reloading 40s&w

ron.brown255 · March 20, 2012, 07:20 PM

i am new to reloading and i am starting with 40 in my glock 22 and ruger sr40, what would you recommend for a accurate load i started with hornandy 185gr xtp bullets and blue dot powder at 7.8gr and am running a little bit of a firm crimp with all lee dies what should i change or just try out

bfoosh006 · March 21, 2012, 12:34 AM

Welll....No offense, but,.. I'd like more info, COAL, do you mean 180gr XTP?...... ( 185gr is usually .45ACP ), what primer? And honestly, I can't ever remember anyone saying how accurate Blue Dot is...

While this website is great, there are more specific ones out there...So , for a website that has a ton of handgun info go here..http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?showforum=4

again, no offense intended.

howlnmad · March 21, 2012, 12:47 AM

Dang, I hate when people start out with 40s. Such a high pressure round to begin with.

What manuals are you using to reference? Where did you come up with that charge weight? What primer? What overall length?

Lots of questions to be answered.

MEATSAW · March 21, 2012, 02:02 AM

40S&W is easy! In a Glock stay away from cast lead bullets and you'll be okay. Always start at the "starting" load or at least 10% below max load. I know a lot of people work up to max, but I actually find that for shooting targets there is no reason to max it out if you are getting good results with lower charges.

I use and recommend plated bullets and Accurate #5 powder in my H&K .40 (also a polygonal rifled barrel).

TMD · March 21, 2012, 03:57 AM

Quote:

Dang, I hate when people start out with 40s. Such a high pressure round to begin with.

No more pressure than 9mm.

serf 'rett · March 21, 2012, 03:06 PM

Welcome to the forum.

For an accurate load IN YOUR PISTOL, I would recommend you consult your reloading manuals for loading information, minimum to maximum. Load up a series of rounds starting at minimum and then in equal steps to the maximum you want to test. Make notes. Head out to the range. Set up the sandbags. Make notes. Shoot the targets. Make notes. Review the targets. Make notes. Pick the best groups and repeat the testing using the information from the best groups.

That's the best way to find an accurate load for YOUR PISTOL. The accurate load for MY pistol is most likely different. In fact, if you do thorough testing, you may find your two pistols “like” different loads from each other.

You may also want to note that any change in components will potentially have an effect on accuracy.

ron.brown255 · March 21, 2012, 08:50 PM

I use the new lee load data book and winchester primers and the oal for a batch that I made but yet to fire is 1.132

MEATSAW · March 21, 2012, 10:40 PM

1.132 is a bit long. I think most load data is for an oal of 1.125. My pistol likes an oal of 1.129 but you might run into function problems above 1.130. Check that it will cycle through the action.

ron.brown255 · March 22, 2012, 08:52 AM

My book says max oal is 1.135 and they do chamber just fine but for cycleing I don't know I'm going to make a couple diffrent batchs for this weekend

serf 'rett · March 22, 2012, 11:00 AM

I’m trying to figure out where you are getting your reloading information from. In your opening post you state your bullet is a Hornandy 185gr XTP. I assume you meant a Hornaday 180 grain XTP. This particular bullet is shown in my Lee manual; however, there is no load data for Blue Dot powder for that bullet. The only Blue Dot load data I see for a 180 grain bullet is shown under the chart for an 180 grain jacketed bullet. The Lee manual shows a minimum of 8.0 grain to a maximum of 8.8 grains of Blue Dot powder. My Lyman manual gives a much wider range of 7.3 grains min to 8.8 max at 1.115 OAL with jacketed hollow point.

My Lee manual shows that the minimum OAL is 1.125 inches for that particular load, so your length of 1.132 inches may be ok; however, you need to make sure the cartridge is headspacing off the case rim and not off the bullet.

My Lee manual also indicates that the Blue Dot powder is a compressed load. You need to be familiar with the effects of a compressed load. There is some possibility the bullet could creep forward.

I also noted you mentioned you were using a “firm” crimp. The 40S&W needs a taper “crimp” which I think of as being mostly removing the case mouth expansion. Do not over crimp this round. Too much crimp can cause case deformation resulting in the bullet actually becoming looser in the case. You do not want a loose bullet in this caliber, because the bullet can be set back during loading, causing an over pressure situation.

Axelwik · March 22, 2012, 11:42 AM

Just remember that reloading takes a lot of attention to detail. Do a lot of reading of reloading manuals and don't miss the details.

A few grains up or down can make a big difference when it comes to safety and performance of your loads. Everything from seating depth, to crimping, primer selection, to exact bullet and powder weights all make a big difference.

level10 · March 22, 2012, 08:15 PM

i am using win 231 for my 40 loads 5 grains works well 180 gr xtp

dsb1829 · March 22, 2012, 08:45 PM

Check benos forum, lots of good info and experience. Personally I use the g22 as my game gun, so I wasn't looking to load hot (quite the opposite). I mostly shoot AA#2 , which is on the fast end of medium pistol powders. I did load up some 180g Magnus lead TCBB bullets with BlueDot last weekend. Since I couldn't find lead data I used the offset between AA#7 and BD in 10mm to estimate a start load of 7-7.1g @ 1.115 COAL. I RAN 10RD 7.0, 10rd 7.3, and 10rd 7.5. Only the 7.5 was fast enough to get normal ballistics with respect to point of impact at 10 & 25yd.

I would venture to guess 7.8 is a fine start load considering the long COAL you are using.

FWIW, I amusing a Wilson Combat barrel.

jimbob86 · March 22, 2012, 09:19 PM

Quote:

Dang, I hate when people start out with 40s. Such a high pressure round to begin with.

Quote:

No more pressure than 9mm.

Both may be listed at 35K psi, but for some strange reason, I have never seen anyone blow up a 9mm ...... both guns that have gone Ka-boom on people I know (and I don't know that many people) were Glocks in .40 S&W, and both involved reloads..... one had an aftermarket barrel and one was stock.....

I know far more people who load for 9mm than for .40 ..... so it's just coincidence that my lyin' eyes tell me the same thing that I read on the Interwebz: .40 S&W+Reloads+Glock handgun is a recipe for firearm damage.

TRDFurgesson · March 28, 2012, 02:51 PM

Lyman calls for 5.6gr of Bullseye using a 180gr Sierra JHP's @ 1.115 OAL.
Alliant's Bullseye data calls for 5.5gr using 180gr Speer GDHP @ 1.120 OAL.

I would like to use ZERO 180gr TCFM FMJ's with 5.6gr of bullseye and a 1.120 OAL. I'm trying to formulate a load that is similar to my defense loads (federal HST 180gr JHP XM40HC) for IDPA practice.

Thanks in advance!

WESHOOT2 · March 29, 2012, 06:31 AM

--Power Pistol

--Ensure NO bullet setback; I load virtually all my used-brass 40 S&W by first sizing with a LEE 'U' undersized sizing die. This enhances case neck tension, the critical factor that secures the bullet from setback.

--Load as long as YOUR magazine and gun allow; 1.130"+/-.005" for 'standard' handguns.

--Work up SLOW; the high-pressure 40 S&W can turn on you in an instant (or .1g more powder).

--Highest-performance ammo gets loaded using 3N37.

Generic:
-sized sorted case
-CCI500
-OAL 1.130"+/-.005"
-5.2g Power Pistol (start)
-180g FP, lead, plated, or jacketed

vladan · March 29, 2012, 09:41 AM

Quote:

Quote:
Dang, I hate when people start out with 40s. Such a high pressure round to begin with.

Quote:
No more pressure than 9mm.

Both may be listed at 35K psi, but for some strange reason, I have never seen anyone blow up a 9mm ...... both guns that have gone Ka-boom on people I know (and I don't know that many people) were Glocks in .40 S&W, and both involved reloads..... one had an aftermarket barrel and one was stock.....

I know far more people who load for 9mm than for .40 ..... so it's just coincidence that my lyin' eyes tell me the same thing that I read on the Interwebz: .40 S&W+Reloads+Glock handgun is a recipe for firearm damage.

Problem is that most .40 guns are build on 9mm platform and because of that there is much less material in chamber walls and barrel.
Another reason why to learn to reload on .40S&W is a bad idea is here : http://greent.com/40Page/ammo/40/180gr.htm

dsb1829 · March 29, 2012, 01:12 PM

I would take that Green article with a grain of salt. It has been 10 years and 180g still hasn't been left behind due to "danger" with the load.

TRDFurgesson · March 29, 2012, 03:07 PM

Is anyone using bullseye? All I have is clays and bullseye. I load .40s&w, .45acp, and 9x19mm.

DrKyle1 · March 30, 2012, 11:16 PM

For my g35 competition setup I run 180 gr Cmj from Montana gold. & 4.1 gr tightgroup. I love it. Soft clean & accurate.

dsb1829 · March 31, 2012, 08:18 AM

Quote:

Is anyone using bullseye? All I have is clays and bullseye. I load .40s&w, .45acp, and 9x19mm.

Again, Brian Enos forum is a good resource. Check it out. Lot of folks use Clays for their light match loads in .40 and 45ACP.

I loaded up a workup yesterday with Clays (3.0, 3.2, 3.4 grains). I can't say that it impressed me much. It is softer than the AA#2 load I have been using, but it was not a slam dunk. My gun didn't like the 3.2g load, I had a couple FTF so something was up with that load and the stock timing (I don't want to have different springs for different loads). The 3.0 load was too slow and didn't have the same POI as std loads. The 3.4 was fine, but IMO it is getting too close to the high end of the pressure scale. I would have to meter/measure/trickle each load to ensure I didn't get overloads. That is not something I want in a round that I shoot 50-150rd a week.

Can't help on Bullseye, no experience there.

TMD · March 31, 2012, 10:26 AM

Quote:

For my g35 competition setup I run 180 gr Cmj from Montana gold. & 4.1 gr tightgroup. I love it. Soft clean & accurate.
__________________
Dr. Kyle

This used to be my pet load in my G35 as well until someone turned me on to Power Pistol. Now I load 6.0gn of PP with the same bullets and a COL of 1.130.

ron.brown255 · March 31, 2012, 05:31 PM

i dont know if its just my g22 or TMD glock but mine loves a 1.130 length so i you got a glock i would suggest trying it out if you havnt already and posting what you find out

lpspinner · April 1, 2012, 09:11 PM

Quote:

For my g35 competition setup I run 180 gr Cmj from Montana gold. & 4.1 gr tightgroup. I love it. Soft clean & accurate.
__________________
Dr. Kyle

I also use 4.1 gr of Titegroup for my G22, except I'm using Bear Creek 180gr molys and Xtreme Plated bullets.

After years of playing around, I've settled on Titegroup as my all around powder for 9mm, .40 & .45 when it comes to gaming. I also load it for my 9mm Mak.

Huskerguy · April 2, 2012, 10:07 PM

I run 4.2 grains of Titegroup, 180 grain Berry's bullet at 1.125 OAl. Nice shooting and accurate.

March 20, 2012, 07:20 PM	#1
ron.brown255 Junior Member Join Date: March 20, 2012 Posts: 8	reloading 40s&w i am new to reloading and i am starting with 40 in my glock 22 and ruger sr40, what would you recommend for a accurate load i started with hornandy 185gr xtp bullets and blue dot powder at 7.8gr and am running a little bit of a firm crimp with all lee dies what should i change or just try out

March 21, 2012, 02:02 AM	#4
MEATSAW Senior Member Join Date: May 1, 2009 Location: Burnet, TX Posts: 727	40S&W is easy! In a Glock stay away from cast lead bullets and you'll be okay. Always start at the "starting" load or at least 10% below max load. I know a lot of people work up to max, but I actually find that for shooting targets there is no reason to max it out if you are getting good results with lower charges. I use and recommend plated bullets and Accurate #5 powder in my H&K .40 (also a polygonal rifled barrel). __________________ Veteran OEF (2002) and OIF1 (2003) - US Army Member of the Burnet Gun Fighters, Inc. and of course the NRA Oregon State University alum -- Go Beavs!

March 21, 2012, 03:06 PM	#6
serf 'rett Senior Member Join Date: June 25, 2009 Location: Stuttgart, AR Posts: 1,569	Welcome to the forum. For an accurate load IN YOUR PISTOL, I would recommend you consult your reloading manuals for loading information, minimum to maximum. Load up a series of rounds starting at minimum and then in equal steps to the maximum you want to test. Make notes. Head out to the range. Set up the sandbags. Make notes. Shoot the targets. Make notes. Review the targets. Make notes. Pick the best groups and repeat the testing using the information from the best groups. That's the best way to find an accurate load for YOUR PISTOL. The accurate load for MY pistol is most likely different. In fact, if you do thorough testing, you may find your two pistols “like” different loads from each other. You may also want to note that any change in components will potentially have an effect on accuracy. __________________ A lack of planning on your part does not necessarily constitute an emergency on my part.

March 21, 2012, 10:40 PM	#8
MEATSAW Senior Member Join Date: May 1, 2009 Location: Burnet, TX Posts: 727	1.132 is a bit long. I think most load data is for an oal of 1.125. My pistol likes an oal of 1.129 but you might run into function problems above 1.130. Check that it will cycle through the action. __________________ Veteran OEF (2002) and OIF1 (2003) - US Army Member of the Burnet Gun Fighters, Inc. and of course the NRA Oregon State University alum -- Go Beavs!

March 22, 2012, 11:00 AM	#10
serf 'rett Senior Member Join Date: June 25, 2009 Location: Stuttgart, AR Posts: 1,569	I’m trying to figure out where you are getting your reloading information from. In your opening post you state your bullet is a Hornandy 185gr XTP. I assume you meant a Hornaday 180 grain XTP. This particular bullet is shown in my Lee manual; however, there is no load data for Blue Dot powder for that bullet. The only Blue Dot load data I see for a 180 grain bullet is shown under the chart for an 180 grain jacketed bullet. The Lee manual shows a minimum of 8.0 grain to a maximum of 8.8 grains of Blue Dot powder. My Lyman manual gives a much wider range of 7.3 grains min to 8.8 max at 1.115 OAL with jacketed hollow point. My Lee manual shows that the minimum OAL is 1.125 inches for that particular load, so your length of 1.132 inches may be ok; however, you need to make sure the cartridge is headspacing off the case rim and not off the bullet. My Lee manual also indicates that the Blue Dot powder is a compressed load. You need to be familiar with the effects of a compressed load. There is some possibility the bullet could creep forward. I also noted you mentioned you were using a “firm” crimp. The 40S&W needs a taper “crimp” which I think of as being mostly removing the case mouth expansion. Do not over crimp this round. Too much crimp can cause case deformation resulting in the bullet actually becoming looser in the case. You do not want a loose bullet in this caliber, because the bullet can be set back during loading, causing an over pressure situation. __________________ A lack of planning on your part does not necessarily constitute an emergency on my part.

March 21, 2012, 12:34 AM	#2
bfoosh006 Senior Member Join Date: February 17, 2009 Posts: 1,089	Welll....No offense, but,.. I'd like more info, COAL, do you mean 180gr XTP?...... ( 185gr is usually .45ACP ), what primer? And honestly, I can't ever remember anyone saying how accurate Blue Dot is... While this website is great, there are more specific ones out there...So , for a website that has a ton of handgun info go here..http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?showforum=4 again, no offense intended.

March 21, 2012, 12:47 AM	#3
howlnmad Senior Member Join Date: April 29, 2009 Location: Harriman Tn Posts: 424	Dang, I hate when people start out with 40s. Such a high pressure round to begin with. What manuals are you using to reference? Where did you come up with that charge weight? What primer? What overall length? Lots of questions to be answered.

March 21, 2012, 08:50 PM	#7
ron.brown255 Junior Member Join Date: March 20, 2012 Posts: 8	I use the new lee load data book and winchester primers and the oal for a batch that I made but yet to fire is 1.132

March 22, 2012, 08:52 AM	#9
ron.brown255 Junior Member Join Date: March 20, 2012 Posts: 8	My book says max oal is 1.135 and they do chamber just fine but for cycleing I don't know I'm going to make a couple diffrent batchs for this weekend

March 22, 2012, 11:42 AM	#11
Axelwik Senior Member Join Date: March 12, 2012 Location: Land of Enchantment Posts: 436	Just remember that reloading takes a lot of attention to detail. Do a lot of reading of reloading manuals and don't miss the details. A few grains up or down can make a big difference when it comes to safety and performance of your loads. Everything from seating depth, to crimping, primer selection, to exact bullet and powder weights all make a big difference.

March 22, 2012, 08:15 PM	#12
level10 Member Join Date: December 25, 2011 Posts: 32	40 load i am using win 231 for my 40 loads 5 grains works well 180 gr xtp Last edited by level10; March 22, 2012 at 08:22 PM.

March 22, 2012, 08:45 PM	#13
dsb1829 Member Join Date: March 28, 2011 Posts: 46	Check benos forum, lots of good info and experience. Personally I use the g22 as my game gun, so I wasn't looking to load hot (quite the opposite). I mostly shoot AA#2 , which is on the fast end of medium pistol powders. I did load up some 180g Magnus lead TCBB bullets with BlueDot last weekend. Since I couldn't find lead data I used the offset between AA#7 and BD in 10mm to estimate a start load of 7-7.1g @ 1.115 COAL. I RAN 10RD 7.0, 10rd 7.3, and 10rd 7.5. Only the 7.5 was fast enough to get normal ballistics with respect to point of impact at 10 & 25yd. I would venture to guess 7.8 is a fine start load considering the long COAL you are using. FWIW, I amusing a Wilson Combat barrel.

March 28, 2012, 02:51 PM	#15
TRDFurgesson Senior Member Join Date: July 4, 2011 Location: Ohio Posts: 115	Is this load too hot?? Lyman calls for 5.6gr of Bullseye using a 180gr Sierra JHP's @ 1.115 OAL. Alliant's Bullseye data calls for 5.5gr using 180gr Speer GDHP @ 1.120 OAL. I would like to use ZERO 180gr TCFM FMJ's with 5.6gr of bullseye and a 1.120 OAL. I'm trying to formulate a load that is similar to my defense loads (federal HST 180gr JHP XM40HC) for IDPA practice. Thanks in advance! __________________ Ohioans for conceal carry A Glock that is not maintained will last, a Glock that is maintained will last a long time, and a Glock that is well maintained will last longer than you will.

March 29, 2012, 06:31 AM	#16
WESHOOT2 Senior Member Join Date: February 20, 1999 Location: home on the range; Vermont (Caspian country) Posts: 14,324	40 S&W thoughts, advice, experience --Power Pistol --Ensure NO bullet setback; I load virtually all my used-brass 40 S&W by first sizing with a LEE 'U' undersized sizing die. This enhances case neck tension, the critical factor that secures the bullet from setback. --Load as long as YOUR magazine and gun allow; 1.130"+/-.005" for 'standard' handguns. --Work up SLOW; the high-pressure 40 S&W can turn on you in an instant (or .1g more powder). --Highest-performance ammo gets loaded using 3N37. Generic: -sized sorted case -CCI500 -OAL 1.130"+/-.005" -5.2g Power Pistol (start) -180g FP, lead, plated, or jacketed __________________ . "all my ammo is mostly retired factory ammo"

March 29, 2012, 01:12 PM	#18
dsb1829 Member Join Date: March 28, 2011 Posts: 46	I would take that Green article with a grain of salt. It has been 10 years and 180g still hasn't been left behind due to "danger" with the load.

March 29, 2012, 03:07 PM	#19
TRDFurgesson Senior Member Join Date: July 4, 2011 Location: Ohio Posts: 115	Is anyone using bullseye? All I have is clays and bullseye. I load .40s&w, .45acp, and 9x19mm. __________________ Ohioans for conceal carry A Glock that is not maintained will last, a Glock that is maintained will last a long time, and a Glock that is well maintained will last longer than you will.

March 30, 2012, 11:16 PM	#20
DrKyle1 Junior Member Join Date: September 24, 2007 Location: South Texas Posts: 8	For my g35 competition setup I run 180 gr Cmj from Montana gold. & 4.1 gr tightgroup. I love it. Soft clean & accurate. __________________ Dr. Kyle

March 31, 2012, 05:31 PM	#23
ron.brown255 Junior Member Join Date: March 20, 2012 Posts: 8	i dont know if its just my g22 or TMD glock but mine loves a 1.130 length so i you got a glock i would suggest trying it out if you havnt already and posting what you find out

April 2, 2012, 10:07 PM	#25
Huskerguy Senior Member Join Date: March 28, 2009 Location: Kansas Posts: 348	I run 4.2 grains of Titegroup, 180 grain Berry's bullet at 1.125 OAl. Nice shooting and accurate.