Help me choose pistol for IDPA

Kermit · December 2, 2001, 06:47 PM

Went to my 1st match and enjoyed myself. Not just from the comptetion, but also from the comraderie (sp?). My question is this...what pistol from these choices would work best? I shoot both equally well, but during the shoot, I noticed it might be easier to engage the multiple targets w/ a 9mm.
1. Beretta 92fs
2. USP 45

I ask because I still have to buy holster and unless I can find one that will fit both, I'd only like to purchase one setup.

Thanks

PUMC_TomG · December 2, 2001, 07:29 PM

Well some of the more "competitive" shooters may not agree with me here: but I believe that the primary function of IDPA is to help you gauge your performance and to provide entertainment with your carry pistol. I suggest you use what you carry everyday, or something close. This lets you know how you would most likely fare in an actual self-defense situation. Keep in mind these targets don't shoot back.
If you don't carry however and just want to have a lot of fun... I would go with the 9mm. Faster followup shots, very important to "neutralize" the target effectively (two shots per target). Also the Beretta is a very bomb-proof weapon. Not that the USP isn't... but there are TONS of add-ons modifications and spare parts around for that weapon. It IS the official sidearm of the U.S. Military (whether they like it or not.) That isn't a crack, but there are still those who say .45 all the way. I say 15 well placed shots are better than 8 well placed shots w/o reloading.

If 9mm will do the job, will a .45 make em deader?????

9x45 · December 2, 2001, 07:41 PM

For IDPA, a 9mm is all you need. There is no major/minor difference, only the 125K power floor. Personally, I would go with a G34. In your case, use the Beretta, otherwise you are in CDP class with your H&K, and you are competing with the short reset trigger's of the 1911 varients...
As far as carry guns, trigger time, along with being aggresive and focused is more important than shooting full house ammo in your carry gun.

Jim Watson · December 2, 2001, 09:00 PM

Beretta.
1. Less expensive ammo.
2. Less recoil.
3. Better, or at least improvable trigger pull.
4. Fobus or Uncle Mike's Kydex holster & mag pouch will give you a serviceable startup rig at low cost, I don't think they make them for USP yet.
5. It is a well developed system, apparently the key to reliable operation is good lubrication, I have read several recent reports of dry Berettas not working. (Also Glocks.)

I tried hard to like the USP - you CAN shoot a DA .45 in ESP, 9x45 - but never mastered the trigger and even bulkier grip than B92. The lightest loads that would function the USP were still heavier than 9mm, more expensive whether as ammo or reloading components, and it took a more expensive holster.
Still, it is an accurate, reliable, and apparently durable gun, if you can handle it as well.

What I shoot for ESP is a CZ 75 but agree that you should start with what you have. There is nothing really wrong with either. Kit up and come shoot with us.

Beretta Racer · December 2, 2001, 11:31 PM

Beretta Elite II 92G

Kermit · December 3, 2001, 08:20 PM

Beretta Racer,
The 'G' config is decock only, right? For whatever reason, at this moment in time, I feel more secure w/ the fs and the decock/safety lever. Just me

Unless I could be convinced otherwise...why is the 'G' config "better"?

garrettwc · December 3, 2001, 08:51 PM

Kermit, I shoot IDPA a little bit here in my area. The Beretta 92FS and variants have a strong following in Stock Service Pistol division that would be your bet. Ernie Langdon won two National Titles with his 92 Elite.

If you like it and get real serious you can send the 92F to Ernie for an action job and trigger work.

Here's the link to Ernie's website:

Langdon Tactical Technologies

Beretta Racer · December 4, 2001, 11:09 AM

Yes, the Elite II G is decock only, I guess because it was set up for competition and not as a carry gun. This way you will not accidentily leave the safety on at the start of a competition run, as is prone to happen occasionally. The first round is still D/A with all followups S/A.

Jim Watson · December 4, 2001, 02:14 PM

I don't know if the 92G designation was just the next after 92F and they got lucky, or if it was really meant to stand for Gendarmarie. Anyhow, the 92G with springloaded decocker was originally built for the French. So they would not get caught, as Jeff Cooper says, "with their dingus down."

Kind of like Glock 17. 17 shots? No, Gaston's 17th patent.

jason10mm · December 4, 2001, 03:37 PM

Use the .45. The bigger hole will help get points if the shot is right on the edge of the 0 zone. You can't load more than 10 in the mag anyway, so capacity is not an issue. Once you start using that Beretta you will understand why we say to get the decocker version. That safety is tough to reach, but maybe you have gorilla thumbs. For a real challenge shoot IDPA with a 5 shot revolver or a mouse gun. I'm dying to try it with a Kel-Tec P-32 or a NAA guardian sometime. Would love to transition to a back-up gun instead of reloading sometime as well. The gamer types would scream bloody murder, but it would be sooooo funny. LAter.

9x45 · December 5, 2001, 01:55 PM

What IDPA match do you go to where you are allowed to use 2 guns at?

Kermit · December 5, 2001, 04:19 PM

No, I'd just like to be able to rotate between my USP and my 92fs...you know, one match USP & the next my 92fs

AR15shooter · December 11, 2001, 12:22 PM

I prefer the Springfield 45 over my Beretta, the availability of GI mags is a plus due to the fact they are fairly inexpensive and reliable. I tend to alternate between guns though, as I carry both. Its always a good idea to be proficient with more than one weapon.

1911A1 fan · December 15, 2001, 11:36 AM

Boy I've read these post, and some of you sound kind of gamey! PLEASE lets not lose sight of what IDPA came about for. If you use a 92FS for SD then by all means use it in IDPA. If your SD gun is the HK then use that one. But shoot what you carry and carry what you shoot!

Kermit · December 15, 2001, 12:04 PM

I understand the application, but it is still a game. I will eventually use both guns in IDPA, but I want to learn the game and build some confidence in what I'm doing 1st. If I can do that easier and quicker w/ a 9mm or the 45, I want to start with that. After all, you perform better if you're confident in what you're doing, right?

Dr.Rob · December 20, 2001, 05:29 PM

Shoot whatever you feel comfy with.

You need a legal holster (its meant to be a strong side concealment rig)

You need magazine carriers/pouches.

You need magazines. 5 or so.

You need practice (a lot of it). You will no doubt at your first match feel humbled, woefully inadequate and slow. Pratice means dry fire and plenty of ammo. If you don't reload use the 9mm.

Oh yeah no matter what you shoot, it WILL eventually jam in competition, pratice your jam clearing.

Be safe and have fun.

Salt · December 27, 2001, 02:40 AM

Gamers should stick to IPSC, IDPA is for the gunfighters.

WESHOOT2 · December 27, 2001, 07:14 AM

Salt, so IDPA is NOT a 'gamer's' game? Really?

I'm so confused..........I don't know anyone who CARRIES a moon-clip revolver.......LOL

standby · December 27, 2001, 11:44 AM

Hello everybody, this the first reply I've posted on TFL, been lurking for quite a while now. There are a lot of very knowledgeable folks here, but I just had to reply to Salt on his above statement. I am a dedicated IPSC shooter who occasionally attends an IDPA match. Please don't take this as a flame as that is not how it is intended. True, there are a lot of "Gamers" in IPSC and I am proud to be one of them. Truth is, it is a game, it is fun and can be educational. Both GAMES help you realize how stress affects you mentally and physically, but neither should be misunderstood to fully prepare you for a real confrontation. That being said, is IDPA really intended for "Gunfighters"? Or for people who want to practice tactics with like minded individuals? I enjoy both, shoot an average of 3 IPSC matches per month and 3-4 IDPA matches per year and can honestly say, I don't know any gunfighters. But, I know a lot of IPSC shooters I wouldn't want to be in a gunfight against.

I know this strayed from the topic and for that I am sorry. As for the original question, shoot what you feel comfortable with.

RickB · December 27, 2001, 12:31 PM

Shoot the gun that you shoot best. That will help your confidence level, and your rate of improvement. Don't pass on shooting more than one gun, though. The HK can be shot in SSP and CDP (assuming it has the proper trigger module to allow cocked 'n' locked carry), so you might want to work with that one; mastering the trigger and controls of one gun that can be shot in two divisions will give you some flexibility. I've shot the Classifier Match with six different guns, and while I know which gun I shoot best, I sometimes shoot one of the others. I enjoy them all.

December 2, 2001, 06:47 PM	#1
Kermit Senior Member Join Date: February 6, 2001 Location: California Posts: 3,020	Help me choose pistol for IDPA Went to my 1st match and enjoyed myself. Not just from the comptetion, but also from the comraderie (sp?). My question is this...what pistol from these choices would work best? I shoot both equally well, but during the shoot, I noticed it might be easier to engage the multiple targets w/ a 9mm. 1. Beretta 92fs 2. USP 45 I ask because I still have to buy holster and unless I can find one that will fit both, I'd only like to purchase one setup. Thanks

December 11, 2001, 12:22 PM	#13
AR15shooter Member Join Date: March 5, 2001 Posts: 94	45 or 9mm I prefer the Springfield 45 over my Beretta, the availability of GI mags is a plus due to the fact they are fairly inexpensive and reliable. I tend to alternate between guns though, as I carry both. Its always a good idea to be proficient with more than one weapon.

December 15, 2001, 11:36 AM	#14
1911A1 fan Senior Member Join Date: August 26, 2001 Posts: 155	Oh no! Not a another IPSC? Boy I've read these post, and some of you sound kind of gamey! PLEASE lets not lose sight of what IDPA came about for. If you use a 92FS for SD then by all means use it in IDPA. If your SD gun is the HK then use that one. But shoot what you carry and carry what you shoot!

December 20, 2001, 05:29 PM	#16
Dr.Rob Staff Alumnus Join Date: July 28, 1999 Location: Denver Posts: 2,454	Shoot whatever you feel comfy with. You need a legal holster (its meant to be a strong side concealment rig) You need magazine carriers/pouches. You need magazines. 5 or so. You need practice (a lot of it). You will no doubt at your first match feel humbled, woefully inadequate and slow. Pratice means dry fire and plenty of ammo. If you don't reload use the 9mm. Oh yeah no matter what you shoot, it WILL eventually jam in competition, pratice your jam clearing. Be safe and have fun. __________________ You broke into the wrong Rec Room!

December 27, 2001, 07:14 AM	#18
WESHOOT2 Senior Member Join Date: February 20, 1999 Location: home on the range; Vermont (Caspian country) Posts: 14,324	THE CUTEST NAIVETE Salt, so IDPA is NOT a 'gamer's' game? Really? I'm so confused..........I don't know anyone who CARRIES a moon-clip revolver.......LOL __________________ . "all my ammo is mostly retired factory ammo"

December 2, 2001, 07:29 PM	#2
PUMC_TomG Senior Member Join Date: July 8, 2001 Posts: 249	Well some of the more "competitive" shooters may not agree with me here: but I believe that the primary function of IDPA is to help you gauge your performance and to provide entertainment with your carry pistol. I suggest you use what you carry everyday, or something close. This lets you know how you would most likely fare in an actual self-defense situation. Keep in mind these targets don't shoot back. If you don't carry however and just want to have a lot of fun... I would go with the 9mm. Faster followup shots, very important to "neutralize" the target effectively (two shots per target). Also the Beretta is a very bomb-proof weapon. Not that the USP isn't... but there are TONS of add-ons modifications and spare parts around for that weapon. It IS the official sidearm of the U.S. Military (whether they like it or not.) That isn't a crack, but there are still those who say .45 all the way. I say 15 well placed shots are better than 8 well placed shots w/o reloading. If 9mm will do the job, will a .45 make em deader?????

December 2, 2001, 07:41 PM	#3
9x45 Senior Member Join Date: January 14, 2000 Location: Southern California Posts: 1,089	For IDPA, a 9mm is all you need. There is no major/minor difference, only the 125K power floor. Personally, I would go with a G34. In your case, use the Beretta, otherwise you are in CDP class with your H&K, and you are competing with the short reset trigger's of the 1911 varients... As far as carry guns, trigger time, along with being aggresive and focused is more important than shooting full house ammo in your carry gun.

December 2, 2001, 09:00 PM	#4
Jim Watson Senior Member Join Date: October 25, 2001 Location: Alabama Posts: 18,535	Beretta. 1. Less expensive ammo. 2. Less recoil. 3. Better, or at least improvable trigger pull. 4. Fobus or Uncle Mike's Kydex holster & mag pouch will give you a serviceable startup rig at low cost, I don't think they make them for USP yet. 5. It is a well developed system, apparently the key to reliable operation is good lubrication, I have read several recent reports of dry Berettas not working. (Also Glocks.) I tried hard to like the USP - you CAN shoot a DA .45 in ESP, 9x45 - but never mastered the trigger and even bulkier grip than B92. The lightest loads that would function the USP were still heavier than 9mm, more expensive whether as ammo or reloading components, and it took a more expensive holster. Still, it is an accurate, reliable, and apparently durable gun, if you can handle it as well. What I shoot for ESP is a CZ 75 but agree that you should start with what you have. There is nothing really wrong with either. Kit up and come shoot with us.

December 2, 2001, 11:31 PM	#5
Beretta Racer Member Join Date: June 10, 2001 Location: Ft. Lauderdale/New Orleans Posts: 40	Beretta Elite II 92G

December 3, 2001, 08:20 PM	#6
Kermit Senior Member Join Date: February 6, 2001 Location: California Posts: 3,020	Beretta Racer, The 'G' config is decock only, right? For whatever reason, at this moment in time, I feel more secure w/ the fs and the decock/safety lever. Just me Unless I could be convinced otherwise...why is the 'G' config "better"?

December 3, 2001, 08:51 PM	#7
garrettwc Senior Member Join Date: October 3, 2001 Posts: 641	Kermit, I shoot IDPA a little bit here in my area. The Beretta 92FS and variants have a strong following in Stock Service Pistol division that would be your bet. Ernie Langdon won two National Titles with his 92 Elite. If you like it and get real serious you can send the 92F to Ernie for an action job and trigger work. Here's the link to Ernie's website: Langdon Tactical Technologies

December 4, 2001, 11:09 AM	#8
Beretta Racer Member Join Date: June 10, 2001 Location: Ft. Lauderdale/New Orleans Posts: 40	Yes, the Elite II G is decock only, I guess because it was set up for competition and not as a carry gun. This way you will not accidentily leave the safety on at the start of a competition run, as is prone to happen occasionally. The first round is still D/A with all followups S/A.

December 4, 2001, 02:14 PM	#9
Jim Watson Senior Member Join Date: October 25, 2001 Location: Alabama Posts: 18,535	I don't know if the 92G designation was just the next after 92F and they got lucky, or if it was really meant to stand for Gendarmarie. Anyhow, the 92G with springloaded decocker was originally built for the French. So they would not get caught, as Jeff Cooper says, "with their dingus down." Kind of like Glock 17. 17 shots? No, Gaston's 17th patent.

December 4, 2001, 03:37 PM	#10
jason10mm Senior Member Join Date: April 29, 2001 Location: San Antonio, Tx Posts: 230	Use the .45. The bigger hole will help get points if the shot is right on the edge of the 0 zone. You can't load more than 10 in the mag anyway, so capacity is not an issue. Once you start using that Beretta you will understand why we say to get the decocker version. That safety is tough to reach, but maybe you have gorilla thumbs. For a real challenge shoot IDPA with a 5 shot revolver or a mouse gun. I'm dying to try it with a Kel-Tec P-32 or a NAA guardian sometime. Would love to transition to a back-up gun instead of reloading sometime as well. The gamer types would scream bloody murder, but it would be sooooo funny. LAter.

December 5, 2001, 01:55 PM	#11
9x45 Senior Member Join Date: January 14, 2000 Location: Southern California Posts: 1,089	What IDPA match do you go to where you are allowed to use 2 guns at?

December 5, 2001, 04:19 PM	#12
Kermit Senior Member Join Date: February 6, 2001 Location: California Posts: 3,020	No, I'd just like to be able to rotate between my USP and my 92fs...you know, one match USP & the next my 92fs

December 15, 2001, 12:04 PM	#15
Kermit Senior Member Join Date: February 6, 2001 Location: California Posts: 3,020	I understand the application, but it is still a game. I will eventually use both guns in IDPA, but I want to learn the game and build some confidence in what I'm doing 1st. If I can do that easier and quicker w/ a 9mm or the 45, I want to start with that. After all, you perform better if you're confident in what you're doing, right?

December 27, 2001, 02:40 AM	#17
Salt Junior member Join Date: December 26, 2001 Posts: 673	Gamers should stick to IPSC, IDPA is for the gunfighters.

December 27, 2001, 11:44 AM	#19
standby Member Join Date: December 27, 2001 Posts: 27	Hello everybody, this the first reply I've posted on TFL, been lurking for quite a while now. There are a lot of very knowledgeable folks here, but I just had to reply to Salt on his above statement. I am a dedicated IPSC shooter who occasionally attends an IDPA match. Please don't take this as a flame as that is not how it is intended. True, there are a lot of "Gamers" in IPSC and I am proud to be one of them. Truth is, it is a game, it is fun and can be educational. Both GAMES help you realize how stress affects you mentally and physically, but neither should be misunderstood to fully prepare you for a real confrontation. That being said, is IDPA really intended for "Gunfighters"? Or for people who want to practice tactics with like minded individuals? I enjoy both, shoot an average of 3 IPSC matches per month and 3-4 IDPA matches per year and can honestly say, I don't know any gunfighters. But, I know a lot of IPSC shooters I wouldn't want to be in a gunfight against. I know this strayed from the topic and for that I am sorry. As for the original question, shoot what you feel comfortable with.

December 27, 2001, 12:31 PM	#20
RickB Senior Member Join Date: March 1, 2000 Location: Boise, ID Posts: 8,518	Shoot the gun that you shoot best. That will help your confidence level, and your rate of improvement. Don't pass on shooting more than one gun, though. The HK can be shot in SSP and CDP (assuming it has the proper trigger module to allow cocked 'n' locked carry), so you might want to work with that one; mastering the trigger and controls of one gun that can be shot in two divisions will give you some flexibility. I've shot the Classifier Match with six different guns, and while I know which gun I shoot best, I sometimes shoot one of the others. I enjoy them all.