Who are you?

[xrocket]

Having been the first post to Sweatnbullets original thesis and having followed this tread over the last three days I've noticed a predominate difference of opinion.

On one side is the "warrior"; practitioner, fantasizer, teacher, student or wannabe. You choose. On the other side is the naysayer. Well I've considered these two sides of the coin and have decided I'm neither. I'm a ....

Lover, that's right, a lover.

I love my life.

I love my family.

I love my freedom.

What I'm not ... is a warrior.

Know this though, if my life or my family is put in harms way by anyone, anywhere, anytime I am prepared to defend with the full force and determination available to me. I will put you down without reservation, remorse or mercy.

There is a need for warriors with true hearts and clear purpose. Until the moment your fate intersects time and place my friends, everything practiced or imagined warrior wise, is pure BS.

[Scorch]

A warrior learns combat skills, trains assiduously, lives a life built around those skills, and hopes to die while using them in combat.

A soldier learns combat skills, lives a life around not using those skills even though he must depend on them for survival, and hopes he will not die while using those skills.

Civilians live lives generally unconcerned with combat (except for their entertainment), live lives focused on their own wants and needs, and play games to entertain themselves, and pretend they are not scared of those who are trained to kill.

Who am I? I am an advanced martial artist, a combat Marine, a shooter, a knife fighter, and am not afraid of dying (although I am sure it is nearby at all times). But I am also a civilian, a father, a husband, and a member of society who understands that civil order is essential to our way of life, and regards selling fear as lower than pimping.

I see by sweatnbullet's signature line that he is in the business of training people to shoot as if they were fighting for their lives, i.e. playing army. He does this by selling fear.

I ask myself how many of his students will ever be in a situation where they need to be combat trained, and why those who participate in this type of training never felt the need to join the armed forces and fight in combat.

[gvf]

By day 6, I gave up, and decided that Manifred had won the pill war. 6 days of antibiotics would have to be good enough.

Sorry to hi-jack the thread for a second, but that's very funny, the cat & pill story. I was defeated in the same way by my cat, and I gave up after DAY 5.
That's why BGs never mug cats - perhaps it would best to carry a cat instead of my .357 Python.

[The Tourist]

Scorch, first thank you for my freedom.

To address the issues you have raised, there is a world of difference between teaching, and some one else producing little ninjas like a sensei with a cookie cutter.

First of all, you are dispensing knowledge. It is the immoral twisting of that knowledge that is really on trial here. Someone taught me to care for and balance tires--that's a far cry from using that skill to run down an adversary.

Let me ask you a question. How would you feel if you and I worked on a project for a nameless faceless Joe-lunchbox. I picked out a decent combat knife and sharpened it, and you taught him to use it. We tragically learn he manipulated us for our skills to kill his wife for insurance money.

Lots of folks would say it not be our fault, we cannot control the actions of others. In an academic way, I agree.

But I am also a husband, a church member and I do volunteer work. The concept that someone used my skills to do evil would haunt me for more years than I care to admit.

In my heart, (and from your response) I know it would bother you.

And that's the difference. You have chosen a path to blunt aggression by helping people who feel helpless. I might teach them to change a tire, or fix a toaster. Same deal. Skills are a good thing to learn.

But as a person who has never been a soldier, but wades through numerous guys who claim to be warriors, can you see why I feel strongly on this issue.

[Mr. James]

I ask myself how many of his students will ever be in a situation where they need to be combat trained, and why those who participate in this type of training never felt the need to join the armed forces and fight in combat.

Good questions. Very good questions.

And thank you.

[The Canuck]

Originally Posted by The Tourist

Every time I hear the word 'warrior' I want to gag.

You may want to see a specialist about that.

You're not a warrior, I'm not a warrior. A member of Armed Forces is not a warrior; they are citizen soldiers.

Alright, first off, it is definitely not your place to tell me what I am or am not.

Secondly, the warrior mindset does not mean you are a Samurai or a Knight or Masai or anything of the sort. It means that you are of the mind to do your damndest to win. Win what? According to you guys it is battle, war, or any other conflagration. If you were to truly study the Bushido you will see that the code requires you to strive for victory in all things, whether it is simply to survive, to protect your children or even just bring home the bacon. The warrior mindset means you think like a winner.

Every idiot I know who lives at a dojo and claims his lineage to his samurai past is so convoluted in fantasy I doubt that he can be salvaged. The last samurai died out during the 1890's, and unless someone can provide some solid historic foundation, I do not know of one who was Caucasian.

If you wake up in the morning, stare into the mirror to shave and see a warrior, you need more counseling than I do. You are a danger to society and other mall ninjas.

B.S. like this makes me wonder who really needs the counselling. Where do I start going off about my "dojo" or my "mall"? Where do I call myself a warrior? I have never called myself a warrior. I have called myself friend, soldier, husband, pilot, and rescuer, but not once warrior.

By the way, my "dojo" was Canadian Forces Base Wainright, where I passed Infantry school.

A man defends his family and community. Drunken townies fight for bragging rights. Warriors fight for supposed goals no one else sees.

Look it up, try Websters or Oxford, they both tell you.

[Sweatnbullets]

Well over 50% of my students are LEO or military. Many of the remaining students have been involved in life threatening encounters or have jobs or situations that they consider dangerous. Of course there are simply some men and women that want to be able to protect their loved ones to the best of their ability.

There sure are a lot of phoney "warrior" definitions coming into this thread with no documentation. If you are going to come up with some bizzare definition, post the source. Until then you are just making stuff up to fit your unsubstantiated beliefs. I posted my source.....put up......or.....

Also let's get something straight....I never claimed to be a warrior. All I did was let people know that the term "warrior mindset" is a generally accepted term inside of firearms training. The fact is that I do not rant about words that I do not like. To me that is boardering on obsessive behavior and consider that a character flaw.

It is just a word....get over it.

Read the dictionary and learn something.

How do you feel about the word "tactical"?

[Wildalaska]

How do you feel about the word "tactical"?

A marketing tool or a desciptive adjective that makes sense, or an ego booster word for "warriors"

If folks want to have a "warrior mindset" all their lives thats fine, I myself cant spend my time ready to take out aggressively every stranger that I see

WildilikepuppiesandflowersAlaska TM

Warrior mindset or not, there is always ONE person in this world who is tougher than you...just hope you dont meet him

[Sweatnbullets]

If I ever get attacked, I'll fight like a cornered cat to defend myself and the people I love. Why a cornered cat? Because a cornered cat might be small, but she can make a grown man think twice about trying to grab her. Because until she needs to use them, a cat's claws stay sheathed. Because she doesn't build her life around being able to fight, but she sure can if she needs to. She keeps her claws sharp, but sharpening her claws isn't the most important thing in her life. Because when she does fight, she fights only to get away, and doesn't worry a squiff about the consequences. Because she doesn't have a "sort of" setting. She fights all-out, with everything she's got. When she needs to. But only when she needs to. She doesn't swagger around looking to pick fights, or spend her whole life fluffed up to three times her normal size.

VERY NICE!

Perfect description of the "warrior mindset." You may not like the term but you are living the meaning of it.

Once again, I am not judgemental of generally accepted terms or words inside of specific professions.

If everyone before me called it the "cornered cat mindset" I would not freak out and try to change it. I would just accept the established historical terminology and move on to actual things that mattered.

[Tanzer]

We're chasing our tails here. It all started when The Canuck used the term "Warrior Mindset", which I attempted to point out as mere semantics. When the local high school girls volleyball team plays, they act like warriors. Not by the definition in the dictionary, but by the adapted vernacular. It doesn't mean they're commandos. Then again, there's one girl... Naw, forget it.
Right now, it seem that "who are you" (referring to some) is folks who can't get to the real issue because a definition hangs them up, and traffic has to come to a halt while we try to hash out whether "warriors" have it right, or "cornered cats" have it all together. I would argue that word choice has little to do with the OP.
This is not to belittle Pax's input. I have visited her sight on a number of occasions, and my wife does too. In the context of her work, the term is very fitting, but it is situational. I'm sure Pax is not a "cornered cat" at the supermarket deli counter.
The "Who Are You", I would think, refers to everyday living. Who am I when customer service tells me they won't fix my printer? A pitbull. Who am I when my daughter is crying about her boyfriend dumping her? An Oak tree she can nest in.
I could go on, but the point is, someone tripped over the word "warrior" and we divided into teams, now we're all wearing our horned helmets, or showing our claws, and taking cheap shots at one another, impying that others need to see a shrink because they disagree with something that in no way defines any individual.

[matthew temkin]

I too feel funny about using the term warrior when describing the avj. Joe such as myself.
My dad was a WW2 Ranger who saw extensive combat from N. Africa to Anzio and he never called himself a warrior.
He always said that he was just a typical young man of the 1930's/1940s who was asked to do a dirty job and then did it.
Ditto for the dozens of military/police combat vets who shared their insights with me.
None saw themselves as warriors--just men forced into a situation who survived with a combination of skill, mindset and a little bit of luck.
Who I am is a family man who--for reasons that I could never phantom--has always had an strong interest in the outdoors, survival, self defense and both sporting and defensive firearms.
I am also a part time instructor of these skills who tries to remain humble by stating that I am just passing on the hard won knowledge of those who trained me.
While I try to remain non judgemental I do shake my head when seeing a C.P.A. decked out in tactical gear with a customized AR 15, a $2500 1911, Royal Robbins clothing and enough equipment to support a platoon.
Sometimes I want to ask just what he is training for?

[Sweatnbullets]

The word "warrior" is never used in the original post. It is not a word that I throw around easily. But, "warrior mindset" (once again, not in the original post) is a very different thing, since it is a common and historically accepted term inside of the firearms training industry.

The dictionary is your friend.

Unsubstantiated made up definitions are not.

What we have is a group of people judging another group of people and using a made up defintion in order to attempt to cast some bad light on the people that actually accept what is written in the dictionary.

[Sweatnbullets]

Sometimes I want to ask just what he is training for?

I ask all of the time and you would be very surprised by the answers.

[Tanzer]

The word "warrior" is never used in the original post. It is not a word that I throw around easily. But, "warrior mindset" (once again, not in the original post) is a very different thing, since it is a common and historically accepted term inside of the firearms training industry.

Maybe, but we commonly accept common variations. Here's an example, keeping in mind that;

The dictionary is your friend.

Cornered Cat. (not to pick on Pax, but good example):
Does your cellular matrix change? Do you grow fur and claws and get big yellow eyes while a tail rips through the back of your pants? No, it's just hyperbole, but a perfectly acceptable one because it is descriptive. Kinda silly to look up "cat" in the dictionary to prove that you are not actually a feline.

[The Tourist]

Originally Posted by Sweatnbullets

"warrior mindset" is a very different thing, since it is a common and historically accepted term inside of the firearms training industry.

And to me it means about as much as a RUB buying black leather and conchos. You use the phrase "training industry." This means the guy is still in some type of school and hasn't fought anyone.

In my home, right now, I am probably within ten feet of a pistol, some kind of knife (I haven't looked), a motion alarm light, upscale glass windows, and two dogs. At the end of the hallway is the safe area with sevral boxes of spare ammo and our cell phone chargers.

There are about two dozen homes in my immediate area, perhaps 4 to 6 of us live under the same kind of dwelling. We have neighborhood watch.

But "warrior mindset"? C'mon, we're average American suburbanites with jobs and families. Even the veterans and the lone State Patrol Trooper in my block never use the word "warrior."

Do we have the ability and training to respond? Of course. Are we 'razor ready' to dab on the war-paint and attack a third world country? I'll let you answer that ridiculous question yourself.

If you take some MA classes, shoot a little IPSC, hit the gym, watch your diet, jog a bit, then just say so. If you do all of those things, you don't need the hype. People will know you by your accomplishments.

Case in point. Several years ago, Sonny Barger wrote a book and was involved in a little high-mileage vehicle called "The Sparrow." I saw him on TV, and he was neat, clean and articulate.

But I did not forget--not even for a moment--who he was. Same deal here.

Oxford Univesity Press:

warrior>noun - (especially in former times) a brave and experienced soldier or fighter.

[David Armstrong]

You're not a warrior, I'm not a warrior. A member of Armed Forces is not a warrior; they are citizen soldiers.

I'll disagree, I think members of the Armed Forces can be warriors, although simple membership is not the defining factor. What galls me are the folks who claim to be warriors who have never been in a war and/or have never worn the uniform of the Armed Forces. And sorry, fellow LEOs, but the "War on Crime" doesn't make it.

[pax]

Since I partly contributed to the direction this thread has gone, it seems only fair that I should say this to the man who started the thread: I'm sorry for my part in causing the thread drift. Instead of jumping into the drift, I should have nudged the thread back toward the OP's intent.

Thinking about it, in a lot of ways, how you see yourself (a warrior, a cornered cat, a sheepdog, or whatever) actually has a whole lot to do with what you are willing, able, and prepared to do when a crisis hits. A lot of people freeze when a crisis comes simply because they have never pictured themselves calmly coping with that particular problem.

Sweatnbullets made a really good point: it's important to understand what your initial reaction is likely to be, and to build from there.

Roger, I don't know if you're familiar with his work, but Tony Blauer does a really good job teaching folks how to physically convert the intial "flinch" into a useful and effective fighting technique. He does not deny the existence of a flinch, or try to train people out of it (an impossible task~!), he simply shows them how to start from that predictable physical reaction and build it into something useful. It sounds as if you're trying to communicate the same basic idea on a wider scale ...?

pax

[Tanzer]

Sorry, but I'll state again, It's just a descriptive term (in civilian life). If I call someone a dirty rotten bastard, am I implying that A) He is unclean and needs a shower? B) He is in a state of decay? and C) His father took off before he was born?
I did my tour, never once thinking warrior - thinking survivor, B U T thinking victorious survivor. Not to say there aren't any real warriors , not by a long shot. It's just not what I felt like.
But we're talking civilian last I checked. In that arena, Warrior Schmorior - that was Mel Gibson in BraveHeart. The closest I can think of in civilian life is service wives/widows. Otherwise, It's just a drumbeat term, and I see no harm in it.

[Capt. Charlie]

Thinking about it, in a lot of ways, how you see yourself (a warrior, a cornered cat, a sheepdog, or whatever) actually has a whole lot to do with what you are willing, able, and prepared to do when a crisis hits. A lot of people freeze when a crisis comes simply because they have never pictured themselves calmly coping with that particular problem.

Semantics aside, I think Col. Dave Grossman summed it up very well. He said (paraphrased) Most people run from the sound of gunfire, while the warrior runs toward it. There's a lot between the lines there.

[Wildalaska]

Most people run from the sound of gunfire

Can we have a consensus that most civilians, under most circumstances, SHOULD?

WildthatswhyigetiffyonallthesedescriptionsofmindsetsAlaska TM

[Monsterman]

I'm Josh. What's up?

[hogdogs]

TOWARDS!!! Unless he has a shotgun... Than maybe away, REAL LOW! I may run a little dipsy doodle zigzag dance but i am goin' in! Armed with a gun, a knife, fists or feet i am gettin that gun!!! Heck... unless it is a moonless night out here in the country, he has me in excellent silhouette to shoot me in the back and unlike myself BGs have no honor or fear of shooting you! But they do fear a redneck willing to eat their lunch!
I may not be in the majority but I do vote republican!
Brent

[tplumeri]

Feel free to never read anything that I post. I also use my real name (Roger Phillips) at other forums.....real free to not read those either.


I'll take your advice, thanks.

[STLRN]

I am an warrior, my life's work is to make war, to join in combat and destroy those people and things my nation asks me to. I have been lead men and been involved in the fighting. When I joined the Marines and the only thing I asked my recruiter was can I get combat arms and will I see war? Since that date I have been to war 4 times and have conducted operations against this nation's enemy for almost 3 years. When it was my time to PCS last all I asked was to be sent to a deploying unit. I didn't ask for things that would advance my career like going to school. Or to be close to my son, but instead to go to where the fighting is at.

Combat is a very terrifying thing, but you never will feel so alive as to when you hear the sizzle of a tracer going by your head.

[matthew temkin]

I would say that STLRN has earned the right to be called a warrior.
After all, IMHO a true warrior is one who has been to war, yes?