Primer Backing Out

sahern · January 5, 2009, 02:26 AM

Hi from the land of the cold. It is around -40f out side right now. To cold to go out and shoot so I thought I would give rubber bullets a try in the garage. I have not reloaded in over twentyfive years and that was with my dad. I went out and brought a RCBS hand priming tool to prime the brass. Not sure what I want to go with for a reloading set up yet. The five or six rounds that I fired the primer back out. It was seated all the way as far as I could tell. What could have caused the primer to back out? Are the hand primers very good or should I stick with one on a press. Thanks for any information.

joneb · January 5, 2009, 02:49 AM

What cartridge are you loading ?
There is not enough recoil to force the shell back and reset the primer, try enlarging the flash hole to 1/8" .125"

sahern · January 5, 2009, 02:53 AM

Thanks it is a 44Mag. I was looking around on the internet and found the same answer. I will drill them out with a 1/8 drill bit and give it a try. Thanks for the info.

INGunGuy · January 5, 2009, 05:44 AM

Just make SURE you keep those .44mag shells separate from the rest and make sure they are MARKED in some way so they dont get into your supply of loadable .44mag brass. Would had to use one of those rubber bullet shells and end up loading it up for real.

INGunGuy

F. Guffey · January 5, 2009, 09:06 AM

Sahrern, NT 45 ACP, Federal and Winchester, use different sized flash holes, I have a flash hole gage that falls through the Federal case and indicates the Winchester flash hole is standard. If I loaded both case I doubt I could tell the difference, except, if the primer flash hole is a restriction and increases pressure on the primer, drilling the flash hole could would reduce restriction and increase pressure on the primer when fired, but, the primer by this time could be seated with the head of the case preventing it from backing.

As to why the primer backs out? A forum is not a good place to discuss head space, without head space the primer could not back out, then there is the question as to when the head space occured, before the round was chambered or after the case was chambered, if head space was created after the cartridge was chambered it is one or the other or both, that would be the impact of the firing pin (first), and the primer driving the case forward (second).

Head space before chambering? Instructions when followed will always results in a case that is sized 'at least' .005 shorter than a standard (go-gage)chamber, I have 30/06 chambers that are standard + .011, about .004 over a field gage, again, I apply the 'leaver policy' once the shoulder moves out, I 'leaver out' by not following instructions.

By drilling the flash hole, the primer pressure is reduced, something like gallons, pressure and flow, but the question could become: Did drilling the flash hole prevent the primer from backing out or did drilling the flash hole prevent the primer from sizing the case (shorter) and creating head space after the case was chambered?

F, Guffey

totalloser · January 5, 2009, 02:01 PM

Most normal loads will push the case back against the breech, or stretch the brass to touch the breech. Light loads, such as rubber bullet loads, will create enough pressure to seal the chamber by swelling the case mouth, holding the brass in place, but not enough to push the case back. So the pressure inside the primer pocket pushes the primer back.

With a normal load, the case head would be tight against the breech, and so the primer couldn't back out as it is contacting the breech.

If you are loading with really low pressure, the primer pushing out like .003" or something close to that, I think is normal. But +1 to not mixing them up. A light enough load could leave one in the barrel. And followed by a full load could scatter your sidearm BADLY. KABOOM! In fact, I'd watch out for leaving a bore obstruction, anyway.

The Lovemaster · January 5, 2009, 02:31 PM

Man am I glad I'm not back in Fairbanks right about now!

Scott, proud '86 UAF graduate

January 5, 2009, 02:26 AM	#1
sahern Junior Member Join Date: January 5, 2009 Location: Fairbanks, Alaska Posts: 3	Primer Backing Out Hi from the land of the cold. It is around -40f out side right now. To cold to go out and shoot so I thought I would give rubber bullets a try in the garage. I have not reloaded in over twentyfive years and that was with my dad. I went out and brought a RCBS hand priming tool to prime the brass. Not sure what I want to go with for a reloading set up yet. The five or six rounds that I fired the primer back out. It was seated all the way as far as I could tell. What could have caused the primer to back out? Are the hand primers very good or should I stick with one on a press. Thanks for any information.

January 5, 2009, 05:44 AM	#4
INGunGuy Senior Member Join Date: November 11, 2008 Location: Jeffersonville, Indiana Posts: 142	Just make SURE you keep those .44mag shells separate from the rest and make sure they are MARKED in some way so they dont get into your supply of loadable .44mag brass. Would had to use one of those rubber bullet shells and end up loading it up for real. INGunGuy __________________ Governments are instituted among men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed. That whenever any form of government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the right of the people to alter or abolish it, and to institute new government.

January 5, 2009, 02:01 PM	#6
totalloser Senior Member Join Date: October 19, 2007 Location: Fort Bragg, CA Posts: 679	Most normal loads will push the case back against the breech, or stretch the brass to touch the breech. Light loads, such as rubber bullet loads, will create enough pressure to seal the chamber by swelling the case mouth, holding the brass in place, but not enough to push the case back. So the pressure inside the primer pocket pushes the primer back. With a normal load, the case head would be tight against the breech, and so the primer couldn't back out as it is contacting the breech. If you are loading with really low pressure, the primer pushing out like .003" or something close to that, I think is normal. But +1 to not mixing them up. A light enough load could leave one in the barrel. And followed by a full load could scatter your sidearm BADLY. KABOOM! In fact, I'd watch out for leaving a bore obstruction, anyway. __________________ You only truly believe in freedom if you believe in the freedom of those you disagree.

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January 5, 2009, 02:49 AM	#2
joneb Senior Member Join Date: December 10, 2005 Location: Central , OR Posts: 1,888	What cartridge are you loading ? There is not enough recoil to force the shell back and reset the primer, try enlarging the flash hole to 1/8" .125"

January 5, 2009, 02:53 AM	#3
sahern Junior Member Join Date: January 5, 2009 Location: Fairbanks, Alaska Posts: 3	Thanks it is a 44Mag. I was looking around on the internet and found the same answer. I will drill them out with a 1/8 drill bit and give it a try. Thanks for the info.

January 5, 2009, 09:06 AM	#5
F. Guffey Senior Member Join Date: July 18, 2008 Posts: 7,249	Sahrern, NT 45 ACP, Federal and Winchester, use different sized flash holes, I have a flash hole gage that falls through the Federal case and indicates the Winchester flash hole is standard. If I loaded both case I doubt I could tell the difference, except, if the primer flash hole is a restriction and increases pressure on the primer, drilling the flash hole could would reduce restriction and increase pressure on the primer when fired, but, the primer by this time could be seated with the head of the case preventing it from backing. As to why the primer backs out? A forum is not a good place to discuss head space, without head space the primer could not back out, then there is the question as to when the head space occured, before the round was chambered or after the case was chambered, if head space was created after the cartridge was chambered it is one or the other or both, that would be the impact of the firing pin (first), and the primer driving the case forward (second). Head space before chambering? Instructions when followed will always results in a case that is sized 'at least' .005 shorter than a standard (go-gage)chamber, I have 30/06 chambers that are standard + .011, about .004 over a field gage, again, I apply the 'leaver policy' once the shoulder moves out, I 'leaver out' by not following instructions. By drilling the flash hole, the primer pressure is reduced, something like gallons, pressure and flow, but the question could become: Did drilling the flash hole prevent the primer from backing out or did drilling the flash hole prevent the primer from sizing the case (shorter) and creating head space after the case was chambered? F, Guffey

January 5, 2009, 02:31 PM	#7
The Lovemaster Senior Member Join Date: December 29, 2007 Location: Arizona Posts: 416	Man am I glad I'm not back in Fairbanks right about now! Scott, proud '86 UAF graduate