The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > The Conference Center > Law and Civil Rights

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old July 30, 2015, 07:23 AM   #1
steve4102
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 23, 2005
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 2,949
Docs v Glocks

The Federal Appeals could upheld FL HB-155 stopping Dr. from asking patients about firearms ownership and entering this information into a data base. They can still ask, but they must in "good Faith" believe that it is relevant to patient care and safety.

https://www.nraila.org/articles/2015...glocks-gun-law
steve4102 is offline  
Old July 30, 2015, 08:10 AM   #2
Aguila Blanca
Staff
 
Join Date: September 25, 2008
Location: CONUS
Posts: 18,433
Quote:
Originally Posted by Article
... Doctors will largely cease inquiring into and counseling on the topic of firearms, lest they be accused of crossing the line between providing life-saving preventive medical information and promoting an anti-firearm political agenda.
Color me naive, but I sort of think that's exactly the point of the law.

Doctors who have been brainwashed probably hold a sincere belief that keeping guns away from patients is a good idea, but that doesn't mean they (the doctors) have any professional/educational expertise on which to support that belief. Which means that for them to delve into firearms counseling is a professional boundary violation.

NRA firearms instructors should not give medical advice. Doctors should not give firearms advice. Simple.
Aguila Blanca is offline  
Old July 30, 2015, 10:03 AM   #3
Sharkbite
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 4, 2013
Location: Western slope of Colorado
Posts: 3,678
My Dr talks to me about reloading all the time. Just need more Doctors like him
Sharkbite is offline  
Old July 30, 2015, 11:03 AM   #4
bandaid1
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 9, 2013
Posts: 116
I've said this before, but there are very few legitimate reasons to ask about weapons when treating patients. In fact, if a patient verbalizes a desire to harm self or other, that fact is all that is needed. What tool or modality they intend to use matters little in most cases. The issue is that they intend some form of suicidal or homicidal intent, period.

I do not buy this counciling B.S. for safe firearm storage reason that is being given by some Doctors. Healthcare providers are NOT educated in firearms ownership/self defense and have no expertise in giving any advice on such matters, one way or the other. At best it's a boon doggle. It's a chargeable counseling with zero oversight. At worst it creates a searchable database of firearms owners, that would not be protected from State or Federal Government access, it won't. If fact, your healthcare insurer will also have access to such information as well, which in theory, could use such info to raise your rates as a person with a higher health risk.
bandaid1 is offline  
Old July 30, 2015, 05:29 PM   #5
oldandslow
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 2, 2007
Posts: 641
steve,

I'm a doc and I ask my patients about their guns all the time. I also ask them if they have primers or powder to trade and how their AR and scope are shooting and what they'll be shooting at the upcoming match. Since many of my patients are shooters it is a pleasant discussion for both of us.

best wishes- oldandslow
oldandslow is offline  
Old August 9, 2015, 04:58 PM   #6
bshefa
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 22, 2006
Location: Central Texas
Posts: 185
I am also a doc. Many of my patients discuss shooting and hunting with me. The question about firearms becomes medical and relevant in cases of suicidal ideation and attempted suicide. Part of the evaluation requires determining if the patient is a legitimate risk to him or herself by determining if they have the means or a plan for suicide. Often, this requires asking about firearms and ammunition. It does not require specific models or lists. I see this several times a week in an inpatient setting.

I don't see this being relevant to the overall health of a normal functioning individual.
bshefa is offline  
Old August 9, 2015, 05:02 PM   #7
Aguila Blanca
Staff
 
Join Date: September 25, 2008
Location: CONUS
Posts: 18,433
Quote:
Originally Posted by bshefa
Often, this requires asking about firearms and ammunition. It does not require specific models or lists. I see this several times a week in an inpatient setting.
Anything that "often" requires some action, automatically often does NOT require that same action. It certainly does not require a blank space on the patient record form that asks, "Are there firearms in the home?"
Aguila Blanca is offline  
Old August 9, 2015, 05:16 PM   #8
bshefa
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 22, 2006
Location: Central Texas
Posts: 185
I agree there doesn't need to be question on the review of systems for all patients concerning firearms. See the bottom sentence of my post.

If you are in the hospital or emergency room for psychiatric disease, especially leading to suicidal ideation, you better believe it is asked and documented. You are allowed to lie, of course. This is required of physicians wanting to circumvent civil suit for failing to properly address suicidal risk. I can't cite specific cases however the Texas Medical Jurisprudence study guide made this clear. I don't feel like digging it out of the attic to see which cases were cited.
bshefa is offline  
Old August 9, 2015, 05:44 PM   #9
FITASC
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 6, 2014
Posts: 6,432
None of my doc's business; plain and simple- he can ask, ans I will not reveal anything
__________________
"I believe that people have a right to decide their own destinies; people own themselves. I also believe that, in a democracy, government exists because (and only so long as) individual citizens give it a 'temporary license to exist'—in exchange for a promise that it will behave itself. In a democracy, you own the government—it doesn't own you."- Frank Zappa
FITASC is offline  
Old August 9, 2015, 07:22 PM   #10
doofus47
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 9, 2010
Location: live in a in a house when i'm not in a tent
Posts: 2,483
My doc doesn't panic about my kids if they're a bit over/under weight against the averages nor a bit taller or shorter than the national averages. He rifle hunts elk and never asks me about my guns.
I'm so sticking with him.
__________________
I'm right about the metric system 3/4 of the time.
doofus47 is offline  
Old August 9, 2015, 09:06 PM   #11
egor20
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 14, 2010
Location: Northern Virginia
Posts: 1,824
I shoot skeet with my doctor and also my priest, so I basically have all the bases covered.
__________________
Chief stall mucker and grain chef

Country don't mean dumb.
Steven King. The Stand
egor20 is offline  
Old August 9, 2015, 09:31 PM   #12
Spooler41
Member
 
Join Date: June 12, 2014
Location: Port Angeles ,Washington
Posts: 34
Since I've never been put under oath by a doctor, I've never felt compelled
to be totally honest about my firearms habits and inventory. When questioned
about firearms ownership a simple "No" usually handles the moment.

......................... Jack
__________________
sigpic26618_32.gif.jpeg
Spooler41 is offline  
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:17 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2021 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Page generated in 0.07302 seconds with 8 queries