9mm Subsonic...

danbrew · November 12, 1998, 10:56 PM

Ah yes, it's that age old question... What's your favorite load for a 9mm subsonic round?

Even better -- what's commercialy available? Not much, as I see it. The IMI stuff is generally considered too hot for the MP5 family and the American Eagle 147g gives you so much dirty blow back it's a hoot to shoot.

Any favorite loads?

I know that some folks are using 3.6g of VV N350 with a 147g FMJ round. Would love to hear your favorite load -- will load and practive the "reasonable" ones.

danbrew

Walt Welch · November 15, 1998, 12:33 AM

I suggest that you go to the following web site: http://www.shooters.com/gunlinks/index.htm

Click on Product Manufacturers (Non Firearm), and check out the powder and other component sites. Winchester has a load book which you can download. Hodgdon has an online reloading manual.

Happy surfing. Walt Welch NRA Life Member

**4V50 Gary** · November 24, 1998, 04:55 PM

Winchester 147 gr subsonic HP. Why? Cuz I can get it free

christian · December 24, 1998, 10:06 AM

My practice load for years has been the OUTSTANDING,ECONIMICAL and ACCURATE 147 lead flat point on top of 3.7 grains of AA #2.
1.100' minimum OAL. This load works in all 9mm's I've tried and is under 900fps. It is so accurate that I considered tattoing the load data on my arm! Leading is almost nonexistent because of the low velocity and hard-cast bullet. It burns completely and clean,even cycles my glock 19! Good Luck!

BillOH · December 25, 1998, 10:13 AM

I am in the process of testing several different powders for heavy bullet loads for 9mm. For practice and for IDPA I feel that a heavy bullet at the same power factor as a light bullet gives less twist and a softer felt recoil. That way I can practice longer before my hand and arm get too tired and sore to shoot. I am trying Bullseye, Win 231, Unique and AA#5. Any other suggestions? I want to make a power factor of 125 with a small margin for IDPA. BILL

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Walt Welch · December 26, 1998, 03:08 AM

BillOH; not being involved in organized competition shooting, I am not sure if your power factor of 125 corresponds with making 'major' in IPSC (bullet weight x velocity = 175,000).

If it is the same, then your attempt is doomed to failure. Accurate arms were unable to find such loads for the 9mm, and this was the case with the Lyman Pistol and Revolver Reloading Handbook, 2nd edition. I have never seen in print a load for the 9 x 19 that makes 'major,' and the Lyman handbook mentioned above lists only one load to make 'major' in the 9 x 21.

Be careful and safe. Walt

BillOH · December 26, 1998, 05:27 PM

Walt, thanks for your concern. This is the same as IPSC minor (bullet weight X velocity = 125,000) or the same as a 125 grain at 1000 fps. I like the softer feel of the heavy bullet at this power factor. I shot IPSC for many years and was always loading pretty hot and now that I can load lighter loads in IDPA I find there isn't as much info out there. Bill

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dundee · December 27, 1998, 02:34 AM

when I was loading for my wife to shoot IPSC I used 2 loads. 4.0 gr of 231 with a 125 cast lead bullet and 3.0/231 with a 158 cast rn bullet. Originally I used the 158 cast version, the wife was shooting a Colt 9MM. The 158 bullets were locally cast, cheap and easy to find. Then when I perverted her into the Glock 17 the 158 load sprayed all over the target. We went to the 125 gr load. Both make IPSC minor with no problem. I believe seating length was 1.08 or 1.1 for the 2 loads.

BillOH · December 27, 1998, 01:34 PM

dundee, Thanks for the info. What I am mainly interested in is a load for 147 grain lead or jacketed 9mm at a velocity of around 870 fps. The powders I have tried so far have given a very soft shooting load. Any personal experience out there? Bill

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cv0lv0g0 · June 1, 2008, 11:09 AM

rounds have to be under 800 fps to be sub sonic so you can also put less powder in the cartridge and you have more powder to spare.

SoS119 · August 23, 2008, 04:20 PM

You might want to do a little research before posting. While the medium (i.e. air, water, etc.) makes a pretty big difference on the speed of sound, let's assume we're talking about standard atmosphere.

Your premise of less powder is good, of course, but the numbers are way off.

Have a look at http://www.ebr-inc.net/articles_spee...und-chart.html

Basically, at zero degrees fahrenheit, you want the fastest round fired to be comfortably under 1050 or so fps. As the temperature increase, so does your margin for safety. e.g. 70 degrees Fahrenheit, Speed of Sound is approximately 1128 feet per second.

Take care all.

bluetopper · August 23, 2008, 09:57 PM

I just bought a new 9mm 1911 and I'm trying to work up a target load for a 147 lead flat point bullet myself.

If you're looking for 870fps...........that's what I'm getting with 2.7gr of Clays. I thought about bumping it up to 3.0 next time out.

Also try 3.9gr Power Pistol (900fps) up to 4.6gr (1020fps).

BTW...if a person is trying to make major with a 9mm, Power Pistol powder is the way to go. You get more vel. with less pressure than any other powder.

ctulanko · August 25, 2008, 07:09 AM

I like the Hornady 124gr FMJ with 3.5gr of Bullseye...they cycle well and shoot well.

frank_1947 · August 25, 2008, 05:32 PM

with a lead 147 WST 3.2 if your gun will cycle under 800 fps

cv0lv0g0 · March 16, 2009, 08:51 PM

here you go
In dry air at 20 °C (68 °F), the speed of sound is 330 meters per second 1,083 ft/s). This figure is heavily dependent on air temperature, but is nearly independent of air pressure or density.

average of speed needed to break this is 1,083 ft/s. 800 ft/s is close to min. i have more to say but im tired.

June 1, 2008, 11:09 AM	#10
cv0lv0g0 Junior Member Join Date: June 1, 2008 Location: wv Posts: 14	take less powder in round rounds have to be under 800 fps to be sub sonic so you can also put less powder in the cartridge and you have more powder to spare.

August 23, 2008, 04:20 PM	#11
SoS119 Junior Member Join Date: August 23, 2008 Posts: 1	misinformation on speed of sound You might want to do a little research before posting. While the medium (i.e. air, water, etc.) makes a pretty big difference on the speed of sound, let's assume we're talking about standard atmosphere. Your premise of less powder is good, of course, but the numbers are way off. Have a look at http://www.ebr-inc.net/articles_spee...und-chart.html Basically, at zero degrees fahrenheit, you want the fastest round fired to be comfortably under 1050 or so fps. As the temperature increase, so does your margin for safety. e.g. 70 degrees Fahrenheit, Speed of Sound is approximately 1128 feet per second. Take care all.

August 23, 2008, 09:57 PM	#12
bluetopper Senior Member Join Date: December 16, 2005 Location: Northeast TX Posts: 1,197	I just bought a new 9mm 1911 and I'm trying to work up a target load for a 147 lead flat point bullet myself. If you're looking for 870fps...........that's what I'm getting with 2.7gr of Clays. I thought about bumping it up to 3.0 next time out. Also try 3.9gr Power Pistol (900fps) up to 4.6gr (1020fps). BTW...if a person is trying to make major with a 9mm, Power Pistol powder is the way to go. You get more vel. with less pressure than any other powder. Last edited by bluetopper; August 24, 2008 at 10:26 AM.

March 16, 2009, 08:51 PM	#15
cv0lv0g0 Junior Member Join Date: June 1, 2008 Location: wv Posts: 14	sry for time of 1 year doing other things here you go In dry air at 20 °C (68 °F), the speed of sound is 330 meters per second 1,083 ft/s). This figure is heavily dependent on air temperature, but is nearly independent of air pressure or density. average of speed needed to break this is 1,083 ft/s. 800 ft/s is close to min. i have more to say but im tired.

November 12, 1998, 10:56 PM	#1
danbrew Member Join Date: October 27, 1998 Location: Chicago Posts: 72	Ah yes, it's that age old question... What's your favorite load for a 9mm subsonic round? Even better -- what's commercialy available? Not much, as I see it. The IMI stuff is generally considered too hot for the MP5 family and the American Eagle 147g gives you so much dirty blow back it's a hoot to shoot. Any favorite loads? I know that some folks are using 3.6g of VV N350 with a 147g FMJ round. Would love to hear your favorite load -- will load and practive the "reasonable" ones. danbrew

November 15, 1998, 12:33 AM	#2
Walt Welch Senior Member Join Date: November 3, 1998 Location: Alamo, CA Posts: 424	I suggest that you go to the following web site: http://www.shooters.com/gunlinks/index.htm Click on Product Manufacturers (Non Firearm), and check out the powder and other component sites. Winchester has a load book which you can download. Hodgdon has an online reloading manual. Happy surfing. Walt Welch NRA Life Member

November 24, 1998, 04:55 PM	#3
4V50 Gary Staff Join Date: November 2, 1998 Location: Colorado Posts: 21,840	Winchester 147 gr subsonic HP. Why? Cuz I can get it free

December 24, 1998, 10:06 AM	#4
christian Member Join Date: December 24, 1998 Location: florida,usa Posts: 24	My practice load for years has been the OUTSTANDING,ECONIMICAL and ACCURATE 147 lead flat point on top of 3.7 grains of AA #2. 1.100' minimum OAL. This load works in all 9mm's I've tried and is under 900fps. It is so accurate that I considered tattoing the load data on my arm! Leading is almost nonexistent because of the low velocity and hard-cast bullet. It burns completely and clean,even cycles my glock 19! Good Luck!

December 25, 1998, 10:13 AM	#5
BillOH Member Join Date: November 18, 1998 Location: OHIO Posts: 77	I am in the process of testing several different powders for heavy bullet loads for 9mm. For practice and for IDPA I feel that a heavy bullet at the same power factor as a light bullet gives less twist and a softer felt recoil. That way I can practice longer before my hand and arm get too tired and sore to shoot. I am trying Bullseye, Win 231, Unique and AA#5. Any other suggestions? I want to make a power factor of 125 with a small margin for IDPA. BILL ------------------

December 26, 1998, 03:08 AM	#6
Walt Welch Senior Member Join Date: November 3, 1998 Location: Alamo, CA Posts: 424	BillOH; not being involved in organized competition shooting, I am not sure if your power factor of 125 corresponds with making 'major' in IPSC (bullet weight x velocity = 175,000). If it is the same, then your attempt is doomed to failure. Accurate arms were unable to find such loads for the 9mm, and this was the case with the Lyman Pistol and Revolver Reloading Handbook, 2nd edition. I have never seen in print a load for the 9 x 19 that makes 'major,' and the Lyman handbook mentioned above lists only one load to make 'major' in the 9 x 21. Be careful and safe. Walt

December 26, 1998, 05:27 PM	#7
BillOH Member Join Date: November 18, 1998 Location: OHIO Posts: 77	Walt, thanks for your concern. This is the same as IPSC minor (bullet weight X velocity = 125,000) or the same as a 125 grain at 1000 fps. I like the softer feel of the heavy bullet at this power factor. I shot IPSC for many years and was always loading pretty hot and now that I can load lighter loads in IDPA I find there isn't as much info out there. Bill ------------------

December 27, 1998, 02:34 AM	#8
dundee Senior Member Join Date: December 6, 1998 Location: mytown,mi,usa Posts: 162	when I was loading for my wife to shoot IPSC I used 2 loads. 4.0 gr of 231 with a 125 cast lead bullet and 3.0/231 with a 158 cast rn bullet. Originally I used the 158 cast version, the wife was shooting a Colt 9MM. The 158 bullets were locally cast, cheap and easy to find. Then when I perverted her into the Glock 17 the 158 load sprayed all over the target. We went to the 125 gr load. Both make IPSC minor with no problem. I believe seating length was 1.08 or 1.1 for the 2 loads.

December 27, 1998, 01:34 PM	#9
BillOH Member Join Date: November 18, 1998 Location: OHIO Posts: 77	dundee, Thanks for the info. What I am mainly interested in is a load for 147 grain lead or jacketed 9mm at a velocity of around 870 fps. The powders I have tried so far have given a very soft shooting load. Any personal experience out there? Bill ------------------

August 25, 2008, 07:09 AM	#13
ctulanko Junior Member Join Date: July 18, 2008 Posts: 12	I like the Hornady 124gr FMJ with 3.5gr of Bullseye...they cycle well and shoot well.

August 25, 2008, 05:32 PM	#14
frank_1947 Member Join Date: August 9, 2008 Location: MO Posts: 76	with a lead 147 WST 3.2 if your gun will cycle under 800 fps