What's your opinion of the "Special Grade" Garand?

[FoghornLeghorn]

I'm looking at the CMP sales page for the Garand.

http://odcmp.com/Sales/m1garand.htm

I like the description of the "Special Grade" Garand for $995. This grade has no historical significance and isn't likely to be sought by collectors, but I like it. I want to use it for the range and for hunting, and it sounds like basically a new gun.

I'll likely shoot military surplus or ammo specific to the M1, so changing out the vent plug won't be necessary. I also reload and have all components for the caliber.

What's the opinion of the FL? Is $995 an outrageous price for a Garand, particularly one with no historical significance?

[Technosavant]

I have one.

The CMP Special is what you get when you want a M1 Garand and you'd rather have a basically new rifle that will shoot extremely well than a collector's piece. I wouldn't say they have no historical value, I will say they are of very limited interest to the collector.

My CMP Special has a December 1942 production serial number and a fair amount of WWII hardware on it (not everything, but a few pieces). It came out of the box looking brand new, but it did need a good greasing (it was bone dry) and the stock was also in dire need of a lot of oil (a couple dozen coats of BLO will work wonders). It looks great and shoots very well. I am very pleased with it.

Keep in mind that although the Special, being made out of assorted parts with a new stock and barrel, is not going to be that interesting to most collectors right now, some of the others are also not entirely original. Truly original M1s just don't really exist- if they're out there they are super expensive. So it's more of a sliding scale of historical and collector's interest.

My own suspicion is that when the M1 well has dried up, interest in these Specials will build... they won't ever be as sought after by collectors as some of the others, but they will be sought after by those wanting a great shooting Garand.

[P5 Guy]

They sound like they will be great shooters. And everyone that wants to shoot a piece of American history should consider a rifle from the CMP. The Special Grade rifles are the best for those that want to shoot a lot. The fit of the stock and a brand new barrel will give the shooter the best bet for good results.
Another bit of advice for better shooting would be to learn handloading as the military surplus and by extension the proper pressure ammo for the M1, will be running out in the future.

[NWPilgrim]

They look beautiful. Best part is the new barrel. I saw them on the rack at Port Clinton and would have bought one but happened to find a very nice Service Grade on the rack, too. If I was buying again mail order I would definitely get the Special.

[nate_g_2003]

I have a .30-06 Special on order right now, hopefully getting to me before Christmas. I went with the Special because I want a rifle I can shoot, and not worry about if shooting is will make it less valuable (it's a stretch, I know). I don't really classify myself as a collector of guns; I buy guns that I find appealing, and those I want to shoot. I don't really have a place (or budget) to buy a gun and not shoot it (Why buy it and NOT shoot it?).

When I first started reading up on them, the throat erosion and muzzle erosion sort of freaked me out, so I settled on the Special with the new barrel. I'm sure there are M1s out there with readings that seem terrible, but will outshoot my Special with no problem (not withstanding operator error ).

As for the price, a "brand new" Garand for under $1K seemed like a great deal to me. All the Garands I see on various websites are listed for more than that, and don't even get me started on gun show pricing!

[tahunua001]

yes and no.
considering that outside of the CMP there is no such thing as a M1 that costs less than $1000 unless it's beat to hell or the owner has no idea how much they can actually get out of it. under most circumstances any new production parts, even if they maintain the original configuration, reduces the value of the rifle. however considering that it's mechanically the same, is not really a reproduction or fake from the standpoint that it's mostly original and you are guaranteed good wood and perfect bore it is great if all you want is a shooter.

[FoghornLeghorn]

Thanks for the responses. I've had the paperwork ready (and there's quite a bit of that) since last year.

I'll be sending off my check and paperwork tomorrow.

Thanx again.

[rdmallory]

Better get them while you can. Never can tell when they get low enough to start auctioning them off. You can't touch a M1 carbine less the 1K on CMP now.


Doug

[Technosavant]

My guess is that they may have the CMP Special grade when the others are gone. Since they're basically parts guns built up from whatever is on hand with new barrels and stocks, they'd be easier to source than most other grades.

Eventually the tap WILL run dry. They won't get any cheaper. So yeah, if someone wants one, I'd not wait.

[JR_Roosa]

What's the opinion of the FL? Is $995 an outrageous price for a Garand, particularly one with no historical significance?

No, it's a steal. Don't compare it to collectible antique rifles or to milsurp rifles, because it's a different beast.

Really you want to compare it to an entry level M1A that sells for around $1400 right now. The special grade is sort-of a new rifle. Granted some of the new looking refinished parts can actually be pretty worn, but it has a new rifle look, and the barrel is excellent for a non-match rifle.

The only upgrades I would consider would be a trigger job (~$80) and maybe a hooded rear match sight with a narrow front post (~$30 each) which would then make it comparable to the $1700 "Loaded" M1A, and will improve accuracy by an inch or two at 100yds in my experience.

Also consider that the small parts are almost all USGI, and think what you would pay for an M1A with all USGI parts.

If you want a collector rifle, just wait 10 or 20 years. The CMP Garands didn't go anywhere...they're all sitting in safes and being carefully preserved. Many of them will be back on the market again someday, and probably in numbers that outstrip demand. You'll never see them again at the old CMP prices, but I doubt that they will ever become unaffordable by most folks.

-J.

[tahunua001]

No, it's a steal. Don't compare it to collectible antique rifles or to milsurp rifles, because it's a different beast.

pretty sure it's not a different beast. it's a military surplus arm no ifs, ands, or buts about it.

Really you want to compare it to an entry level M1A that sells for around $1400 right now

the fact that it's been "molested" by new production parts changes nothing. if it was 100% brand new then it could be compared to the M1a but as it is not the only way that one could logically compare the two is if M1As were built on military surplus receivers.

Also consider that the small parts are almost all USGI, and think what you would pay for an M1A with all USGI parts.

what you need to realize is that there were 6.5 million M1 garands made and under 1.4 million M14s made. half of those were destroyed and another 3rd were sold to other countries. add the fact that fire control groups on M14s are class 3 parts there are not a whole lot of them(think low thousands) in circulation.

there is no way that you can logically think that an M1 garand has anywhere near the worth of an M14.

[JR_Roosa]

Hey Tahunua. You make good points, but I think you took my post the wrong way.

there is no way that you can logically think that an M1 garand has anywhere near the worth of an M14.

What do you mean by worth? I think we are talking about two different issues. Are you saying that the CMP Special grade isn't worth the $1000?

the only way that one could logically compare the two is if M1As were built on military surplus receivers.

I'm comparing the relative price/functionality of the two, which I think makes the Special Grade more appealing than if you compare it to other CMP Garands or collectible milsurps. I agree that it's still a milsurp rifle that's been reworked and isn't newly manufactured. I also agree that the current Service Grade rifles are even more of a steal at $700, although the luck-of-the-draw issue creeps in a little.

If you want a non-collectible 30 cal semi auto battle rifle that looks new and will hold around 2 to 3 MOA, you can get a CMP special grade that will perform similarly to a Springfield Inc. M1A and save $500. I think that the extra $500 gets you a factory warranty, new parts instead of new-looking parts, more available appropriate ammo, and a detachable magazine, which is worth it if you have the $500 to spend.

Wouldn't you agree that USGI M14 parts have increasing value as much for their quality as for their rarity? I'm saying that the USGI parts on the Garand are of similar quality to the M14 USGI parts, and probably better quality than the parts on a new M1A. They also cost a lot less because of the rarity of available M14 parts, making the Garand a lot more affordable platform.

Would I pay a premium for a nicely made M1A built on a quality commercial receiver with NOS USGI M14 parts? You bet!

Would I pay a premium for a correct Garand in really good condition? You bet!

What did I do to get my first rifle to shoot in matches? I didn't have much money to spend and so I went with the Special Grade, and it got me through several seasons before I needed to upgrade, and it won a few of those matches. It's new Criterion barrel outshoots by a few points my other Garands with their slightly used USGI barrels, even though they will have increasing collector value that the Special Grade will never really have. I also don't cry when it gets rained on, or if the rifle gets a ding or two, because it really doesn't have any collector value, and I could get it refinished or restocked and not ruin a piece of history.

-J.

[NWPilgrim]

JR Roosa was comparing the value of $1,000 Garand to a $1,400 M1A, NOT the M14. He made no mention of the M14 at all. Of course a select fire M14 would be worth many times of an old semi-auto Garand.

I've made this exact decision three times. I would rather put $450 (at the time) or $650 down for a Service Grade Garand than $1,000 (at the time) or $1,400+ M1A. I did finally get an M1A but traded it off and after that bought two more Garands. For the last one I was on the verge of buying the Special grade but found an excellent Service Grade instead. If I buy another Garand it will be the Special Grade for sure.

If I was a match shooter I probably would go with the .308 M1A NM, but recreational shooting I agree with JR Roosa that the Garand is a unique value.

[JR_Roosa]

If I was a match shooter I probably would go with the .308 M1A NM, but recreational shooting I agree with JR Roosa that the Garand is a unique value.

My next custom build will be a match M1A, although probably not on an SAI receiver, so I do appreciate that platform too. To do that on an LRB lugged receiver with a Krieger barrel and McMillan stock with USGI parts and gunsmithing cost is going to break $4,000 I bet.

My last custom build was a match Garand, though. Between the field grade rifle, barrel, and all the gunsmithing work, I have $3,300 in it. It's a spectacular rifle. It also saved me a few bucks over the cost of the M1A match rifle.

-J.

[tahunua001]

perhaps I mis-read JR Roosa's post but he did ask to imagine the cost of a M1A with USGI parts in it. comparing the two is just not realistic in any fashion.

now considering that you get a lighter rifle with quick change, high capacity magazines and the ability to mount a scope without heavily modifying it, and not having to worry about what ammo you put in it, the $400 price difference become a lot more negligible.

[jaughtman]

Have you looked into the Special Service Grade? They have more "original parts" since they put them together from mostly HR pieces they find stored. I have one and LOVE IT!

J

[tahunua001]

the only difference between the service and service special is that you are guaranteed new wood... you do not get a new barrel out of the deal. if I was going to spend extra for a rifle in better condition I'd for out the extra $50 and get the one with a new barrel.

[jaughtman]

But I think those Special Service Grades have "almost new" barrels at the very least as all the metal outside of the stock pieces are listed as in "95% condition" collector grade - and they will all be real HR pieces. At least that is what the service people say at the store (and in their descriptions). I have handled dozens of the SSG's at the store and all appear to have unfired or barely-fired barrels (and recievers). I would think that would give them a heck of a lot more collector appeal as well as giving you a like-new rifle to fire....but like I said, I have been wrong a lot in my life. LOL.

J

[FALPhil]

I think jaughtman makes some really good points.

One of my Garands, the most recently acquired, is a Special grade H&R in the 5.6 million range. It has all the correct parts that a rifle in that range should have as it left the factory except for the stock, which is a brand new Dupage with the CMP cartouche. The barrel is not an aftermarket unit, but a correct barrel that gauges new. That's one of the benefits of hand selecting in the CMP store. I also have a correct H&R stock that came on one of my other Garands, but it is in only fair shape.

I plan to use the Special in JCG matches.

[JR_Roosa]

^^^

That sounds like a Service Grade Special, not the regular Special Grade that has the Criterion barrel.

They had a pile of those at the Western Games, and they were really pretty.

I think the consensus is that the Criterions outperform new GI barrels by a little bit. In a non-bedded, non match prepped rifle, I don't know how you would be able to tell. My Criterion with 3000 rounds downrange outshoots my service grade with a ME of 0 by a couple of points.

-J.

[nate_g_2003]

the only difference between the service and service special is that you are guaranteed new wood... you do not get a new barrel out of the deal. if I was going to spend extra for a rifle in better condition I'd for out the extra $50 and get the one with a new barrel.

That was my thinking. It was hard to choose between the Service Grade Special and the CMP Special. But the new barrel is what sold me.

[tahunua001]

But I think those Special Service Grades have "almost new" barrels at the very least as all the metal outside of the stock pieces are listed as in "95% condition" collector grade - and they will all be real HR pieces. At least that is what the service people say at the store (and in their descriptions). I have handled dozens of the SSG's at the store and all appear to have unfired or barely-fired barrels (and recievers). I would think that would give them a heck of a lot more collector appeal as well as giving you a like-new rifle to fire....but like I said, I have been wrong a lot in my life. LOL.

there is more than one kind of service grade special available depending on the demand for some. by February all that they were listing(aside from specials) were H&Rs now all of the H&Rs have sold and they are only listing springfields as they slowly collected them a couple to a crate and nobody was ordering because nobody knew that they had them. I'd wager there's a couple winchesters floating around too but they just don't have the numbers to warrant advertizing them. if the rifles are really in as good of condition as advertized then one must wonder why they needed the new wood to begin with.

[jaughtman]

Since I live near the Anniston store, I visit regular and bug the poor staff. LOL. I wondered that same thing and here is the reply I got from the staff:

Sir,

On our Service Grade Special rifle, we received the metal just as you see
it. We received the rifle (complete) without the wood. Our best guess is
that what you have is just the way it came from the factory and never issued
or fired (other than testing at the factory. For some reason, the military
removed the wood. All we did was install the wood (and the metal parts that
go on the wood (butt plate, screws, etc.).

Orest Michaels
Chief Operating Officer

So you see, you DO get a new (or almost-new) barrel with the Service Grade Special....AND they are all original parts (whether HR or Springfield). So I elected to go with the SGP as I figured it was new (barrel, reciever, and all) AND more (somewhat) collectable/correct....but to each their own. Great rifles, all of them!

[FALPhil]

That sounds like a Service Grade Special, not the regular Special Grade that has the Criterion barrel.

JR, you are correct. I don't know what I was thinking. At the time I purchased this rifle, all the Anniston store had on the racks were a half dozen of these, some drill rifles, and a bunch of Cs and Ds (more Ds than Cs).