Was Peter Capstick 'for real'

Prichard · July 25, 1999, 09:49 PM

n

[This message has been edited by Prichard (edited February 07, 2000).]

Rob Pincus · July 25, 1999, 10:49 PM

I am a member of DSC and SCI, Ihave never been to Africa but was very close to going this year and only put it off because of my plans to change career paths.
I have several good friends who have been over there, including many officers of DSC and SCI. They assure me that while Capstick's writings are colorful and, in their own way, informative, he is word is not exactly Gospel.

I have been led to believe that Capstick should be treated like Marcinko apparently should be:

Where they there? Yes.

Did they do this and do that? Pretty Much, yeah.

Do they make a whole heck of a lot more out of some things than they probably need to? Well, yeah.

I read them both for entertainment and take was seems plausible for what it is.

------------------
-Essayons

Prichard · July 25, 1999, 11:32 PM

n

[This message has been edited by Prichard (edited February 07, 2000).]

Rob Pincus · July 25, 1999, 11:53 PM

there is a phenomenon that I descirbe as "Experience through Exposure" that might come to play in both of the aforementioned writers works.

Several weeks ago a detective told me a funny story about a case he had worked. It revolved around the whereabouts of certain compromising pictures and an attractive female. His story was entertaining, but not important or really relevant to anything. I would've stored it away in my brain and promptly forgotten it completely....EXCEPT that about two weeks later that guy's supervisor told me a story about what happened when another detective got his hands on some compromising pictures during a case one time.. you guessed it, the same story, the same pictures, different guy.

The first Det. was in the room when I heard the "true" story adn I could tell that he was embarrased, but he never said anything, nor did I. But it will probably color every such story that I ever hear from that guy again, and he likely knows it.

It is a reletively harmless practice that I have seen a lot in LE/ Military/ Firearms circles.... I used to call it "Story Sharing", but E.T.E. syndrome is much more sophisticated.

Ever noticed just how many people have had deer walk out in front of the firing line while their Basic class was qualifying?

------------------
-Essayons

Prichard · July 28, 1999, 12:49 AM

n

[This message has been edited by Prichard (edited February 07, 2000).]

BigG · July 28, 1999, 12:21 PM

I wish you guys would post addresses of some of the source material you're mentioning. I always had the impression that PHC was as solid as the US dollar, oops!?

Of course, I'm sure he exagerated some, as all raconteurs do...

------------------
Yankee Doodle

Al Thompson · July 28, 1999, 09:22 PM

Hi Guys,

I have read most of Capstick's stuff and have also read (principaly Tom Turpin) several writers take him to task for supposed inaccuracies.

Can't speak for the exacts, but my non-PHC reading Afrikaner PH mirrored several of PHC's habits. As to the question of his slayed the ..... or used the xxxx bullet, no telling.

I have (IMHO) to put PHC in the same basket as Massad Ayoob. I think his writing embellishes his contributions, but the majority of it is sound advice.

BTW, as far as his advocacy of the .375, Ross Seyfried also recommends this for first time African folks. (I strongly disagree BTW, and have the pics and bullets to prove my point)

Finding out for yourself is 3/4 the trip..

Giz

------------------
"Shoot low boys, they're riding Shetland ponies..." LG, RIP

Rob Pincus · July 28, 1999, 11:41 PM

Giz,

That may be a very good comparison! Most people around here know about the mixed opinion that MAyoob has in the "serious" gun culture. I think eveyrone can agree that he is at least a little full of crap sometimes. The frequency would vary depending on who you ask to once a month, to once an article, to once a sentance.
The point is, that is the same type opinions I get from the serious safari guys about Capstick.

Al Thompson · July 29, 1999, 07:19 AM

Hi Rob,

Yeah, it's very hard to state that someone is wrong here, right there etc., etc. I have noticed that Ayoob has a tendency to contradict himself on occassion, but then again as I process new data, I change my mind also! Problems come about when you can't explain to your audience that things have changed..

I guess the flip side of that is the guy who gets identified as only having one position.. Sort of like Cooper and the 1911. Truthfully, if you read his stuff, he thinks it's the best, but he will also state that the gun is a very small subset of the equation.

The Turpin article that really pissed me off involved Turpin complaining that PHC's advice to be very cautious of the hippo (hippi?) was bunk. My PH treated river crossings like we were walking up to a wounded buff. Everybody was locked, loaded and assigned a zone to watch. Hell, we rehersed the drill in camp!

Interesting point, my PH was very cautious with buff, hippo and lions. Everything else just something to shoot.

Time for work!

Giz

------------------
"Shoot low boys, they're riding Shetland ponies..." LG, RIP

Futo Inu · July 29, 1999, 08:52 AM

Yeah, they have a name for ETE around here - it's called a LIE. And the people who tell them are called LIARS.

boing · July 30, 1999, 03:24 AM

Somewhere (National Geographic?) I read/heard that hippos cause more human deaths in Africa than any other animal. Anyone know if that's true, and if it isn't, what animal holds that distinction?

-boing

dZ · August 6, 1999, 02:57 AM

one of our photographers got grabbed by a hippo while shooting in the water
he got away with some scars...
they are territorial and feed on land at night

they are dangerous if you are unaware
but i think sapiens is the most dangerous...

dZ

Paul B. · August 6, 1999, 10:57 AM

I think the question should have been, Are gun writers for real? I have a pen pal who is an Alaskan guide. He took one of our illustrious gun magazine writers out on a trip. This supposedly good hangun hunter shot and wounded an animal( I forget what it was) about 6 times, finally used a rifle and shot the poor critter several times more. Finally my pen pal had to finish the animal off. I am beginning to think most of these gun writers are full of bull.
There was an article in one of the gun magazines about 30 + years ago, where this fellow was at one time a game warden in Mexico. He writes of a "well known" gun writer that he arrested for killing two does out of season in Mexico. He could not believe his eyes, when he read that these two does became "magnificent bucks" when the writer wrote up the story on his hunt. From some of the books I have read, I would not be surprised the the doe shooters initials were J O'C.
Maybe one has to be full of blarney to be a gun writer.
Paul B.

Futo Inu · August 6, 1999, 11:06 AM

Boing, the report I heard was that hippos kill more people in Africa than all of the "big 5" dangerous animals combined (lion, leopard, rhino, elephant, cape buffalo). They are extremely territorial and bad-tempered and will almost always charge if you get close. Their teeth are razor sharp, too.

boing · August 8, 1999, 12:40 PM

COOL! I want one!

-boing

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July 25, 1999, 09:49 PM	#1
Prichard Senior Member Join Date: February 7, 1999 Posts: 263	n [This message has been edited by Prichard (edited February 07, 2000).]

July 25, 1999, 10:49 PM	#2
Rob Pincus Senior Member Join Date: October 9, 1998 Location: Hotels Posts: 3,668	I am a member of DSC and SCI, Ihave never been to Africa but was very close to going this year and only put it off because of my plans to change career paths. I have several good friends who have been over there, including many officers of DSC and SCI. They assure me that while Capstick's writings are colorful and, in their own way, informative, he is word is not exactly Gospel. I have been led to believe that Capstick should be treated like Marcinko apparently should be: Where they there? Yes. Did they do this and do that? Pretty Much, yeah. Do they make a whole heck of a lot more out of some things than they probably need to? Well, yeah. I read them both for entertainment and take was seems plausible for what it is. ------------------ *-Essayons*

July 25, 1999, 11:32 PM	#3
Prichard Senior Member Join Date: February 7, 1999 Posts: 263	n [This message has been edited by Prichard (edited February 07, 2000).]

July 25, 1999, 11:53 PM	#4
Rob Pincus Senior Member Join Date: October 9, 1998 Location: Hotels Posts: 3,668	there is a phenomenon that I descirbe as "Experience through Exposure" that might come to play in both of the aforementioned writers works. Several weeks ago a detective told me a funny story about a case he had worked. It revolved around the whereabouts of certain compromising pictures and an attractive female. His story was entertaining, but not important or really relevant to anything. I would've stored it away in my brain and promptly forgotten it completely....EXCEPT that about two weeks later that guy's supervisor told me a story about what happened when another detective got his hands on some compromising pictures during a case one time.. you guessed it, the same story, the same pictures, different guy. The first Det. was in the room when I heard the "true" story adn I could tell that he was embarrased, but he never said anything, nor did I. But it will probably color every such story that I ever hear from that guy again, and he likely knows it. It is a reletively harmless practice that I have seen a lot in LE/ Military/ Firearms circles.... I used to call it "Story Sharing", but E.T.E. syndrome is much more sophisticated. Ever noticed just how many people have had deer walk out in front of the firing line while their Basic class was qualifying? ------------------ *-Essayons*

July 28, 1999, 12:49 AM	#5
Prichard Senior Member Join Date: February 7, 1999 Posts: 263	n [This message has been edited by Prichard (edited February 07, 2000).]

July 28, 1999, 12:21 PM	#6
BigG Senior Member Join Date: May 19, 1999 Location: Atlanta, GA Posts: 4,334	I wish you guys would post addresses of some of the source material you're mentioning. I always had the impression that PHC was as solid as the US dollar, oops!? Of course, I'm sure he exagerated some, as all raconteurs do... ------------------ Yankee Doodle

July 28, 1999, 09:22 PM	#7
Al Thompson Staff Alumnus Join Date: May 2, 1999 Location: South Carolina Posts: 3,611	Hi Guys, I have read most of Capstick's stuff and have also read (principaly Tom Turpin) several writers take him to task for supposed inaccuracies. Can't speak for the exacts, but my non-PHC reading Afrikaner PH mirrored several of PHC's habits. As to the question of his slayed the ..... or used the xxxx bullet, no telling. I have (IMHO) to put PHC in the same basket as Massad Ayoob. I think his writing embellishes his contributions, but the majority of it is sound advice. BTW, as far as his advocacy of the .375, Ross Seyfried also recommends this for first time African folks. (I strongly disagree BTW, and have the pics and bullets to prove my point) Finding out for yourself is 3/4 the trip.. Giz ------------------ "Shoot low boys, they're riding Shetland ponies..." LG, RIP

July 28, 1999, 11:41 PM	#8
Rob Pincus Senior Member Join Date: October 9, 1998 Location: Hotels Posts: 3,668	Giz, That may be a very good comparison! Most people around here know about the mixed opinion that MAyoob has in the "serious" gun culture. I think eveyrone can agree that he is at least a little full of crap sometimes. The frequency would vary depending on who you ask to once a month, to once an article, to once a sentance. The point is, that is the same type opinions I get from the serious safari guys about Capstick.

July 29, 1999, 07:19 AM	#9
Al Thompson Staff Alumnus Join Date: May 2, 1999 Location: South Carolina Posts: 3,611	Hi Rob, Yeah, it's very hard to state that someone is wrong here, right there etc., etc. I have noticed that Ayoob has a tendency to contradict himself on occassion, but then again as I process new data, I change my mind also! Problems come about when you can't explain to your audience that things have changed.. I guess the flip side of that is the guy who gets identified as only having one position.. Sort of like Cooper and the 1911. Truthfully, if you read his stuff, he thinks it's the best, but he will also state that the gun is a very small subset of the equation. The Turpin article that really pissed me off involved Turpin complaining that PHC's advice to be very cautious of the hippo (hippi?) was bunk. My PH treated river crossings like we were walking up to a wounded buff. Everybody was locked, loaded and assigned a zone to watch. Hell, we rehersed the drill in camp! Interesting point, my PH was very cautious with buff, hippo and lions. Everything else just something to shoot. Time for work! Giz ------------------ "Shoot low boys, they're riding Shetland ponies..." LG, RIP

July 29, 1999, 08:52 AM	#10
Futo Inu Senior Member Join Date: February 12, 1999 Location: Oklahoma City, OK, USA Posts: 3,624	Yeah, they have a name for ETE around here - it's called a LIE. And the people who tell them are called LIARS.

July 30, 1999, 03:24 AM	#11
boing Senior Member Join Date: December 24, 1998 Location: WNC Posts: 1,072	Somewhere (National Geographic?) I read/heard that hippos cause more human deaths in Africa than any other animal. Anyone know if that's true, and if it isn't, what animal holds that distinction? -boing

August 6, 1999, 02:57 AM	#12
dZ Senior Member Join Date: May 31, 1999 Location: Exiled, Fetid Swamp, DC Posts: 7,548	one of our photographers got grabbed by a hippo while shooting in the water he got away with some scars... they are territorial and feed on land at night they are dangerous if you are unaware but i think sapiens is the most dangerous... dZ

August 6, 1999, 10:57 AM	#13
Paul B. Senior Member Join Date: March 28, 1999 Location: Tucson, AZ Posts: 3,800	I think the question should have been, Are gun writers for real? I have a pen pal who is an Alaskan guide. He took one of our illustrious gun magazine writers out on a trip. This supposedly good hangun hunter shot and wounded an animal( I forget what it was) about 6 times, finally used a rifle and shot the poor critter several times more. Finally my pen pal had to finish the animal off. I am beginning to think most of these gun writers are full of bull. There was an article in one of the gun magazines about 30 + years ago, where this fellow was at one time a game warden in Mexico. He writes of a "well known" gun writer that he arrested for killing two does out of season in Mexico. He could not believe his eyes, when he read that these two does became "magnificent bucks" when the writer wrote up the story on his hunt. From some of the books I have read, I would not be surprised the the doe shooters initials were J O'C. Maybe one has to be full of blarney to be a gun writer. Paul B.

August 6, 1999, 11:06 AM	#14
Futo Inu Senior Member Join Date: February 12, 1999 Location: Oklahoma City, OK, USA Posts: 3,624	Boing, the report I heard was that hippos kill more people in Africa than all of the "big 5" dangerous animals combined (lion, leopard, rhino, elephant, cape buffalo). They are extremely territorial and bad-tempered and will almost always charge if you get close. Their teeth are razor sharp, too.

August 8, 1999, 12:40 PM	#15
boing Senior Member Join Date: December 24, 1998 Location: WNC Posts: 1,072	COOL! I want one! -boing