Flashlight + Pepper spray for defense?

DialONE911 · September 19, 2000, 10:24 PM

A friend's wife is starting a job which will require her to make house calls for patients during 3rd shift hours.

Carry is illegal in the state and she is somewhat anti. My friend wants to get her some pepper spray. My feeling is that supplementing that with a surefire flashlight would make that a much more effective nighttime defensive measure.

The way I figure it, she could use the flashlight to identify and temporarily blind an attacker while hitting him with the pepper spray.

Does anyone with more experience than I do have any comments or suggestions. I was asked because I am the only "gun nut" they know, but I have very little real world experience in self defense.

Thanks

MountainGun44 · September 20, 2000, 12:54 AM

I have two of the Surefire lights. They completely blind you at night. I think it is a greta idea.

jthuang · September 20, 2000, 10:53 AM

I love Surefire lights. A great idea.

Another option to consider is knife training. A lot of people here (myself included) have taken Insights's Defensive Folding Knife classes and found them to be extremely useful, especially in areas where you cannot carry a gun (e.g., on-board airplanes). In DFK2 we also learned the use of a Surefire light in conjunction with the knife.

HTH,

Justin

------------------
Justin T. Huang, Esq.
late of Kennett Square, Pennsylvania

DirtyDave · September 21, 2000, 06:05 AM

Where does one acquire a "Sunlight"?

------------------
"Where there is doubt, there is no doubt"

SB · September 21, 2000, 11:00 PM

I do not believe the "blinding" power of a SureFire is adequate to stop a determined attacker. You do not have to take my word for it. Simply test it out for yourselves. Remember the operative word: Determined.

Both tools are not complete solutions in themselves. They require a "follow-up" should these tools fail to stop an attack. What that is, however, I can not say. There is simply not enough information to make a proper recommendation.

Otherwise, the strategy and the tools to implement it is sound.

CQB1 · September 22, 2000, 09:36 AM

The Flashlight/OC combo (along with a LW tactical folder such as the Spyderco Delica) is an approach we've been recommending to those stuck in jurisdictions where concealed handguns are prohibited. We also stress this during rape prevention courses we teach.

The light doesn't necessarily blind your assailant, but it sure does obscure their vision a bit. (A small powerful light such as the Surefire 6P/Z or Streamlight Scorpion is a must to maximize this effect). An added benefit is that, once lit up, the Badguy is fully illuminated and aware that you've taken official notice of their actions. Often caught off guard by being suddenly and unexpectedly lit up, some will actually scurry back from whence they came without any further trouble.

Having used force on crooks for many years now, we've come to understand that most criminals are bottom feeders and scavengers who attack the weak. Once they realize a prospective victim has fangs and won't allow themselves to be a victim. Many will go away to find another prospect. Therefore, attitude and awareness prior may head the whole thing off before it becomes a problem.

But, if they don't go away, we recommend you "fight behind the light". If the Badguy hasn't made contact yet, direct the light beam towards your opponent's eyes, move laterally to create distance and get off the force line your opponent will follow to contact you, use your OC spray (If that level of force is required), and extract immediately from the area and notify law enforcement of the attack.

NOTE: Don't risk your self defense on those cheesy little key chain OC dispensers. They lack effective range, are too small to manipulate effectively, and don't hold enough juice for the job. Get a MK3 sized can as a minimum. You'll get 10-13 feet of range and enough juice to saturate the attackers face.

All of this assumes, of course, that you're constantly in condition yellow and capable of spotting the threat in the first place. If you didn't spot the attacker early enough and things get real close real fast you need a contact weapon to supplement the OC. Knives are one approach. But few can get them out quickly enough to get them into action at contact distances unless the knife is already in hand. Since the flashlight will already be in one hand (Non dominant recommended), and the car keys or OC in the other, something has to go. If grabbed, we recommend taking whatever you have in your hands, and smashing it into the attackers eyes and nose to break their grip. Once this is done, create distance and fight behind the light as described above. Trust us on this one, it takes a lot of determination to continue the attack while bleeding from the nose and/or eyes and with a face fully saturated with OC.

I could go on and on with this subject, but I've ranted enough for now. Buy some gear.

------------------
CQB Solutions
Equipment, training, & technology for law enforcement & corrections tactical teams.
cqbsolutions.com
[email protected]

September 19, 2000, 10:24 PM	#1
DialONE911 Senior Member Join Date: June 7, 2000 Location: Milwaukee, WI Posts: 214	A friend's wife is starting a job which will require her to make house calls for patients during 3rd shift hours. Carry is illegal in the state and she is somewhat anti. My friend wants to get her some pepper spray. My feeling is that supplementing that with a surefire flashlight would make that a much more effective nighttime defensive measure. The way I figure it, she could use the flashlight to identify and temporarily blind an attacker while hitting him with the pepper spray. Does anyone with more experience than I do have any comments or suggestions. I was asked because I am the only "gun nut" they know, but I have very little real world experience in self defense. Thanks

September 20, 2000, 12:54 AM	#2
MountainGun44 Senior Member Join Date: April 26, 2000 Posts: 343	I have two of the Surefire lights. They completely blind you at night. I think it is a greta idea.

September 20, 2000, 10:53 AM	#3
jthuang Senior Member Join Date: January 21, 2000 Posts: 823	I love Surefire lights. A great idea. Another option to consider is knife training. A lot of people here (myself included) have taken Insights's Defensive Folding Knife classes and found them to be extremely useful, especially in areas where you cannot carry a gun (e.g., on-board airplanes). In DFK2 we also learned the use of a Surefire light in conjunction with the knife. HTH, Justin ------------------ Justin T. Huang, Esq. late of Kennett Square, Pennsylvania

September 21, 2000, 06:05 AM	#4
DirtyDave Junior Member Join Date: September 18, 2000 Posts: 7	Where does one acquire a "Sunlight"? ------------------ "Where there is doubt, there is no doubt"

September 21, 2000, 11:00 PM	#5
SB Senior Member Join Date: November 9, 1998 Posts: 415	I do not believe the "blinding" power of a SureFire is adequate to stop a determined attacker. You do not have to take my word for it. Simply test it out for yourselves. Remember the operative word: Determined. Both tools are not complete solutions in themselves. They require a "follow-up" should these tools fail to stop an attack. What that is, however, I can not say. There is simply not enough information to make a proper recommendation. Otherwise, the strategy and the tools to implement it is sound.

September 22, 2000, 09:36 AM	#6
CQB1 Member Join Date: September 20, 2000 Posts: 16	The Flashlight/OC combo (along with a LW tactical folder such as the Spyderco Delica) is an approach we've been recommending to those stuck in jurisdictions where concealed handguns are prohibited. We also stress this during rape prevention courses we teach. The light doesn't necessarily blind your assailant, but it sure does obscure their vision a bit. (A small powerful light such as the Surefire 6P/Z or Streamlight Scorpion is a must to maximize this effect). An added benefit is that, once lit up, the Badguy is fully illuminated and aware that you've taken official notice of their actions. Often caught off guard by being suddenly and unexpectedly lit up, some will actually scurry back from whence they came without any further trouble. Having used force on crooks for many years now, we've come to understand that most criminals are bottom feeders and scavengers who attack the weak. Once they realize a prospective victim has fangs and won't allow themselves to be a victim. Many will go away to find another prospect. Therefore, attitude and awareness prior may head the whole thing off before it becomes a problem. But, if they don't go away, we recommend you "fight behind the light". If the Badguy hasn't made contact yet, direct the light beam towards your opponent's eyes, move laterally to create distance and get off the force line your opponent will follow to contact you, use your OC spray (If that level of force is required), and extract immediately from the area and notify law enforcement of the attack. NOTE: Don't risk your self defense on those cheesy little key chain OC dispensers. They lack effective range, are too small to manipulate effectively, and don't hold enough juice for the job. Get a MK3 sized can as a minimum. You'll get 10-13 feet of range and enough juice to saturate the attackers face. All of this assumes, of course, that you're constantly in condition yellow and capable of spotting the threat in the first place. If you didn't spot the attacker early enough and things get real close real fast you need a contact weapon to supplement the OC. Knives are one approach. But few can get them out quickly enough to get them into action at contact distances unless the knife is already in hand. Since the flashlight will already be in one hand (Non dominant recommended), and the car keys or OC in the other, something has to go. If grabbed, we recommend taking whatever you have in your hands, and smashing it into the attackers eyes and nose to break their grip. Once this is done, create distance and fight behind the light as described above. Trust us on this one, it takes a lot of determination to continue the attack while bleeding from the nose and/or eyes and with a face fully saturated with OC. I could go on and on with this subject, but I've ranted enough for now. Buy some gear. ------------------ CQB Solutions Equipment, training, & technology for law enforcement & corrections tactical teams. cqbsolutions.com [email protected]