Why Berdan primers on CCI Blazers?

June 27, 2000, 10:35 AM

I can think of two reasons:

1. It's cheaper than Boxer (hard to believe since Boxer is by far the industry standard)

2. It's to prevent nimrods from trying to reload them

Anyone know/have any opinions?

DOCSpanky · June 27, 2000, 10:39 AM

Anyone who would put blazers in a firearm they own is whacko IMHO!

I know some will take offense, but next to the 22LR commandos, Blazer guys are the worst at leaving their useless mess behind them!

------------------
I thought I'd seen it all, until a 22WMR spun a bunny 2 1/4 times in the air!

June 27, 2000, 11:22 AM

I've always been told it was because of your second idea. To keep idiots from trying to reload them. If they did and hurt themselves then they could sue CCI or Speer whatever company is the parent company.

Grayfox · June 27, 2000, 11:24 AM

Jeff,
The reason was to prevent people from trying to reload them. I use Blasers occasionally and have never had any problems with it.

Doc,
I see your point. Good idea to pack out your trash.

NJW · June 27, 2000, 11:39 AM

Two reasons:

1. The berdan primer is considerd by some to be a better ignition system because of the two flash holes. Don't know if it is true or not?

2. So idiots won't reload them. Acutally they used to make regular boxer primed blazers but they were primed with an odd sized primer. It was sized between a large and small primer and that way no one could reload them because you couldn't buy that size primer.

I worked at a commercial reloader when I was in college and every once in a while we would have a blazer case go across the 38 special machine and get loaded. I shot a few of those in my 357 revolver and they shot fine and the case split. I have reloaded blazer cases just to see if it is possible. The decapping pin breaks out the berdan anvil and you have a big jagged flash hole. I only tried it with light loads and just wanted to try it, I don't bother with it any more.

NJW in AZ

Sisco · June 27, 2000, 05:20 PM

DOCSpanky, you touched on my biggest complaint about Blazers, they're used up so people let 'em lie. Same thing goes for those who shoot up a case of milsurp 7.62x39 and leave them lying all over the place too.

solo · June 27, 2000, 06:17 PM

There was a CCI shell casing in my mixed brass I had from some range brass. My father started decaping the brass and picked up the CCI brass and snap, the decapping pin broke. I am very pissed at CCI, those commie's and their priming system.

**Mike Irwin** · June 27, 2000, 11:47 PM

Hey Solo,

You don't sort your range brass? It's not uncommon for a smaller case (.22, .32, or .380) to get lodged in a larger case. Same effect when depriming. Who's to blame then?

CCI Blazer is decent brass at a decent price. Were the cases brass, the ammo would be a lot more expensive, especially in the less popular calibers.

If it wasn't for the anti-reloading features, some idiot would reload the stuff, end up killing a gun or getting hurt, and then suing CCI for his own stupidity. Sad commentary on today's lawsuit society.

------------------
Beware the man with the S&W .357 Mag.
Chances are he knows how to use it.

Ruben Nasser · June 28, 2000, 12:21 AM

I think Blazers are good ammo, very clean and consistent. Teh reason they use berdan primers is to avoid reloading (they put a "NR" headstamp and tell it everywhere in the boxes). I have a few "idiot" friends that reloaded them, just using a sharpened decapper to punch the base, and then used a boxer primer and a normal pressure load. They work, but split after 2-3 loadings, don't do it!!

bfoster · June 28, 2000, 08:33 AM

NJW... A few experimenters with benchrest rifles have tried using Berdan primed brass. The results have shown no signifigant difference in group sizes when compared to Boxer primers. Trust me, if there were any "edge" to be gained, the use of Berdan primers would be universal in that sport- I once won a match by an aggregate which was only 0.0004" smaller than that of the second place finisher.

Bob

Turk · June 29, 2000, 11:04 AM

I think the reason as to why the Blazers use Berdan primers is all economics and marketing. The Blazers fit a niche in the market that gives non-reloaders economical priced ammo basically due to the aluminum cases.

If I remember right I think the Blazers are produced in Europe. (Maybe a Scandinavian country?). The Europeans use Berdan primers. Are they any better than a boxer primer who knows. I’m sure the Europeans will tell you they are better.

Berdan ammunition using brass cases can be reloaded. RCBS makes a deprimer tool. But to be quite frank it’s not work the trouble to reload Berdan primed cases.

Concerning reloading aluminum cases is it possible to reload? Yes, I did it years ago with 9mm Blazers but had to use boxer primers (just to see if it was possible).

You have to use a small punch to knock out the primer. If don’t have Berdan primers you’ll have to break off a small post that’s in the middle of the primer pocket so the boxer primer can be pressed in. Next is to resize the case minus the decapper assembly. Aluminum will resize. I’m quite sure you could also resize steel cases with the proper lubricant. I would think the steel case being resized with steel sizing die would wear the die very quickly.

MY ADVICE IS NOT TO reload the Blazer as there is really no reason with the available of brass cases. Another negative aspect maybe the strength of the aluminum case once fired then getting resized. DANGER cases splitting when fired I had a couple from the 50 I reloaded.

To me the Blazers are OK but I can reload and still save money. I agree with a couple previous posts that Blazers and AK /SKS shooters don’t tend to pick up their cases after a days shooting which leaves a mess.

You all have a good day.

Turk

[This message has been edited by Turk (edited June 29, 2000).]

June 27, 2000, 10:35 AM	#1
Jeff, CA Guest Posts: n/a	I can think of two reasons: 1. It's cheaper than Boxer (hard to believe since Boxer is by far the industry standard) 2. It's to prevent nimrods from trying to reload them Anyone know/have any opinions?

June 27, 2000, 10:39 AM	#2
DOCSpanky Senior Member Join Date: August 21, 1999 Location: Ashland City, TN Posts: 779	Anyone who would put blazers in a firearm they own is whacko IMHO! I know some will take offense, but next to the 22LR commandos, Blazer guys are the worst at leaving their useless mess behind them! ------------------ I thought I'd seen it all, until a 22WMR spun a bunny 2 1/4 times in the air!

June 27, 2000, 11:22 AM	#3
KilgorII Guest Posts: n/a	I've always been told it was because of your second idea. To keep idiots from trying to reload them. If they did and hurt themselves then they could sue CCI or Speer whatever company is the parent company.

June 27, 2000, 11:24 AM	#4
Grayfox Senior Member Join Date: December 17, 1998 Posts: 1,885	Jeff, The reason was to prevent people from trying to reload them. I use Blasers occasionally and have never had any problems with it. Doc, I see your point. Good idea to pack out your trash.

June 27, 2000, 11:39 AM	#5
NJW Senior Member Join Date: November 5, 1998 Location: SouthWest Posts: 204	Two reasons: 1. The berdan primer is considerd by some to be a better ignition system because of the two flash holes. Don't know if it is true or not? 2. So idiots won't reload them. Acutally they used to make regular boxer primed blazers but they were primed with an odd sized primer. It was sized between a large and small primer and that way no one could reload them because you couldn't buy that size primer. I worked at a commercial reloader when I was in college and every once in a while we would have a blazer case go across the 38 special machine and get loaded. I shot a few of those in my 357 revolver and they shot fine and the case split. I have reloaded blazer cases just to see if it is possible. The decapping pin breaks out the berdan anvil and you have a big jagged flash hole. I only tried it with light loads and just wanted to try it, I don't bother with it any more. NJW in AZ

June 27, 2000, 05:20 PM	#6
Sisco Senior Member Join Date: March 25, 1999 Location: KS Posts: 1,558	DOCSpanky, you touched on my biggest complaint about Blazers, they're used up so people let 'em lie. Same thing goes for those who shoot up a case of milsurp 7.62x39 and leave them lying all over the place too.

June 27, 2000, 06:17 PM	#7
solo Senior Member Join Date: August 30, 1999 Posts: 211	There was a CCI shell casing in my mixed brass I had from some range brass. My father started decaping the brass and picked up the CCI brass and snap, the decapping pin broke. I am very pissed at CCI, those commie's and their priming system.

June 27, 2000, 11:47 PM	#8
Mike Irwin Staff Join Date: April 13, 2000 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 41,380	Hey Solo, You don't sort your range brass? It's not uncommon for a smaller case (.22, .32, or .380) to get lodged in a larger case. Same effect when depriming. Who's to blame then? CCI Blazer is decent brass at a decent price. Were the cases brass, the ammo would be a lot more expensive, especially in the less popular calibers. If it wasn't for the anti-reloading features, some idiot would reload the stuff, end up killing a gun or getting hurt, and then suing CCI for his own stupidity. Sad commentary on today's lawsuit society. ------------------ Beware the man with the S&W .357 Mag. Chances are he knows how to use it.

June 28, 2000, 12:21 AM	#9
Ruben Nasser Senior Member Join Date: March 29, 2000 Location: Asuncion, Paraguay Posts: 280	I think Blazers are good ammo, very clean and consistent. Teh reason they use berdan primers is to avoid reloading (they put a "NR" headstamp and tell it everywhere in the boxes). I have a few "idiot" friends that reloaded them, just using a sharpened decapper to punch the base, and then used a boxer primer and a normal pressure load. They work, but split after 2-3 loadings, don't do it!!

June 28, 2000, 08:33 AM	#10
bfoster Senior Member Join Date: October 13, 1998 Location: N. of Fords Switch, OK, USA Posts: 297	NJW... A few experimenters with benchrest rifles have tried using Berdan primed brass. The results have shown no signifigant difference in group sizes when compared to Boxer primers. Trust me, if there were any "edge" to be gained, the use of Berdan primers would be universal in that sport- I once won a match by an aggregate which was only 0.0004" smaller than that of the second place finisher. Bob

June 29, 2000, 11:04 AM	#11
Turk Senior Member Join Date: May 30, 2000 Location: USA Posts: 517	I think the reason as to why the Blazers use Berdan primers is all economics and marketing. The Blazers fit a niche in the market that gives non-reloaders economical priced ammo basically due to the aluminum cases. If I remember right I think the Blazers are produced in Europe. (Maybe a Scandinavian country?). The Europeans use Berdan primers. Are they any better than a boxer primer who knows. I’m sure the Europeans will tell you they are better. Berdan ammunition using brass cases can be reloaded. RCBS makes a deprimer tool. But to be quite frank it’s not work the trouble to reload Berdan primed cases. Concerning reloading aluminum cases is it possible to reload? Yes, I did it years ago with 9mm Blazers but had to use boxer primers (just to see if it was possible). You have to use a small punch to knock out the primer. If don’t have Berdan primers you’ll have to break off a small post that’s in the middle of the primer pocket so the boxer primer can be pressed in. Next is to resize the case minus the decapper assembly. Aluminum will resize. I’m quite sure you could also resize steel cases with the proper lubricant. I would think the steel case being resized with steel sizing die would wear the die very quickly. MY ADVICE IS NOT TO reload the Blazer as there is really no reason with the available of brass cases. Another negative aspect maybe the strength of the aluminum case once fired then getting resized. DANGER cases splitting when fired I had a couple from the 50 I reloaded. To me the Blazers are OK but I can reload and still save money. I agree with a couple previous posts that Blazers and AK /SKS shooters don’t tend to pick up their cases after a days shooting which leaves a mess. You all have a good day. Turk [This message has been edited by Turk (edited June 29, 2000).]