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Old February 7, 2005, 02:04 PM   #26
guntotin_fool
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If you have a gun in your face and as you get out of the car you can, shoot him.
If he puts a gun in your face then backs up to tell you to get out, like he has done this before, give him the car, but only if you are the only one in it;

If I get carjacked and I have wife or kids with me. I floor it and aim at him. with the car, there is not "drive to avoid him" no, it is drive over him to get away. OR if I get out as he covers me, Wife will shoot him. With her gun from her purse.

My brother was in Chicago, driving a rental and he was assaulted at a stop light, He floored it and drove between the two cars in front of him and beside him squashing the BG between his car and the stopped car in the left turn lane and then he kept going till he found a cop car. He was not charged or even arrested. CPD had a lengthy history on the severely damaged BG and decided squeaky clean business traveler had more logical story than multiple felon.
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Old February 7, 2005, 02:46 PM   #27
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Get out of the car, shoot the bastard's back

in my jurisdiction (Austria/EU) selfedefense-law would allow to do the following:

pretend to surrender. get out of the car. go behind the car. draw your concealed carried handgun and shoot the bastard through your rear window in the back.

While you are in minimum danger he will be in a straight line to you and not moving sideways at all. With a 9x19mm or a .357 Mag. you should have no trouble killing the bad guy trough your rear window (or trunk etc) and seat.

If you shoot the guy driving in your own car away from you the risk of hittin others is low. Your engine and front-part of the car are likely to finally stop the bullets or at least slow them down a great deal.
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Old February 7, 2005, 02:52 PM   #28
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You're kidding, they would allow that in Europe? If I did that here in Kalifornia, I'd probably have my butt dragged to jail for years.
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Old February 7, 2005, 04:04 PM   #29
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no kidding

I am an attorney at law in Austria (also trained at NYU School of Law). You are allowed to protect your life and property (not honor!) with deadly force in Austria. If the value of your property is over EUR 1.000,- (and I hope your car is) you are allowed to stop an ongoing attac by shooting after the fleeing thief or burgler as long as they still keep your property with them. You are not obliged to watch your (substantial > EUR 1.000) belongings be dragged away for the sake of a bad guy's health. He jeopardized it himself.

So my scenario is perfectly legal in my country, and - what I hope I would do.
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Old February 7, 2005, 07:06 PM   #30
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Get out of the truck and give it to him

Then as he reached to put it in gear, shoot him with a 44 special, the round might go through him but it wont pass through the side of the car after. and Im going to be so close Im not going to miss.
I feel that if some one wants to put my life in danger, he is dead.
I have never had to pull a trigger on any one, and I pray to God that I wont ever, but I have had to pull a gun on two people, both times that was enough.
I also thank God for that to.
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Old February 9, 2005, 03:08 PM   #31
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Ozzieman, tell me more

...about your two experiences. I only once pulled and fired against dogs, and already posted my stroy in another thread here as follows:

Recently I walked in a park. 5 dogs (2 big, 3 medium sized) ran towards me. No owners in side, no lashes... I stopped. I was bitten twice before and decided that I would never be bitten again.

After the dogs were 30yds close, I pulled my (black) 9mm, kept it hidden at my side (black coat) and checked out where I could fire a safe warning-shot into. There was plain lawn beside my path. The dogs ran closer. As they were 5yds before me, I fired one shot into the lawn.

I didn't even fire in the direction of the dogs, but right into the lawn at my side. The dogs virtually truned 180° in a split second and dashed away.


maybe we should start a thread on personal experiences of actually using our guns...
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Old February 10, 2005, 04:07 AM   #32
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First - do not get taken by surprize. You should be in condition yellow at all times.

At stop lights etc, always leave plenty of room to pull out and get around the car in front of you.

Look for markers as you approach traffic signals or any other place where you must come to a complete stop. Monitor your mirrors, but also your "blind spots" where someone could approach unseen in the side mirrors and your regular field of view. Use your peripheral vision.

Shooting from a low angle should direct bullet paths such that unless some is actualy standing behind your target they will not be in the immediate line of fire. If that is not possible you are really not taking any more risk hitting a bystander than in any other potentially crowded place.
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Old February 10, 2005, 02:53 PM   #33
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I'd punch the accelerator as Xavier says. BTW, how do we know it is a carjacking and not a kidnapping? If for some reason I know it is a kidnapping, I will come out of my door or scoot over the seat jump out the passenger door and run away even if his gun is trained on me the whole way. Doing something to try to shoot a kidnapper would raise the odds of you getting hurt astronomically.
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Old February 10, 2005, 05:28 PM   #34
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I was involved in an attempted car jacking several years back. I live in Utah and I was in Las Vegas, Nevada. Being a good guy, and since my Utah CCW is not honored in NV, my pistol was placed in the trunk. I stopped at a red light in the bad side of town. I was with my wife and we were stopped in the outside lane. It was early morning, in daylight, and no other cars were near by. A guy started to step in front of me. He was trying to conceal a side handle baton. We both picked up on the threat. Then three other guys pulled up in a car on my left rear boxing me in. The baton guy nodded to the three in the car and started to make his move. I locked eyes with him and accelerated. I had every intention of running him down if he didn't move. He jumped out of the way and his friends just sat there. I was aware of my surroundings. They did not have the drop on me. I was on to them, but I was still VERY lucky that they didn't press the attack. Obviously they wanted easier pickin's. Don't forget that a car has more knockdown power than any pistol. I learned a valuable lesson that day. I will never allow myself to be so defenseless again. Watch-Six
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Old February 11, 2005, 07:44 AM   #35
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Watch-Six - That's a really good post and it makes a great point that you don't even have to have the ability to defeat attackers, so don't always give up. Just raising the stakes can be enough for them to look for the easy meat. Kudos to you.
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Old February 11, 2005, 01:12 PM   #36
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Blow the Perp a kiss as you drive off. If you can't do that, shoot early and often.

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Old February 12, 2005, 10:37 AM   #37
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Be prepared!

As has been mentioned, keep watching.

I drive a Hyundai, as does my wife. SOP is to drive with doors locked (power locks) and windows up. Air conditioning is easier on gas and ears than open windows.

Leave space at stop lights, be able to move.

The question has arisen about giving up car if alone, but defending if accompanied by wife or children. Too complicated! One plan for all occasions for me.

Accelerate! Idiot in front of me gets frontal lobotomy. Maybe just kneeotomy, but I'm not stopping for some socially disenfranchised pataak who wants to steal the car I bought with my hard earned dollars. Nor am I going to put me and my family at risk by bailing out in a 'questionable' neighborhood.

Just for the record, I am a Federal lawman and carry constantly. Defending with automobile is quicker and easier and probably more effective than breaking out the shooting polymer.

Still, above all, be vigilant! It's easier to avoid danger than to escape it.
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Old February 12, 2005, 11:43 AM   #38
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Very good scenario, I enjoy reading everyone's solutions, But in OHIO your gun has to be locked in the glovebox, or in a box with a lock on one of the vehicle seats, or in plain view in the holster on your side, which seems impossible to do. So in this case an ohioan would be in a bad position.
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Old February 16, 2005, 03:31 PM   #39
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We live on the wrong continent!

I was watching some news show a couple of years ago. It was dealing with the all too common problem of kidnapping and car hacking in South America. Apparantly kidnapping is a like a whole profession in South America. The news show I was watching showed a this product which could be installed on a persons car called the "Incinerator" or something similar. What it did was if you were being threatened from the drivers side of the car, you stepped on a special pedal (like the old style floor mounted high beam switch) and all hell breaks loose! They install four or five gas nozzles which aim up from the bottom of the car, below the door sill. When the pedal is pushed, 10 to 15 foot flames shoot up in the air at about a 45 degree angle, burning the hell out of anything in the way. The video was amazing. It must have had a propane tank in the tunk or something, but what a great product! F.Y.I. lawyers suck, we should be able to get stuff like this.
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Old February 16, 2005, 07:07 PM   #40
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As I open the door. . .

I grab the gun in my door's side pocket and shots ring out. I might die, but that son of a b!#@& is dying with me!! (Just Kidding!)

Every situation is different! Sometimes it's right to floor it. Sometimes it's right to lock your door! Sometimes it's right to skin your smokewagon and go to work!

All can be solutions and all can be problems.

We are all blessed each day we are alive.

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Old February 16, 2005, 07:55 PM   #41
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I worked with a guy who was car jacked in Detroit twice. The first time he gave up the car and was left stranded in a "bad area". The second time he rolled up the window on the perp's arm and hit the gas, smacking him into a utility pole and the jackster's arm came off. When the Detroit police arrived to take their report, they acted angry like my friend had done something inhumane or wrong. He simply had had enough and decided to take action.
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Old February 16, 2005, 08:24 PM   #42
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Quote:
jackster's arm came off
ewwwwwwwwwwww

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Old February 16, 2005, 08:33 PM   #43
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Personal Carjacking Lesson Learned

It IS in fact true that when people are faced with impending doom, they revert to their lowest level of training instead of using their brains.

At about 0400 one morning, I was by myself in my Avalanche sitting in an intersection downtown waiting for the red light to turn green. From my 10:00 position, an intimidating street type started to approach my vehicle.

I should have FLOORED it and gotten the hell out of there. But no, I'm a law-abiding citizen and I dutifully was waiting for the light to turn Green. But as I spied this guy headed my way, I couldn't help but notice what looked just like a tire iron in his right hand, and I drew my 1911 from my strong side Fobus holster and got a good sight picture. Through the closed window I shouted as loud as I could "Don't come any closer!!".

It was ony then that the light turned Green and I suddenly realized what an idiot I had been in sitting there that whole time when I could have easily floored it and sped off safey before he got as close as he did. The good news was that the BG saw my sidearm pointed at him, and he turned and ran like the wind. My lessons learned that morning included the following pearls of wisdom:

1. Use Situational Awareness ('SA') at all times.
2. Be willing to 'break the law' (run the red light) if your life is in danger.
3. Don't hesitate to go to low-ready if you're "not sure" about a situation that may be developing.
4. Don't let a street thug get within your Zone of Danger before drawing down on him if your Gut Instict (a very useful tool) says "Danger Will Robinson".
5. Be in Condition ONE when carrying your defensive firearm.

The mistake I made was in not phoning in the the incident to the police. For all I know the BG could have sprinted away to a phone booth where he might have called in a "Man with a Gun" call.

If you have an opportunity to take an Evasive Driving course, take it.
If you have an opportunity to take a Vehicle Defense tactics course, do it.
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Old February 16, 2005, 09:11 PM   #44
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When the Detroit police arrived to take their report, they acted angry like my friend had done something inhumane or wrong. He simply had had enough and decided to take action.

There's a reason why Detroit routinely tops the list of the most crime-ridden cities in the country. The city government is corrupt from top to bottom.
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Old February 18, 2005, 07:02 PM   #45
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Im sure that if any cop pulled you over for running a light for that reason, nothing bad would come (the worst would be a ticket). That's my first action when it comes to that debacle, as it presents the lowest probablity of a legal action being thrown my way.
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Old February 23, 2005, 11:37 AM   #46
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My thoughts...

Since with a CCW, you have to exhaust all forms of escape before you can justifiably shoot someone, if a perp was trying to jack my car, I'd slam the gas, nail the person in front of me, reverse into the person in back of me... then get out an shoot him , all joking aside, I'd let him have my car, my crown vic isn't worth the hassle to justify shooting someone.
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Old February 23, 2005, 11:49 AM   #47
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What if the BG didn't happen to like the way you surrendered your Crown Vic and decided to take the car and shoot you in the head? You're gonna depend upon the generosity of an armed car thief to let you walk away from the scene with a mental picture of what he looks like. Grand theft auto is a felony with major jail time last I looked. Just wondering. A lot of people who decide to "let him have my car" get killed for their trouble.

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Old February 23, 2005, 12:51 PM   #48
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I must say. This post made me think for a week or so. I install stereo systems and alarms in cars for a living. All the alarms I put in automatically lock the doors when the ignition is turned on. I just got a new car last summer. I havent put a remote start on it yet which has this auto door lock feature, until last night after thinking about this post.

I always thought, man if you need your doors locked when driving through the city you are a wuss. Now I dont think that. I want my doors to lock when I get into the car. Why? Because really, there is no way for the car jacker to force you out of the car unless he comes up from behind and grabs the door handle. At that point, you cant draw. The only way I am giving up my car is if he has a gun, so I am screwed if the door is opened.

Now I know my doors will always be locked, and I can just floor it if some guy comes up to my window.
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Old February 23, 2005, 04:04 PM   #49
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arm off

Quote:
jackster's arm came off
well done.
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Old February 24, 2005, 04:43 AM   #50
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Quote:
The second time he rolled up the window on the perp's arm and hit the gas, smacking him into a utility pole and the jackster's arm came off.
Guess you dont have to worry bout that guy jacking any more cars

Yeah driving off and wrecking the car would be what I would do before I ever got out unless I had the chance to get my gun drawn long before the BG got there and even then if I had a clear shot out with minimal damage to my vehicle or anyone elses I would probably take it. And beings were on this subject check this link out happened here in Anchorage.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7015826/
Seems to me she had ample oppurtunitys to escape but was so unprepared for this that she just followed this guys instructions. She is very lucky to have survived IMO. We have had several Kidnapping/Murders of young women up here that have gone unsolved for years and years. One case in particular which happened about 10 yrs. ago still hasnt been solved. For a city with the relatively small population that Anchorage has we sure do have some strange criminal occurences, must be the long winters or something.
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