Bullseye and Dillon 650

tollys103079 · February 13, 2014, 10:05 PM

Ok so I got the new dillon set up, spent time going over everything and now I am getting the powder set. It is not measuring well at all. I am trying to throw 5 grains of Bullseye for my .45 cap and it is not happening. It ranges from 4.7 to 5.5 or so and on the rare occasion it throws nothing or very little. I give the adjustment the slightest touch and goes one way, but still cannot dial it in.

Any thoughts?

I was thinking about smoothing out the funnels or inside, but I am not sure where to start.

jepp2 · February 13, 2014, 10:18 PM

Some questions that may guide you.

- is your measure at least 1/2 full?
- did you throw at least 5 or more before you measured the first one?
- is your throw action consistent?
- is the powder funnel forcing the measure to a full stroke?

With Bullseye I would expect you to get no more than 0.1 gr +/- from your adjusted rate. But you need to let things settle out first. And after you make an adjustment, it takes a little while for that to happen.

I do polish the cone and bars, but it makes the most difference on more difficult to measure powders like Unique.

tollys103079 · February 13, 2014, 10:22 PM

Yes the powder measure is 3/4.

I am trying to keep the stroke consistent. I would say it is close.

I threw a lot of charges then checked 3 in a row / adjust / run a few and then check some more.

I just did some reading about using cases that were already belled and it says that it might not be engaging fully, but the bar is moving a full stroke.

I hope that doesn't cause and issue, because I have about 300 cases belled from before I bought it that i wanted to run through it.

Slamfire · February 14, 2014, 01:17 PM

On my Dillion 550B, I will throw 10, 20 throws and adjust based on the average weight of those 10, 20 charges.

Yes, you get charge to charge weight variations with thrown charges, and, it is not worth worrying about for Bullseye.

Quote:

and on the rare occasion it throws nothing or very little

That one is worth worrying about. You need to find why you are getting powder horn clogging. Did you clean the inside of the powder horn?

Rico567 · February 14, 2014, 01:32 PM

My experience with the Dillon powder measure is about the same as "jepp2." There will not be an immediate change to the new throw weight after you turn the adjustment bolt. Adjust - throw 5 - then weigh. If you're pretty close, then average the next 5-10 as "Slamfire" suggests. There is going to be some variation, but my experience with the Dillon measure (I load pretty much just Clays, Titegroup, and Hodgdon Universal) is that it will deliver ±.1 gr once it's dialed in.

NB: I discovered that the powder drop tube that slides up & down inside the die, even though it's nice and shiny and chrome-looking, will rust before just about anything else, to the point where I had to order a new one for .45 ACP. If by chance you've been rustproofing that with some kind of oil or grease when it's out of the press, be sure that you completely degrease that sucker before using it to reload again.

BigJimP · February 14, 2014, 02:40 PM

Couple of things...( but you should get 0.1 grain + or minus accuracy...

a. use anti static clothes dryer sheets....wipe the inside and outside of the powder measure..../ and throw a couple of them into the OEM powder container - and swirl the powder around a little...

If you have any static / powder granuales sticking to the sides of the Dillon powder measure / you have a static issue.

b. make sure you're not "splashing" powder out of the case as the shell holder rotates ( adjust it - to make sure it isn't snapping between stations).

c. go over the setup again on the powder measure...page 21 of instructions covers it / G. Station 2 - Adjustment of powder die/powder funnel....make sure the bar travels its full distance../ the white cube on the side of the measure must contact the powder measure body...

d. make sure your die is tight in the toolhead

e. make sure the "fail safe" rod is adjusted properly ...tighten the blue nut, so the spring is compressed a little when press handle is up. When you seat a primer - and you push the handle forward / make sure that spring compresses about 50%...

f. make sure your bench isn't bouncing ...and that your press is bolted tightly to bench. Some benches flex ...( 3/4" plywood may flex more than your realize )...so you might have to stiffen up your bench.

and if none of that works....try and find someone local, experienced with Dillon equipment to come over and give you a hand....and call Dillon and get their input....

But its a matter of all these little things usually....

tollys103079 · February 14, 2014, 05:10 PM

What is the white cube? I read that in the directions and thought it must be the powder bar because I do not see a white cube.

Also I am sure there is a static issue so I will wipe everything down with a dryer sheet, what do you mean by "oem" with the powder or when it is empty?

Thanks for helping

Steven

TATER · February 14, 2014, 05:41 PM

There is a square white piece of plastic on the side of the measure where the linkage and stuff goes back and forth.
The actuation rod and linkage have to be timed and/or adjusted.
I know you are excited but, slowdown and study, Read then look at the pictures and look back at the machine. Understand what going on and why.
You did clean all oils and stuff out of it right? And, You have the right combination of bars in the measure? After you get the measure mastered,
the next problem is getting the plate set juuusst right (Big Grin)

BigJimP · February 14, 2014, 05:43 PM

" OEM " -- an abbreviation, for Original Equipment Manufacturer....the bottle or container the powder came in. Point I was trying to make - is the plastic bottles the powder came in needs to be wiped in and out with the anti-static sheets ( and some sheets dropped into the bottle while powder is stored )...and I buy all my powder in either 4 lb or 8 lb kegs....so it sits around for at least 6 months or so....

White cube ....is on the right hand side of the powder measure...( as you look at the press - seated in front of it )....the block moves back and forth .../ so if its not moving far enough / it can be part of the problem. There is a spring on the 2 brass plates where you hook the fail safe rod thru .....that connects to a nut on the white cube....
---------
Maybe you don't have the fail safe rod installed correctly either...?? Maybe the powder measure is not tight on its die...??
-------
Point is, there is something significantly out of adjustment, or setup is wrong ...or you wouldn't be getting this much variation...
----------
Might want to consider sitting down with the manual...read the whole thing thru a couple of times again / then sit down in front of the press....and go thru each and every setup point in the manual ..(even the things you know you have done right ) ...and double check everything...

maybe you let a nut off of something...maybe you didn't snug a die down in the toolhead...maybe you're using the wrong charge bar in the powder measure.../ have you re-calibrated your scale....just go back thru all the basics....until you get this all figured out.

tollys103079 · February 14, 2014, 06:17 PM

Yes I cleaned it up as instructed. I imagine it is something small and until I get home to look at it I just get to read more and wonder. I have read about everything I can find now I just want to sit down with it tonight and go through it again. However tonight is a full moon and good snow so looks like it will wait until tomorrow. There are coyotes to find tonight.

LE-28 · February 14, 2014, 06:27 PM

God I'm glad I'm not the only one with a static problem.

See if your wife has any Static Guard and spray it in the hopper. Let it dry for about 10 minutes then fill it up and try it again.

It's works miracles with static problems in a measure. The fact that your press is new isn't helping any either. Once it gets a good coating of graphite inside the problem isn't quite a bad.

Don't loose faith, you have a good machine there.

salvadore · February 14, 2014, 08:36 PM

If you get completely stumped call Dillon.

mk75 · February 15, 2014, 11:38 PM

I have loaded over 10,000 rounds on my 650 using Unique. The only caliber I had "consistency" problems with was the .44 Mag. My advice would be to make sure you throw a few charges before you start reloading. Let the powder settle, or unsettle (I don't know), a bit.

tollys103079 · February 16, 2014, 02:20 PM

Well got it rolling last night a few learning curves, but 600 rounds done. It was awesome once I got it all dialed in. Ran out lead today, so I guess I am done loading the .45. Onto the .223,

Thanks for the help getting it running.

Steve

Shootest · February 17, 2014, 10:40 AM

Just a word of advice. When loading 223 you will need to pause at the top of the stroke to allow time for the powder to funnel through the small neck.
It’s a great press isn’t it?

tollys103079 · February 17, 2014, 02:01 PM

Yes I love the press. I think I have a lot more research to do before I start on the .223. I usually just sort my brass and do not mess with trimming. I just set everything aside that needs trimmed, but with the dillon I will eventually load it so I figured I should trim. Well had trimming is not for me at least not on the old RCBS trimmer.

So I am looking at the Dillon one that mounts in the press so I can deprive/size and trim in one round then clean them again and then run them all the way through.

However I am not dying to throw out 250 for a trimmer. So I am going at it slowly.

Plus loading this many I want to get a headspace gage and make sure everything is right. So I need to get it all figured out first.

Luckily I have plenty of rounds to burn up for now so i got some time to figure it out. If anyone has a tried and true method for the dillon I am listening. I read some old post lots of good stuff.

I also need to change powder as I have read varget and dillon do not play well together.

February 13, 2014, 10:05 PM	#1
tollys103079 Member Join Date: December 7, 2012 Posts: 36	Bullseye and Dillon 650 Ok so I got the new dillon set up, spent time going over everything and now I am getting the powder set. It is not measuring well at all. I am trying to throw 5 grains of Bullseye for my .45 cap and it is not happening. It ranges from 4.7 to 5.5 or so and on the rare occasion it throws nothing or very little. I give the adjustment the slightest touch and goes one way, but still cannot dial it in. Any thoughts? I was thinking about smoothing out the funnels or inside, but I am not sure where to start.

February 13, 2014, 10:18 PM	#2
jepp2 Senior Member Join Date: December 24, 2008 Location: Loveland, CO Posts: 1,476	Some questions that may guide you. - is your measure at least 1/2 full? - did you throw at least 5 or more before you measured the first one? - is your throw action consistent? - is the powder funnel forcing the measure to a full stroke? With Bullseye I would expect you to get no more than 0.1 gr +/- from your adjusted rate. But you need to let things settle out first. And after you make an adjustment, it takes a little while for that to happen. I do polish the cone and bars, but it makes the most difference on more difficult to measure powders like Unique. __________________ NRA Benefactor Life member

February 14, 2014, 01:32 PM	#5
Rico567 Senior Member Join Date: October 19, 2005 Posts: 162	My experience with the Dillon powder measure is about the same as "jepp2." There will not be an immediate change to the new throw weight after you turn the adjustment bolt. Adjust - throw 5 - then weigh. If you're pretty close, then average the next 5-10 as "Slamfire" suggests. There is going to be some variation, but my experience with the Dillon measure (I load pretty much just Clays, Titegroup, and Hodgdon Universal) is that it will deliver ±.1 gr once it's dialed in. NB: I discovered that the powder drop tube that slides up & down inside the die, even though it's nice and shiny and chrome-looking, will rust before just about anything else, to the point where I had to order a new one for .45 ACP. If by chance you've been rustproofing that with some kind of oil or grease when it's out of the press, be sure that you completely degrease that sucker before using it to reload again. __________________ "Dear reader, suppose you are a member of Congress. Now, further suppose you are an idiot. But I repeat myself." - Mark Twain

February 17, 2014, 10:40 AM	#15
Shootest Senior Member Join Date: February 9, 2011 Location: Just outside Cleveland, Ohio Posts: 722	Just a word of advice. When loading 223 you will need to pause at the top of the stroke to allow time for the powder to funnel through the small neck. It’s a great press isn’t it? __________________ The private ownership of firearms is an American Heritage. Anyone who disputes that is Anti-American and unpatriotic. NRA Life Member

February 13, 2014, 10:22 PM	#3
tollys103079 Member Join Date: December 7, 2012 Posts: 36	Yes the powder measure is 3/4. I am trying to keep the stroke consistent. I would say it is close. I threw a lot of charges then checked 3 in a row / adjust / run a few and then check some more. I just did some reading about using cases that were already belled and it says that it might not be engaging fully, but the bar is moving a full stroke. I hope that doesn't cause and issue, because I have about 300 cases belled from before I bought it that i wanted to run through it.

February 14, 2014, 02:40 PM	#6
BigJimP Senior Member Join Date: February 23, 2005 Posts: 13,195	Couple of things...( but you should get 0.1 grain + or minus accuracy... a. use anti static clothes dryer sheets....wipe the inside and outside of the powder measure..../ and throw a couple of them into the OEM powder container - and swirl the powder around a little... If you have any static / powder granuales sticking to the sides of the Dillon powder measure / you have a static issue. b. make sure you're not "splashing" powder out of the case as the shell holder rotates ( adjust it - to make sure it isn't snapping between stations). c. go over the setup again on the powder measure...page 21 of instructions covers it / G. Station 2 - Adjustment of powder die/powder funnel....make sure the bar travels its full distance../ the white cube on the side of the measure must contact the powder measure body... d. make sure your die is tight in the toolhead e. make sure the "fail safe" rod is adjusted properly ...tighten the blue nut, so the spring is compressed a little when press handle is up. When you seat a primer - and you push the handle forward / make sure that spring compresses about 50%... f. make sure your bench isn't bouncing ...and that your press is bolted tightly to bench. Some benches flex ...( 3/4" plywood may flex more than your realize )...so you might have to stiffen up your bench. and if none of that works....try and find someone local, experienced with Dillon equipment to come over and give you a hand....and call Dillon and get their input.... But its a matter of all these little things usually....

February 14, 2014, 05:10 PM	#7
tollys103079 Member Join Date: December 7, 2012 Posts: 36	What is the white cube? I read that in the directions and thought it must be the powder bar because I do not see a white cube. Also I am sure there is a static issue so I will wipe everything down with a dryer sheet, what do you mean by "oem" with the powder or when it is empty? Thanks for helping Steven

February 14, 2014, 05:41 PM	#8
TATER Senior Member Join Date: November 19, 2002 Location: Mississippi Posts: 963	There is a square white piece of plastic on the side of the measure where the linkage and stuff goes back and forth. The actuation rod and linkage have to be timed and/or adjusted. I know you are excited but, slowdown and study, Read then look at the pictures and look back at the machine. Understand what going on and why. You did clean all oils and stuff out of it right? And, You have the right combination of bars in the measure? After you get the measure mastered, the next problem is getting the plate set juuusst right (Big Grin)

February 14, 2014, 05:43 PM	#9
BigJimP Senior Member Join Date: February 23, 2005 Posts: 13,195	" OEM " -- an abbreviation, for Original Equipment Manufacturer....the bottle or container the powder came in. Point I was trying to make - is the plastic bottles the powder came in needs to be wiped in and out with the anti-static sheets ( and some sheets dropped into the bottle while powder is stored )...and I buy all my powder in either 4 lb or 8 lb kegs....so it sits around for at least 6 months or so.... White cube ....is on the right hand side of the powder measure...( as you look at the press - seated in front of it )....the block moves back and forth .../ so if its not moving far enough / it can be part of the problem. There is a spring on the 2 brass plates where you hook the fail safe rod thru .....that connects to a nut on the white cube.... --------- Maybe you don't have the fail safe rod installed correctly either...?? Maybe the powder measure is not tight on its die...?? ------- Point is, there is something significantly out of adjustment, or setup is wrong ...or you wouldn't be getting this much variation... ---------- Might want to consider sitting down with the manual...read the whole thing thru a couple of times again / then sit down in front of the press....and go thru each and every setup point in the manual ..(even the things you know you have done right ) ...and double check everything... maybe you let a nut off of something...maybe you didn't snug a die down in the toolhead...maybe you're using the wrong charge bar in the powder measure.../ have you re-calibrated your scale....just go back thru all the basics....until you get this all figured out.

February 14, 2014, 06:17 PM	#10
tollys103079 Member Join Date: December 7, 2012 Posts: 36	Yes I cleaned it up as instructed. I imagine it is something small and until I get home to look at it I just get to read more and wonder. I have read about everything I can find now I just want to sit down with it tonight and go through it again. However tonight is a full moon and good snow so looks like it will wait until tomorrow. There are coyotes to find tonight.

February 14, 2014, 06:27 PM	#11
LE-28 Senior Member Join Date: September 24, 2012 Location: North Carolina Posts: 759	God I'm glad I'm not the only one with a static problem. See if your wife has any Static Guard and spray it in the hopper. Let it dry for about 10 minutes then fill it up and try it again. It's works miracles with static problems in a measure. The fact that your press is new isn't helping any either. Once it gets a good coating of graphite inside the problem isn't quite a bad. Don't loose faith, you have a good machine there.

February 14, 2014, 08:36 PM	#12
salvadore Junior member Join Date: January 1, 2007 Location: Idaho Posts: 2,282	If you get completely stumped call Dillon.

February 15, 2014, 11:38 PM	#13
mk75 Junior Member Join Date: February 10, 2014 Posts: 7	I have loaded over 10,000 rounds on my 650 using Unique. The only caliber I had "consistency" problems with was the .44 Mag. My advice would be to make sure you throw a few charges before you start reloading. Let the powder settle, or unsettle (I don't know), a bit.

February 16, 2014, 02:20 PM	#14
tollys103079 Member Join Date: December 7, 2012 Posts: 36	Well got it rolling last night a few learning curves, but 600 rounds done. It was awesome once I got it all dialed in. Ran out lead today, so I guess I am done loading the .45. Onto the .223, Thanks for the help getting it running. Steve

February 17, 2014, 02:01 PM	#16
tollys103079 Member Join Date: December 7, 2012 Posts: 36	Yes I love the press. I think I have a lot more research to do before I start on the .223. I usually just sort my brass and do not mess with trimming. I just set everything aside that needs trimmed, but with the dillon I will eventually load it so I figured I should trim. Well had trimming is not for me at least not on the old RCBS trimmer. So I am looking at the Dillon one that mounts in the press so I can deprive/size and trim in one round then clean them again and then run them all the way through. However I am not dying to throw out 250 for a trimmer. So I am going at it slowly. Plus loading this many I want to get a headspace gage and make sure everything is right. So I need to get it all figured out first. Luckily I have plenty of rounds to burn up for now so i got some time to figure it out. If anyone has a tried and true method for the dillon I am listening. I read some old post lots of good stuff. I also need to change powder as I have read varget and dillon do not play well together.