New changes to Az Gun Laws "No Dry Ice"

1ricochet · July 17, 2009, 07:22 PM

They have inserted a new clause stating that you cannot have "Dry Ice" near your weapon. Why would this be? I can't find anything on the web and hope someone might help. The bill was signed into law just a couple of days ago which also changed the law about brandishing your weapon if you are being threatened with physical or deadly harm (among other situations.

IZinterrogator · July 17, 2009, 07:26 PM

I saw that, too. I wasn't sure if I should laugh or cry about the stupidity of the people that we have decided to let represent us.

1ricochet · July 17, 2009, 07:57 PM

I read it 3 times LOL thinking I was missing something, but what really matters is the change to the brandishment ( if thats a word) conditions which was sorely needed (not to get off the subject) but I always thought Dry Ice turns to Vapor instantly under the extreme conditions of primer and exploding gunpowder *smile* I did kind of think that they might know something that I didn't. They probably saw some stupid movie and believed it, IMHO

Al Norris · July 17, 2009, 08:18 PM

Somebody please provide a link to this law.

Farmland · July 17, 2009, 08:32 PM

Dry ice bombs are illegal in Arizona, though I don't know what the connections to guns are.

Farmland · July 17, 2009, 08:40 PM

That is what the law pertains to, the dry ice bomb.

3. Manufacturing, possessing, transporting, selling or transferring a prohibited weapon, except that if the violation involves dry ice, a person commits misconduct involving weapons by knowingly possessing the dry ice with the intent to cause injury to or death of another person or to cause damage to the property of another person; or

Full law link

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2280653/posts

Farmland · July 17, 2009, 08:41 PM

Ok some people might not know what a dry ice bomb is.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dry_ice_bomb

kozak6 · July 17, 2009, 09:21 PM

This is so totally bizarre.

I would also very much like to see a link to the article.

There appears to be two potential bills the original poster is talking about, neither of which have passed yet, to the best of my knowledge.

The first is HB 2439, and the other is SB 1243.

What gets me is that that neither bill has anything to do with dry ice, or dry ice bombs.

I call shenanigans. 1richochet, where on earth did you hear about this?

I don't think you (or I) can find anything on the internet about it because it just isn't so.

Al Norris · July 17, 2009, 09:48 PM

13-3102(A)(3) Manufacturing, possessing, transporting, selling or transferring a prohibited weapon, except that if the violation involves dry ice, a person commits misconduct involving weapons by knowingly possessing the dry ice with the intent to cause injury to or death of another person or to cause damage to the property of another person;

Don't see a problem here. You have dry ice? Mens rea attaches to any supposed offense - This means that a prosecutor must prove that you intended to make an dry ice bomb. No (assembled) bomb? No Intent? No crime.

Jason607 · July 17, 2009, 10:36 PM

In GA you can't carry an ice cream cone in your back pocket either, but thank goodness this law only applies on Sunday or I don't know what I would do. I'm not sure if you can carry the ice cream cone on Sunday if you keep it consealed or if you have a Ice Cream Cone Carry Permit and when I called to ask they just hung up on me.

Stupid laws are a direct reflection of the people who made them.

You know this law is the result of some dummy doing something stupid that resulted in something bad happeneing and of course politicians came to the rescue to make it all right.

Wildalaska · July 18, 2009, 12:13 AM

Why is the dry ice bomb law a stupid law?

WildcuriousAlaska TM

chris in va · July 18, 2009, 12:53 AM

I'm guessing they're really fun, just overly dangerous.

**Mike Irwin** · July 18, 2009, 08:58 AM

Must

make

dry

ice

bomb!

Dragon55 · July 18, 2009, 09:21 AM

OK so when are they gonna outlaw the Mentos in a Pepsi bottle "bomb" ?

Or the 'tater gun' ??

teeroux · July 18, 2009, 09:22 AM

How bout toilet bowl cleaner, aluminum foil, and empty plastic coke bottle law?:barf:

johnwilliamson062 · July 18, 2009, 10:33 AM

I was once acquainted with a guy who was disallowed from purchasing dry ice as part of his probation. In three states!!! He had some good stories and knowledge.

They are extremely dangerous at close range, very easy to make and the ingredients are very available. Hard to get exact timing on them, but easy to make them go off in 15-20 minutes.

You know that pocket behind the drivers seat you can put maps and such into? Check it everyday before you get in your car to commute to work

Don P · July 18, 2009, 10:54 AM

This may pertain to the lead post. The boys from Mythbusters did this in the desert. Dry ice and gunpowder and one hell of an BANG! It sure looked like one nasty bomb.

B. Lahey · July 18, 2009, 11:54 AM

Quote:

The boys from Mythbusters did this in the desert. Dry ice and gunpowder and one hell of an BANG!

That was thermite, not gunpowder.

Quote:

In GA you can't carry an ice cream cone in your back pocket either...

Stupid laws are a direct reflection of the people who made them.

Not a stupid law exactly, just meant to prevent a very specific crime. Think about it, it's about horse thievery without the use of ropes or anything else incriminating. A horse will follow you anywhere on its own if you have an icecream cone in your back pocket.

Probably happened a few times and they coudn't do anything about it under the existing law.

rampage841512 · July 18, 2009, 01:56 PM

Quote:

Why is the dry ice bomb law a stupid law?

Because it is an unnecessary restriction on individual freedom.

Wildalaska · July 18, 2009, 02:17 PM

Quote:

Because it is an unnecessary restriction on individual freedom.

Really? Can you tell me how it is a restriction on individual freedom?

WildorshallisuspectwehavelittlemorethansloganeeringhereAlaska ™

johnwilliamson062 · July 18, 2009, 05:29 PM

Guys, this is obviously aimed at eliminating dry ice bullets...
Geeesh, some slow thinkers on here...

Old Grump · July 18, 2009, 05:46 PM

Friend of mine was a coach for the Chicago Fire soccer team. He came home one day and found his son in the hospital blinded because some low life planted a dry ice bomb and he took the blast in his face. Devastated my friend, he had a nervous break down and never coached again. Wouldn't leave home and leave his son unattended anymore. Those bombs are not funny.

Farmland · July 18, 2009, 09:25 PM

One thing to seriously consider when thinking about dry ice. Bombs which do not explode are a major safety problem. They cannot be left, yet cannot be safely approached.

Because dry ice bombs are so dangerous, in some areas possession of these devices is a felony.

Make one of these in a glass container and you have a very effective IED.

Denver News

DENVER -- Teens may think making dry ice bombs are fun, but police warn they are dangerous and anyone caught with such a device could face felony charges.

**tyme** · July 18, 2009, 09:32 PM

Quote:

Why is the dry ice bomb law a stupid law?

WildcuriousAlaska TM

You're saying that existing laws against harming people do not criminalize the act of making a dry ice bomb and using it in a way that hurts someone?

By the time they get done passing specific laws for every single possible weapon variant, the criminal code will stretch from here to the moon.

Next up: vinegar and baking soda.

Farmland · July 18, 2009, 09:47 PM

I think that the dry ice bomb is not really a gun related part of the law for Arizona. I didn't take the time to read or understand the entire context of the law.

I think any type of a bomb should be considered a felony. Maybe there could be better wording to the extent that any type of bomb, explosive device made is illegal regardless of what material is used.

You know the government they think they are elected to pass laws. I often thought how nice it would be if we could go four years with no new laws.

July 17, 2009, 07:22 PM	#1
1ricochet Junior Member Join Date: July 16, 2009 Posts: 7	New changes to Az Gun Laws "No Dry Ice" They have inserted a new clause stating that you cannot have "Dry Ice" near your weapon. Why would this be? I can't find anything on the web and hope someone might help. The bill was signed into law just a couple of days ago which also changed the law about brandishing your weapon if you are being threatened with physical or deadly harm (among other situations. Last edited by 1ricochet; July 17, 2009 at 07:24 PM. Reason: spelling

July 17, 2009, 07:26 PM	#2
IZinterrogator Senior Member Join Date: November 8, 2004 Location: Prescott Valley, AZ Posts: 2,457	I saw that, too. I wasn't sure if I should laugh or cry about the stupidity of the people that we have decided to let represent us. __________________ "If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen!” - Samuel Adams

July 18, 2009, 08:58 AM	#13
Mike Irwin Staff Join Date: April 13, 2000 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 41,390	Must make dry ice bomb! __________________ "The gift which I am sending you is called a dog, and is in fact the most precious and valuable possession of mankind" -Theodorus Gaza Baby Jesus cries when the fat redneck doesn't have military-grade firepower.

July 18, 2009, 09:21 AM	#14
Dragon55 Senior Member Join Date: March 15, 2009 Location: East Tennessee Posts: 811	OK so when are they gonna outlaw the Mentos in a Pepsi bottle "bomb" ? Or the 'tater gun' ?? __________________ sailing ... A way to spend lots of money and go real S L O W Last edited by Dragon55; July 18, 2009 at 09:21 AM. Reason: more info

July 18, 2009, 10:54 AM	#17
Don P Senior Member Join Date: December 17, 2005 Location: Swamp dweller Posts: 6,187	This may pertain to the lead post. The boys from Mythbusters did this in the desert. Dry ice and gunpowder and one hell of an BANG! It sure looked like one nasty bomb. __________________ *NRA Life Member, NRA Chief Range Safety Officer, NRA Certified Pistol Instructor,, USPSA & Steel Challange NROI Range Officer, ICORE Range Officer, ,MAG 40 Graduate* *As you are, I once was, As I am, You will be.*

July 17, 2009, 07:57 PM	#3
1ricochet Junior Member Join Date: July 16, 2009 Posts: 7	I read it 3 times LOL thinking I was missing something, but what really matters is the change to the brandishment ( if thats a word) conditions which was sorely needed (not to get off the subject) but I always thought Dry Ice turns to Vapor instantly under the extreme conditions of primer and exploding gunpowder smile I did kind of think that they might know something that I didn't. They probably saw some stupid movie and believed it, IMHO

July 17, 2009, 08:18 PM	#4
Al Norris Moderator Emeritus Join Date: June 29, 2000 Location: Rupert, Idaho Posts: 9,660	Somebody please provide a link to this law.

July 17, 2009, 08:32 PM	#5
Farmland Senior Member Join Date: July 5, 2009 Posts: 869	Dry ice bombs are illegal in Arizona, though I don't know what the connections to guns are.

July 17, 2009, 08:40 PM	#6
Farmland Senior Member Join Date: July 5, 2009 Posts: 869	That is what the law pertains to, the dry ice bomb. 3. Manufacturing, possessing, transporting, selling or transferring a prohibited weapon, except that if the violation involves dry ice, a person commits misconduct involving weapons by knowingly possessing the dry ice with the intent to cause injury to or death of another person or to cause damage to the property of another person; or Full law link http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2280653/posts

July 17, 2009, 08:41 PM	#7
Farmland Senior Member Join Date: July 5, 2009 Posts: 869	Ok some people might not know what a dry ice bomb is. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dry_ice_bomb

July 17, 2009, 09:21 PM	#8
kozak6 Senior Member Join Date: June 16, 2005 Location: AZ Posts: 3,113	This is so totally bizarre. I would also very much like to see a link to the article. There appears to be two potential bills the original poster is talking about, neither of which have passed yet, to the best of my knowledge. The first is HB 2439, and the other is SB 1243. What gets me is that that neither bill has anything to do with dry ice, or dry ice bombs. I call shenanigans. 1richochet, where on earth did you hear about this? I don't think you (or I) can find anything on the internet about it because it just isn't so.

July 17, 2009, 09:48 PM	#9
Al Norris Moderator Emeritus Join Date: June 29, 2000 Location: Rupert, Idaho Posts: 9,660	13-3102(A)(3) Manufacturing, possessing, transporting, selling or transferring a prohibited weapon, except that if the violation involves dry ice, a person commits misconduct involving weapons by knowingly possessing the dry ice with the intent to cause injury to or death of another person or to cause damage to the property of another person; Don't see a problem here. You have dry ice? Mens rea attaches to any supposed offense - This means that a prosecutor must prove that you intended to make an dry ice bomb. No (assembled) bomb? No Intent? No crime.

July 17, 2009, 10:36 PM	#10
Jason607 Senior Member Join Date: September 2, 2006 Posts: 138	In GA you can't carry an ice cream cone in your back pocket either, but thank goodness this law only applies on Sunday or I don't know what I would do. I'm not sure if you can carry the ice cream cone on Sunday if you keep it consealed or if you have a Ice Cream Cone Carry Permit and when I called to ask they just hung up on me. Stupid laws are a direct reflection of the people who made them. You know this law is the result of some dummy doing something stupid that resulted in something bad happeneing and of course politicians came to the rescue to make it all right.

July 18, 2009, 12:13 AM	#11
Wildalaska Junior member Join Date: November 25, 2002 Location: In my own little weird world in Anchorage, Alaska Posts: 14,172	Why is the dry ice bomb law a stupid law? WildcuriousAlaska TM

July 18, 2009, 12:53 AM	#12
chris in va Senior Member Join Date: December 26, 2004 Location: Louisville KY Posts: 13,806	I'm guessing they're really fun, just overly dangerous.

July 18, 2009, 09:22 AM	#15
teeroux Senior Member Join Date: December 12, 2006 Posts: 1,512	How bout toilet bowl cleaner, aluminum foil, and empty plastic coke bottle law?:barf:

July 18, 2009, 10:33 AM	#16
johnwilliamson062 Junior member Join Date: May 16, 2008 Posts: 9,995	I was once acquainted with a guy who was disallowed from purchasing dry ice as part of his probation. In three states!!! He had some good stories and knowledge. They are extremely dangerous at close range, very easy to make and the ingredients are very available. Hard to get exact timing on them, but easy to make them go off in 15-20 minutes. You know that pocket behind the drivers seat you can put maps and such into? Check it everyday before you get in your car to commute to work

July 18, 2009, 05:29 PM	#21
johnwilliamson062 Junior member Join Date: May 16, 2008 Posts: 9,995	Guys, this is obviously aimed at eliminating dry ice bullets... Geeesh, some slow thinkers on here...

July 18, 2009, 05:46 PM	#22
Old Grump Member in memoriam Join Date: April 9, 2009 Location: Blue River Wisconsin, in Posts: 3,144	Friend of mine was a coach for the Chicago Fire soccer team. He came home one day and found his son in the hospital blinded because some low life planted a dry ice bomb and he took the blast in his face. Devastated my friend, he had a nervous break down and never coached again. Wouldn't leave home and leave his son unattended anymore. Those bombs are not funny. __________________ Good intentions will always be pleaded for any assumption of power. The Constitution was made to guard the people against the dangers of good intentions. There are men in all ages who mean to govern will, but they mean to govern. They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters. --Daniel Webster--

July 18, 2009, 09:25 PM	#23
Farmland Senior Member Join Date: July 5, 2009 Posts: 869	One thing to seriously consider when thinking about dry ice. Bombs which do not explode are a major safety problem. They cannot be left, yet cannot be safely approached. Because dry ice bombs are so dangerous, in some areas possession of these devices is a felony. Make one of these in a glass container and you have a very effective IED. Denver News DENVER -- Teens may think making dry ice bombs are fun, but police warn they are dangerous and anyone caught with such a device could face felony charges.

July 18, 2009, 09:47 PM	#25
Farmland Senior Member Join Date: July 5, 2009 Posts: 869	I think that the dry ice bomb is not really a gun related part of the law for Arizona. I didn't take the time to read or understand the entire context of the law. I think any type of a bomb should be considered a felony. Maybe there could be better wording to the extent that any type of bomb, explosive device made is illegal regardless of what material is used. You know the government they think they are elected to pass laws. I often thought how nice it would be if we could go four years with no new laws.