmint rifle in today. I'm getting ready to order some dies so I can start working up some hand loads. In the past I've always used the standard RCBS 2-die set (full length sizer & deprimer/neck expander). How do these dies rank against some of the other "precison" brands of dies? I'm assuming that in order to get the best accuracy out of my new rifle I will need to full lenght size the brass, fire-form the brass, and then only neck size them after that.....right? How many reloads should I get from the brass before I have to start with a new batch?

What is a good set of dies to buy? I want a good set of dies that will give me good accuracy, and not break my wallet. Are the RCBS dies pretty good? What about the Lee dies?

Any info you guys could give me would be great.....I'm new to the "precision rifle" area of reloading. I'm used to just loading up rounds for hunting.

Thanks for the help.

Shoney · June 7, 2007, 12:29 AM

Redding generally considered the very best, but now the Lee Collet Die is being advertised as:
"There is no loading system that will load more accurate ammunition than Lee Collet Dies. We guarantee it in writing with every set. No one but Lee has ever dared to make a guarantee like this "Smallest group size or your money back."

You are correct in the procedure you outlined for FL sizing, fireforming, neck sizing.

T. O'Heir · June 7, 2007, 03:07 AM

I've been loading match grade and hunting ammo with regular RCBS dies for years. If you want, you can set up the sizer die to neck size only if you use the brass only in that rifle. FL won't hurt anything but it is a wee bit harder on the brass. It's necessary if you have another .308 and use the same brass or if you ever buy a semi-auto in .308.
The precision part comes by being meticulous. Weigh each and every powder charge even after you've worked up the load. No crimping required. Neck tension should be sufficient.
The only other thing is the bullet. Match grade bullets, while expensive, will give you better groups, but they are not suitable for hunting anything but varmints. Think 168 grain match bullets for up to 600 yards, 175 grain Matchkings for over 600. For a hunting bullet, use 165 grain bullets. The .308 loves 'em. A 165 grain bullet will kill any game in North America you care to hunt.
IMR4064 is one of the powders to use. Varget has a good reputation too, but I've never used it myself.

boltgun71 · June 7, 2007, 06:05 AM

I use standard RCBS dies for my .308 and they have worked fine. I dont know what you consider match grade accuracy but I have gotten a few 1/4" groups(3 shots) at 100yds with mine and 1/2-3/4 MOA(3 or 5 shots) or better depending on bullet type has been the standard with it. Like what was said earlier I think being meticulous is the key. I weigh each powder charge individually and measure each round to make sure bullet seating/OAL is the same and so on with the other steps. Consistency is key in my book.

Walkalong · June 7, 2007, 07:06 AM

Redding Competition dies or Forster Bench Rest dies will do just fine. After that it is bullet selection and load development.

WCW · June 7, 2007, 07:50 AM

I have several sets of RCBS dies and they have worked fine for years, but any dies I purchase in the future will be Hornady dies. The Hornady elliptical expander button is a lot smoother going through the case necks following resizing. I don’t think you can go wrong with either brand.

Clark · June 7, 2007, 09:08 AM

I have Wilson, Redding "S", Forster, Lee, RCBS, Hornady, Lyman, and some old obscure brands.

I prefer to use:
1) Forster full length sizers honed out to my neck specification at the Forster factory for $10
2) Forster sliding sleeve seater die

But if a guy really knows what he is doing, he can load sub moa ammo with cheap old RCBS dies:
1) De prime in a separate step.
2) Remove the expander ball
3) Lube only the outside of the case
4) Full length size, but adjust the die until the should is pushed back .001"
5) Square and chamfer the inside of the neck.
6) Seat in three steps with 120 degrees of rotation
7) Seat long so the bullet touches the lands.
8) Shoot only on days with no wind

Bart Bobbit shoots groups 1/4 the size of mine with old RCBS sizers with the necks lapped out.

brickeyee · June 7, 2007, 09:20 AM

Try plain old RCBS dies first and see if the gun has any other problems.

More advanced methods are only likely to be productve if everything else is correct.

100W_Warlock · June 10, 2007, 11:04 AM

Your bolt gun is new and 308 spec, so, I would use Redding.

I like Dillon for 7.62 military brass and M1A rifles... (although, it don't really matter for semi autos that much)

RCBS is just as good IMHO.

I have worked up sub MOA loads with Lee dies for .223 and 30-06, as well.

There is no substitute for good process and procedures.

June 7, 2007, 12:13 AM	#1
imq707s Senior Member Join Date: August 31, 2000 Posts: 179	What dies for my .308 loads? I just got my new CZ 550 Varmint rifle in today. I'm getting ready to order some dies so I can start working up some hand loads. In the past I've always used the standard RCBS 2-die set (full length sizer & deprimer/neck expander). How do these dies rank against some of the other "precison" brands of dies? I'm assuming that in order to get the best accuracy out of my new rifle I will need to full lenght size the brass, fire-form the brass, and then only neck size them after that.....right? How many reloads should I get from the brass before I have to start with a new batch? What is a good set of dies to buy? I want a good set of dies that will give me good accuracy, and not break my wallet. Are the RCBS dies pretty good? What about the Lee dies? Any info you guys could give me would be great.....I'm new to the "precision rifle" area of reloading. I'm used to just loading up rounds for hunting. Thanks for the help.

June 7, 2007, 12:29 AM	#2
Shoney Senior Member Join Date: February 21, 2002 Location: Transplanted from Montana Posts: 2,311	Redding generally considered the very best, but now the Lee Collet Die is being advertised as: "There is no loading system that will load more accurate ammunition than Lee Collet Dies. We guarantee it in writing with every set. No one but Lee has ever dared to make a guarantee like this "Smallest group size or your money back." You are correct in the procedure you outlined for FL sizing, fireforming, neck sizing. __________________ I pledge allegiance to the Flag - - -, and to the Republic for which it stands….Our Forefathers were brilliant for giving us a Republic, not a democracy! Do you know the difference??? and WHY?http://www.wallbuilders.com/LIBissue...les.asp?id=111

June 10, 2007, 11:04 AM	#9
100W_Warlock Senior Member Join Date: May 23, 2004 Posts: 267	Redding work well... Your bolt gun is new and 308 spec, so, I would use Redding. I like Dillon for 7.62 military brass and M1A rifles... (although, it don't really matter for semi autos that much) RCBS is just as good IMHO. I have worked up sub MOA loads with Lee dies for .223 and 30-06, as well. There is no substitute for good process and procedures.

June 7, 2007, 03:07 AM	#3
T. O'Heir Senior Member Join Date: February 13, 2002 Location: Canada Posts: 12,453	I've been loading match grade and hunting ammo with regular RCBS dies for years. If you want, you can set up the sizer die to neck size only if you use the brass only in that rifle. FL won't hurt anything but it is a wee bit harder on the brass. It's necessary if you have another .308 and use the same brass or if you ever buy a semi-auto in .308. The precision part comes by being meticulous. Weigh each and every powder charge even after you've worked up the load. No crimping required. Neck tension should be sufficient. The only other thing is the bullet. Match grade bullets, while expensive, will give you better groups, but they are not suitable for hunting anything but varmints. Think 168 grain match bullets for up to 600 yards, 175 grain Matchkings for over 600. For a hunting bullet, use 165 grain bullets. The .308 loves 'em. A 165 grain bullet will kill any game in North America you care to hunt. IMR4064 is one of the powders to use. Varget has a good reputation too, but I've never used it myself.

June 7, 2007, 06:05 AM	#4
boltgun71 Senior Member Join Date: January 4, 2006 Location: Pennsylvania Posts: 547	I use standard RCBS dies for my .308 and they have worked fine. I dont know what you consider match grade accuracy but I have gotten a few 1/4" groups(3 shots) at 100yds with mine and 1/2-3/4 MOA(3 or 5 shots) or better depending on bullet type has been the standard with it. Like what was said earlier I think being meticulous is the key. I weigh each powder charge individually and measure each round to make sure bullet seating/OAL is the same and so on with the other steps. Consistency is key in my book.

June 7, 2007, 07:06 AM	#5
Walkalong Senior Member Join Date: May 30, 2007 Location: Al. Posts: 196	Redding Competition dies or Forster Bench Rest dies will do just fine. After that it is bullet selection and load development.

June 7, 2007, 07:50 AM	#6
WCW Senior Member Join Date: March 6, 2007 Posts: 132	I have several sets of RCBS dies and they have worked fine for years, but any dies I purchase in the future will be Hornady dies. The Hornady elliptical expander button is a lot smoother going through the case necks following resizing. I don’t think you can go wrong with either brand.

June 7, 2007, 09:08 AM	#7
Clark Senior Member Join Date: December 4, 1999 Location: WA, the ever blue state Posts: 4,678	I have Wilson, Redding "S", Forster, Lee, RCBS, Hornady, Lyman, and some old obscure brands. I prefer to use: 1) Forster full length sizers honed out to my neck specification at the Forster factory for $10 2) Forster sliding sleeve seater die But if a guy really knows what he is doing, he can load sub moa ammo with cheap old RCBS dies: 1) De prime in a separate step. 2) Remove the expander ball 3) Lube only the outside of the case 4) Full length size, but adjust the die until the should is pushed back .001" 5) Square and chamfer the inside of the neck. 6) Seat in three steps with 120 degrees of rotation 7) Seat long so the bullet touches the lands. 8) Shoot only on days with no wind Bart Bobbit shoots groups 1/4 the size of mine with old RCBS sizers with the necks lapped out.

June 7, 2007, 09:20 AM	#8
brickeyee Senior Member Join Date: December 29, 2004 Posts: 3,351	Try plain old RCBS dies first and see if the gun has any other problems. More advanced methods are only likely to be productve if everything else is correct.