Coyotes: Are they always fair game? - Page 2

Ankeny · February 14, 2000, 12:17 AM

Well, I might as well step in it. In my neck of the woods it is socially acceptable to kill critters for sport, and I do just that. I call in and kill dozens of predators a year. In the off season I shoot gophers and prarie dogs for fun. I don't promote it, and I don't condemn those who disagree.

While riding snowmobiles several years ago I chased a coyote down and mashed him into the snow. While parked on top of him I got a .22 pistol out of my tank bag. I drove off of the critter and shot him as he struggled to his feet. At the time, a mountain pelt like that fetched about $120.00.

My snowmobiling partner rode over and immediately told me what a dispicable ass I was for doing such a terrible thing. He lectured me on how the poor old coyote was just trying to "earn a living" out in the mountains and wasn't hurting a thing. Interestingly enough, my riding partner is a hunter, having killed a deer and an elk that fall. Heck, I took him deer hunting. It just so happened that I crossed the moral and ethical line as far as he was concerned.

Maybe Clean Cut is just trying to define where that line is as far as his own hunting practices. Who knows...?

CleanCut · February 14, 2000, 12:50 AM

That's right. It's my right to define where I draw that line. It's called free speech. This isn't the Soviet Union. It's also my right to criticize anyone else who crosses that line. To me, the argument's about SPORTSMANSHIP. It has nothing to do with 'expertise', experience with guns (and WRITING ABOUT IT!), etc. As I said before and I'll say it again, it's OK to get rid of coyotes to protect farm and livestock. My view isn't threatening anybody's livelihood. I just made a point about people who go out in the desert and take pot shots at coyotes.
See: www.varminter.com/pics/picdetail.cfm?counter=37.

rbbrew · February 14, 2000, 02:38 AM

The pictures are worth a thousand words, but should we put them in the wrong mouth? Okay, so you twice posted a link to the same picture. A cute little coyote looks like it is asleep at the feet of some leering guy.

Just because the caption says something about the SoCal desert doesn't mean this guy drove his Land Rover 100 miles into the desert, put on snowshoes and hiked 20 miles over a mountain range, rappeled down a 150-foot cliff with his rifle between his teeth, then pot-shot this hapless coyote that was too far away from civilization to "bother" anyone.

The terrain reminds me very much of that surrounding my friend's house in Vista, CA. His house was (he moved to Carlsbad two years ago) also surrounded by about 500 houses on little quarter-acre lots. If you jumped the 7' solid wood fence in his back yard, you were in some of the meanest snake and coyote infested country between L.A. and Mexico, otherwise known as THE SOCAL DESERT.

Remember also that coyotes will cover anywhere from 2-5 miles per day to hunt, and the territory range of a single pack may be up to ten times that amount in square miles. In short, very few of them don't somehow butt up against human habitat.

I wouldn't suggest that you hunt ANYTHING if a picture brings you to conclusions that something excessive is going on with predator control. Wait 'till you start field dressing what you have killed, either for it's pelt or meat.

And there's nothing wrong with that approach, either. I took fifteen years off between deer hunts, just shooting at paper targets for fun, because I could not bring myself to shoot a deer the first couple of times I went. I helped my friends field dress and butcher theirs, but I just could not pull the trigger myself. This year I got one, and I'm writing this message with a bellyfull of wonderful venison steaks from earlier in the evening.

Bergie: Good to hear the mountain lion is expanding its range, also. This is another predator I would have a hard time shooting, though the cats tend to stay in the same areas, and the problem ones are easier to identify for elimination as a hazard. Sometimes it just has to be done...

Desertscout · February 14, 2000, 12:08 PM

It's a little known fact that crows are Federally protected. Some states have extremely generous seasons on them but they are protected nonethe less. Years ago in TX(I don't know how it is now), the lwa said something to the effect that you were not to kill crows unless they were damaging crops or somehow hurting something. The game wardens that I talked to said that they never saw a crow that wasn't doing something wrong or his way to do it so they didn't care how many or when you we shot them.

This brings us to coyotes. I have never seen one that wasn't on his way to do something he wasn't supposed to do and I kill most everyone that I see.

We sell guided varmint hunts here and coyotes are a big part of our living in the off season. We live in the middle of 30,000 acres of private land and there are also a lot of cattle on the land. So, that being the case, yes, coyotes are considered dangerous to the calves and to our domestic pets and farm animals but because they are so numerous, we also kill them for sport and profit. I just had two hunters here on the 12th and 13th for a coyote hunt. In the summer we add prairie dogs to the list.
I routinely shoot them right out my back door. If a cow dies, I drag it over within a couple hundred yards of the house and shoot coyotes off it when I don't have anything else to do.
Muleshoe, I agree with you about an ulterior motive here.
www.cia-g.com/~lzysbarc

------------------

Desertscout
[email protected]

"The very atmosphere of firearms anywhere and everywhere restrains evil interference -- they deserve a place of honor with all that is good."
--George Washington

CleanCut · February 14, 2000, 02:04 PM

Desertscount, sounds like a great vacation.

Never been to Texas, but I know I would thoroughly enjoy the hunting.

Coyotes? Oh, why not. I never was one of those bleeding heart types. Really. I just kind of felt sorry for that one picture of the animal on that rock.

Next time I'm in the desert, I'll take one out for you'all so you feel better.

CleanCut

Destructo6 · February 14, 2000, 05:02 PM

I live in the city and have had 3 (5+ possible) pets taken by Coyotes. I'll shoot them whenever I can, but since I can't shoot in the city, that means shooting them in the desert. I see it as keeping the populations low in their natural habitat so that they don't intrude on my natural habitat.

February 14, 2000, 12:17 AM	#26
Ankeny Senior Member Join Date: December 14, 1998 Location: Shoshoni, WY USA Posts: 556	Well, I might as well step in it. In my neck of the woods it is socially acceptable to kill critters for sport, and I do just that. I call in and kill dozens of predators a year. In the off season I shoot gophers and prarie dogs for fun. I don't promote it, and I don't condemn those who disagree. While riding snowmobiles several years ago I chased a coyote down and mashed him into the snow. While parked on top of him I got a .22 pistol out of my tank bag. I drove off of the critter and shot him as he struggled to his feet. At the time, a mountain pelt like that fetched about $120.00. My snowmobiling partner rode over and immediately told me what a dispicable ass I was for doing such a terrible thing. He lectured me on how the poor old coyote was just trying to "earn a living" out in the mountains and wasn't hurting a thing. Interestingly enough, my riding partner is a hunter, having killed a deer and an elk that fall. Heck, I took him deer hunting. It just so happened that I crossed the moral and ethical line as far as he was concerned. Maybe Clean Cut is just trying to define where that line is as far as his own hunting practices. Who knows...?

February 14, 2000, 12:50 AM	#27
CleanCut Member Join Date: February 3, 2000 Posts: 97	That's right. It's my right to define where I draw that line. It's called free speech. This isn't the Soviet Union. It's also my right to criticize anyone else who crosses that line. To me, the argument's about SPORTSMANSHIP. It has nothing to do with 'expertise', experience with guns (and WRITING ABOUT IT!), etc. As I said before and I'll say it again, it's OK to get rid of coyotes to protect farm and livestock. My view isn't threatening anybody's livelihood. I just made a point about people who go out in the desert and take pot shots at coyotes. See: www.varminter.com/pics/picdetail.cfm?counter=37.

February 14, 2000, 02:38 AM	#28
rbbrew Member Join Date: February 7, 2000 Posts: 45	The pictures are worth a thousand words, but should we put them in the wrong mouth? Okay, so you twice posted a link to the same picture. A cute little coyote looks like it is asleep at the feet of some leering guy. Just because the caption says something about the SoCal desert doesn't mean this guy drove his Land Rover 100 miles into the desert, put on snowshoes and hiked 20 miles over a mountain range, rappeled down a 150-foot cliff with his rifle between his teeth, then pot-shot this hapless coyote that was too far away from civilization to "bother" anyone. The terrain reminds me very much of that surrounding my friend's house in Vista, CA. His house was (he moved to Carlsbad two years ago) also surrounded by about 500 houses on little quarter-acre lots. If you jumped the 7' solid wood fence in his back yard, you were in some of the meanest snake and coyote infested country between L.A. and Mexico, otherwise known as THE SOCAL DESERT. Remember also that coyotes will cover anywhere from 2-5 miles per day to hunt, and the territory range of a single pack may be up to ten times that amount in square miles. In short, very few of them don't somehow butt up against human habitat. I wouldn't suggest that you hunt ANYTHING if a picture brings you to conclusions that something excessive is going on with predator control. Wait 'till you start field dressing what you have killed, either for it's pelt or meat. And there's nothing wrong with that approach, either. I took fifteen years off between deer hunts, just shooting at paper targets for fun, because I could not bring myself to shoot a deer the first couple of times I went. I helped my friends field dress and butcher theirs, but I just could not pull the trigger myself. This year I got one, and I'm writing this message with a bellyfull of wonderful venison steaks from earlier in the evening. Bergie: Good to hear the mountain lion is expanding its range, also. This is another predator I would have a hard time shooting, though the cats tend to stay in the same areas, and the problem ones are easier to identify for elimination as a hazard. Sometimes it just has to be done...

February 14, 2000, 12:08 PM	#29
Desertscout Member Join Date: February 5, 2000 Posts: 44	It's a little known fact that crows are Federally protected. Some states have extremely generous seasons on them but they are protected nonethe less. Years ago in TX(I don't know how it is now), the lwa said something to the effect that you were not to kill crows unless they were damaging crops or somehow hurting something. The game wardens that I talked to said that they never saw a crow that wasn't doing something wrong or his way to do it so they didn't care how many or when you we shot them. This brings us to coyotes. I have never seen one that wasn't on his way to do something he wasn't supposed to do and I kill most everyone that I see. We sell guided varmint hunts here and coyotes are a big part of our living in the off season. We live in the middle of 30,000 acres of private land and there are also a lot of cattle on the land. So, that being the case, yes, coyotes are considered dangerous to the calves and to our domestic pets and farm animals but because they are so numerous, we also kill them for sport and profit. I just had two hunters here on the 12th and 13th for a coyote hunt. In the summer we add prairie dogs to the list. I routinely shoot them right out my back door. If a cow dies, I drag it over within a couple hundred yards of the house and shoot coyotes off it when I don't have anything else to do. Muleshoe, I agree with you about an ulterior motive here. www.cia-g.com/~lzysbarc ------------------ Desertscout [email protected] "The very atmosphere of firearms anywhere and everywhere restrains evil interference -- they deserve a place of honor with all that is good." --George Washington

February 14, 2000, 02:04 PM	#30
CleanCut Member Join Date: February 3, 2000 Posts: 97	Desertscount, sounds like a great vacation. Never been to Texas, but I know I would thoroughly enjoy the hunting. Coyotes? Oh, why not. I never was one of those bleeding heart types. Really. I just kind of felt sorry for that one picture of the animal on that rock. Next time I'm in the desert, I'll take one out for you'all so you feel better. CleanCut

February 14, 2000, 05:02 PM	#31
Destructo6 Senior Member Join Date: March 18, 1999 Location: Nogales, AZ USA Posts: 4,000	I live in the city and have had 3 (5+ possible) pets taken by Coyotes. I'll shoot them whenever I can, but since I can't shoot in the city, that means shooting them in the desert. I see it as keeping the populations low in their natural habitat so that they don't intrude on my natural habitat.