Primer pocket...

Sixer · March 12, 2009, 03:22 AM

Ok, this kinda sucks... I tumbled, deprimed, and sized around 500 pieces of .223 brass, only to find that the little primer ring things decided to stay in the primer pockets. I thought I was ready to prime these cases, but the primers won't fit due to the rings in the pocket. How the heck do I get these things out so I can fit the primers in the case?

I'm new at this, so I apologize for the newb question

Thanks in advance.

wwmkwood · March 12, 2009, 07:34 AM

That ringy thing is the crimp used on military brass, search for crimp removal. I use the RCBS swag kit some ream it and some use a Dillon tool.

robfromga · March 12, 2009, 07:51 AM

Sounds like the military crimp. You have several options from a 10 dollar hand tool to a 100 dillon super swage. If its only a couple hundred and you wont have any more than go the cheap route. But more than that then a proper tool will make life more better

You should be able to do 200ish in less than a hr with the super swage, will take longer and way more hand sttrength with a hand tool. Its also my opion the the super swage is easier on the brass.

http://www.dillonprecision.com/conte...wage_600_parts

Dingoboyx · March 12, 2009, 07:57 AM

The military cant risk having a problem with misfires so their ammo has the primer crimped for added insurance they cant jump out. Some have 2 flash holes with a bridge too, coz they use different types of primers with no anvil built in. (Evidently the bridge acts as the anvil) so check for this too. Sometimes the bridge makes it hard or impossible to deprime with a lee type pin de primer. Like wwmkwood said, tools are available to ream off the crimps and you might have to drill the bridge out (so you have a normal single flash hole). I have heard of people reaming the primer pocket with a drill bit, but if you can get the right tool, would be better.

My advice, stay away from ex military brass (unless you have lots of time to fiddle with it to get it useable) no matter how cheap it seems

Muzza

darkgael · March 12, 2009, 08:15 AM

If you are doing a few, go to the hardware store and get a countersink drill bit. There are number of different types, you want the simplest (like the single end high speed bit listed here http://www.mcmaster.com/#countersink-drill-bits/=ywpmb). You'll have to be careful. remove just the "ringy" thing but it'll work. You can even use it by hand.
Pete

PCJim · March 12, 2009, 09:28 AM

What Dingo is referring to are cases designed for Berdan type primers. They are common outside the US, ie Australia. Boxer style primers are the standard in the US.

Also look at the Hornady primer pocket reamer, available at MidwayUSA and other sites. It is of the correct diminsions to leave you with a perfect pocket with a slight bevel when used. It can be chucked into a variable speed drill and used on a low rpm setting (lockable setting helps!) to facilitate reaming large quantities of brass.

Superhornet · March 12, 2009, 09:52 AM

One of the best units is a combination top press mounted swager and primer tool from CH. Works like a champ, comes with small and large primer rams and will push aside the crimp....very fast....IMHO

Sixer · March 12, 2009, 10:45 AM

Well just when you think your'e all set to go... Crapola.

Ok, well it looks like I need to hit up the hardware store, because I'm out of money to spend on more reloading stuff at the moment

I appreciate the help guys.

I should have mentioned that this is PMC Bronze .223 brass. Not military AFAIK... The best part is that I've still got another 600 unfired rounds. Of course I was planning on reloading it at some point

Anyone want to buy some PMC Bronze .223 ?

robfromga · March 12, 2009, 12:01 PM

I'll give ya 25 bucks for the brass, shipped to 30813.

The PMC brass is good, not great but good. Ive got some thats on its 6th reload

It is all crimped

Dont know how far away you are, but I'll swage it for you and send it back if you want to work something out, beats the crap out of reaming 1000 cases buy hand. You'll go nuts after 200

that and if you take out too much with a drill bit the case is screwed, too little and the primers wont seat or they seat sideways....ask me I know

Dingoboyx · March 12, 2009, 12:04 PM

My advice would be not to feel bad or stoopid or something. I am guessing you got it cheap? Just enjoy shooting your 600 you have ready to go, stash the leftovers in a box and file in the to do section of your reloading bunker, and buy some good brass to reload. When you win lotto, get all the right gear and re load them then (you probably wont need to, you will be able to buy an ammo factory then

) Just do what we have all done and mark it up to experience. Remember, a great bargain of cheap ammo, is probably cheap for good reason! The old saying.... if its too good to be true, it probably is!

Oh, and slap whoever sold it to you without filling you in on the downside next time you see them (unless they are bigger than you

Muzza

robfromga · March 12, 2009, 02:54 PM

good advice Dingo...while not the best PMC is far far from a lemon

flashhole · March 12, 2009, 03:02 PM

I just use a large diameter drill bit and turn them by hand until the crimp is removed. An RCBS deburring tool will work too. It takes a little time but it works well. I then use an EJS primer pocket uniformer to finish them out.

Dingoboyx · March 12, 2009, 03:28 PM

Just saying that there is easier brass to reload. If he has the $ for the right tools, and time to do it, re load away

Muzza

Sixer · March 12, 2009, 03:55 PM

rob,
Thank you for the offer... I'm gonna have to pass since I'm short on cash and (sadly enough

) I probably have plenty of time to kill with more reloading chores.

Dingo,
Thanks for the advice. I bought a case of this PMC in August of '08 for $325 shipped... I had never really considered reloading at the time, but I kept most of the brass anyway. The ammo has been great for plinking and the brass looks great, aside from the primer pockets.

Lesson learned for sure! I think I will go the cheap route with a counter-sink drill bit and see how that works. Better yet, maybe I can get 2 drill bits and just con my GF into "helping" me out in her spare time

JR3149 · March 13, 2009, 01:14 AM

Any of you simply "cutting" the military crimp out of your .223 brass? I've been using a VLD (made by both RCBS and Lyman) inside debur tool and placing it inside the primer pocket. I chuck it on the end of my cordless drill and in 10 seconds or less...the military crimp is GONE!

Is anybody else doing this? It's WAY easier than swaging. Any disadvantages?

dardascastbullets · March 13, 2009, 05:46 AM

Hi Sixer!

I recommend the Wilson primer pocket reamer for your particular primer pocket size. The reamer has a contour that removes the military crimp and forms a very smooth round contour at the mouth of the pocket simulating the original commercial primer pocket. There isn't a separate ring formed as the crimp is actually cut away in small chips. I used the Wilson Primer Pocket Reamer exclusively on all my rifle brass when I purchased new brass. It's a great tool kills two birds with one stone and gives a high quality primer pocket whereby primers are inserted very smoothly and snug.

I trust that this information will help you.

kraigwy · March 13, 2009, 08:10 AM

Geeees dont sell the brass, hang on to it until you can buy a RCBS (or other) pocket swedger.

If you want to load a few before you can afford the swadger, dig out your pocket knife and ream a few.

When I was a kid just out on my own, the first rifle I started loading for when I moved out was '06 military brass to be used in a Model '95 Winchester. I had zero dollars. A bit of suplus power and some bullets. I also had a lee reloader, (the kind you used a hammer for sizing). I also had a pocket knife to ream the cases. Primitive but it allowed me to eat.

I cant beleive anyone old enough to think about reloading dosnt have a pocket knife.

Sixer · March 13, 2009, 12:04 PM

Quote:

I trust that this information will help you.

Yes sir, it will... Thanks

Quote:

Geeees dont sell the brass, hang on to it until you can buy a RCBS (or other) pocket swedger.

If you want to load a few before you can afford the swadger, dig out your pocket knife and ream a few.

No plans to sell it... Last night I tried using a cordless drill and bit just slightly larger than the pocket. It took about 2 seconds and that military crimp was gone. Well not completely gone, but gone enough to comfortably fit a primer into the pocket. 1 down 500 to go... this actually shouldn't take all that long.

PCJim · March 13, 2009, 03:36 PM

Just be careful that you do not remove too much brass. Those primers need to be held in place when fired......

March 12, 2009, 03:22 AM	#1
Sixer Senior Member Join Date: April 16, 2008 Location: Missouri Posts: 1,891	Primer pocket... Ok, this kinda sucks... I tumbled, deprimed, and sized around 500 pieces of .223 brass, only to find that the little primer ring things decided to stay in the primer pockets. I thought I was ready to prime these cases, but the primers won't fit due to the rings in the pocket. How the heck do I get these things out so I can fit the primers in the case? I'm new at this, so I apologize for the newb question Thanks in advance. __________________ Hopp Custom Leather <------ click for HOLSTER awesomeness!! -There is no theory of evolution... Just a list of creatures Chuck Norris has allowed to live.

March 12, 2009, 07:57 AM	#4
Dingoboyx Senior Member Join Date: March 7, 2009 Location: South East Queensland, Australia Posts: 1,513	The problem with buying ex millitary brass, unfortunately for us The military cant risk having a problem with misfires so their ammo has the primer crimped for added insurance they cant jump out. Some have 2 flash holes with a bridge too, coz they use different types of primers with no anvil built in. (Evidently the bridge acts as the anvil) so check for this too. Sometimes the bridge makes it hard or impossible to deprime with a lee type pin de primer. Like wwmkwood said, tools are available to ream off the crimps and you might have to drill the bridge out (so you have a normal single flash hole). I have heard of people reaming the primer pocket with a drill bit, but if you can get the right tool, would be better. My advice, stay away from ex military brass (unless you have lots of time to fiddle with it to get it useable) no matter how cheap it seems Muzza __________________ Muzza If you cant blind them with brilliance, Baffle them with BS Be alert...... there is a shortage of LERTs

March 12, 2009, 08:15 AM	#5
darkgael Senior Member Join Date: February 9, 2006 Location: Homes in Brooklyn, NY and in Pennsylvania. Posts: 5,473	Drill bit If you are doing a few, go to the hardware store and get a countersink drill bit. There are number of different types, you want the simplest (like the single end high speed bit listed here http://www.mcmaster.com/#countersink-drill-bits/=ywpmb). You'll have to be careful. remove just the "ringy" thing but it'll work. You can even use it by hand. Pete __________________ “Auto racing, bull fighting, and mountain climbing are the only real sports ... all others are games.” Ernest Hemingway ... NRA Life Member

March 12, 2009, 10:45 AM	#8
Sixer Senior Member Join Date: April 16, 2008 Location: Missouri Posts: 1,891	Well just when you think your'e all set to go... Crapola. Ok, well it looks like I need to hit up the hardware store, because I'm out of money to spend on more reloading stuff at the moment I appreciate the help guys. I should have mentioned that this is PMC Bronze .223 brass. Not military AFAIK... The best part is that I've still got another 600 unfired rounds. Of course I was planning on reloading it at some point Anyone want to buy some PMC Bronze .223 ? __________________ Hopp Custom Leather <------ click for HOLSTER awesomeness!! -There is no theory of evolution... Just a list of creatures Chuck Norris has allowed to live.

March 12, 2009, 12:04 PM	#10
Dingoboyx Senior Member Join Date: March 7, 2009 Location: South East Queensland, Australia Posts: 1,513	We've all bought a lemon at some stage My advice would be not to feel bad or stoopid or something. I am guessing you got it cheap? Just enjoy shooting your 600 you have ready to go, stash the leftovers in a box and file in the to do section of your reloading bunker, and buy some good brass to reload. When you win lotto, get all the right gear and re load them then (you probably wont need to, you will be able to buy an ammo factory then ) Just do what we have all done and mark it up to experience. Remember, a great bargain of cheap ammo, is probably cheap for good reason! The old saying.... if its too good to be true, it probably is! Oh, and slap whoever sold it to you without filling you in on the downside next time you see them (unless they are bigger than you Muzza __________________ Muzza If you cant blind them with brilliance, Baffle them with BS Be alert...... there is a shortage of LERTs

March 12, 2009, 07:34 AM	#2
wwmkwood Senior Member Join Date: December 24, 2008 Location: Kansas Posts: 110	That ringy thing is the crimp used on military brass, search for crimp removal. I use the RCBS swag kit some ream it and some use a Dillon tool.

March 12, 2009, 07:51 AM	#3
robfromga Senior Member Join Date: January 9, 2009 Location: Augusta, Ga Posts: 240	Sounds like the military crimp. You have several options from a 10 dollar hand tool to a 100 dillon super swage. If its only a couple hundred and you wont have any more than go the cheap route. But more than that then a proper tool will make life more better You should be able to do 200ish in less than a hr with the super swage, will take longer and way more hand sttrength with a hand tool. Its also my opion the the super swage is easier on the brass. http://www.dillonprecision.com/conte...wage_600_parts

March 12, 2009, 09:28 AM	#6
PCJim Senior Member Join Date: July 11, 2008 Location: FL Posts: 570	What Dingo is referring to are cases designed for Berdan type primers. They are common outside the US, ie Australia. Boxer style primers are the standard in the US. Also look at the Hornady primer pocket reamer, available at MidwayUSA and other sites. It is of the correct diminsions to leave you with a perfect pocket with a slight bevel when used. It can be chucked into a variable speed drill and used on a low rpm setting (lockable setting helps!) to facilitate reaming large quantities of brass.

March 12, 2009, 09:52 AM	#7
Superhornet Senior Member Join Date: March 24, 2005 Location: florida Posts: 292	One of the best units is a combination top press mounted swager and primer tool from CH. Works like a champ, comes with small and large primer rams and will push aside the crimp....very fast....IMHO

March 12, 2009, 12:01 PM	#9
robfromga Senior Member Join Date: January 9, 2009 Location: Augusta, Ga Posts: 240	I'll give ya 25 bucks for the brass, shipped to 30813. The PMC brass is good, not great but good. Ive got some thats on its 6th reload It is all crimped Dont know how far away you are, but I'll swage it for you and send it back if you want to work something out, beats the crap out of reaming 1000 cases buy hand. You'll go nuts after 200 that and if you take out too much with a drill bit the case is screwed, too little and the primers wont seat or they seat sideways....ask me I know

March 12, 2009, 02:54 PM	#11
robfromga Senior Member Join Date: January 9, 2009 Location: Augusta, Ga Posts: 240	good advice Dingo...while not the best PMC is far far from a lemon

March 12, 2009, 03:02 PM	#12
flashhole Senior Member Join Date: February 9, 2005 Location: Owego, NY Posts: 2,000	I just use a large diameter drill bit and turn them by hand until the crimp is removed. An RCBS deburring tool will work too. It takes a little time but it works well. I then use an EJS primer pocket uniformer to finish them out. __________________ ,,, stupidity comes to some people very easily. 8/22/2017 my wife in a discussion about Liberals. Are you ready for civil war?

March 12, 2009, 03:28 PM	#13
Dingoboyx Senior Member Join Date: March 7, 2009 Location: South East Queensland, Australia Posts: 1,513	I'm not bagging PMC guys Just saying that there is easier brass to reload. If he has the $ for the right tools, and time to do it, re load away Muzza __________________ Muzza If you cant blind them with brilliance, Baffle them with BS Be alert...... there is a shortage of LERTs

March 12, 2009, 03:55 PM	#14
Sixer Senior Member Join Date: April 16, 2008 Location: Missouri Posts: 1,891	rob, Thank you for the offer... I'm gonna have to pass since I'm short on cash and (sadly enough ) I probably have plenty of time to kill with more reloading chores. Dingo, Thanks for the advice. I bought a case of this PMC in August of '08 for $325 shipped... I had never really considered reloading at the time, but I kept most of the brass anyway. The ammo has been great for plinking and the brass looks great, aside from the primer pockets. Lesson learned for sure! I think I will go the cheap route with a counter-sink drill bit and see how that works. Better yet, maybe I can get 2 drill bits and just con my GF into "helping" me out in her spare time __________________ Hopp Custom Leather <------ click for HOLSTER awesomeness!! -There is no theory of evolution... Just a list of creatures Chuck Norris has allowed to live.

March 13, 2009, 01:14 AM	#15
JR3149 Member Join Date: February 24, 2005 Location: Mankato, MN Posts: 41	Any of you simply "cutting" the military crimp out of your .223 brass? I've been using a VLD (made by both RCBS and Lyman) inside debur tool and placing it inside the primer pocket. I chuck it on the end of my cordless drill and in 10 seconds or less...the military crimp is GONE! Is anybody else doing this? It's WAY easier than swaging. Any disadvantages?

March 13, 2009, 05:46 AM	#16
dardascastbullets Senior Member Join Date: July 20, 2008 Location: Essexville, MI Posts: 164	Hi Sixer! I recommend the Wilson primer pocket reamer for your particular primer pocket size. The reamer has a contour that removes the military crimp and forms a very smooth round contour at the mouth of the pocket simulating the original commercial primer pocket. There isn't a separate ring formed as the crimp is actually cut away in small chips. I used the Wilson Primer Pocket Reamer exclusively on all my rifle brass when I purchased new brass. It's a great tool kills two birds with one stone and gives a high quality primer pocket whereby primers are inserted very smoothly and snug. I trust that this information will help you. __________________ Matt Dardas

March 13, 2009, 08:10 AM	#17
kraigwy Senior Member Join Date: June 16, 2008 Location: Wyoming Posts: 11,061	Geeees dont sell the brass, hang on to it until you can buy a RCBS (or other) pocket swedger. If you want to load a few before you can afford the swadger, dig out your pocket knife and ream a few. When I was a kid just out on my own, the first rifle I started loading for when I moved out was '06 military brass to be used in a Model '95 Winchester. I had zero dollars. A bit of suplus power and some bullets. I also had a lee reloader, (the kind you used a hammer for sizing). I also had a pocket knife to ream the cases. Primitive but it allowed me to eat. I cant beleive anyone old enough to think about reloading dosnt have a pocket knife. __________________ Kraig Stuart CPT USAR Ret USAMU Sniper School Distinguished Rifle Badge 1071

March 13, 2009, 03:36 PM	#19
PCJim Senior Member Join Date: July 11, 2008 Location: FL Posts: 570	Just be careful that you do not remove too much brass. Those primers need to be held in place when fired......