Is this legal to own or do I start up my torch?

sammy1234 · January 28, 2009, 09:05 AM

I cant seem to find the info regarding posession of a Mac 10 frame. I have a Mac 10 frame that was made by bending a flat over a mandrel. It has the grip frame also welded and holes drilled. I was originally going to build an open bolt or closed bolt 45 acp gun with BATF approval. But recently a friend told me that he thought the frame was illegal to own and that I have to torch cut it into 3 pieces? At what point is it considered a NFA weapon? I know this forum has the expertise I need. Also, I have a friend with a Powder Springs M 10 frame that does have a serial #, but no records to allow a transfer. Should this be torched too ??? Thanks in advance

PTK · January 28, 2009, 09:25 AM

That frame is an illegal MG and you just admitted ownership on a public forum. Not the brightest thing you've ever done.

goodspeed(TPF) · January 28, 2009, 09:28 AM

Good thing no one knows he lives at 123 Elm st. Springfield Il.

jmorris · January 28, 2009, 09:45 AM

You can’t make it into an SMG or an open bolt semi.

There are “kits” (- the frame) out there for closed bolt M11’s that would be legal. You might contact http://www.ftfindustries.com/mac_kits.htm and see if they can put anything together for your Mac 10 frame.

sammy1234 · January 28, 2009, 10:10 AM

Well, I guess that means the torch gets lit ! My question WAS, at what point does the frame or frame flat become an illegal thing to posess????

sundance43.5 · January 28, 2009, 07:21 PM

That sound outside your house is the black choppers coming to get you.

rabidgoldfish · January 28, 2009, 09:55 PM

Does it have the holes drilled for auto parts or semi parts?

If it has the right set of holes you should be ok. IANAL tho

David Hineline · January 28, 2009, 10:29 PM

By federal law frame building is fine untill you put in the holes or parts in the frame that make it a machine gun, open bolt fireing semi autos are also considered a machinegun.

If you build it to accept the full auto parts then you already broke the law.

When you speak of your friends powder springs 45 receiver, is it a machine gun receiver or a semi auto receiver. If machinegun it better find some paper. If an older pre-ban open bolt semi auto receiver then it will have some value, compared to a current production gun.

sammy1234 · January 29, 2009, 09:03 AM

David, THANK YOU! At last a response I can use. Believe it or not, I called the BATF to ask about this and got a response that "if it does not have a trigger group, or a hole drilled for a selector and or a final 3rd fold on the flat , it is ok > Furthermore, the agent told me that it is perfectly legal to own and make a closed bolt pistol without BATF approval if its for your own personal use. The problem comes in if you sell the weapon. Then you have to serial # it.

johnwilliamson062 · January 29, 2009, 09:18 AM

you have an unregistered receiver. If it was a 10/22 receiver it would be illegal.

armsmaster270 · January 29, 2009, 09:22 AM

In CA unless it was registered with DOJ prior to the assault weapon ban It is an illegal assault weapon full auto or semi auto no difference go to

http://ag.ca.gov/firearms/dwcl/12275.php

January 28, 2009, 09:05 AM	#1
sammy1234 Junior Member Join Date: January 28, 2009 Location: southern Cal Posts: 6	Is this legal to own or do I start up my torch? I cant seem to find the info regarding posession of a Mac 10 frame. I have a Mac 10 frame that was made by bending a flat over a mandrel. It has the grip frame also welded and holes drilled. I was originally going to build an open bolt or closed bolt 45 acp gun with BATF approval. But recently a friend told me that he thought the frame was illegal to own and that I have to torch cut it into 3 pieces? At what point is it considered a NFA weapon? I know this forum has the expertise I need. Also, I have a friend with a Powder Springs M 10 frame that does have a serial #, but no records to allow a transfer. Should this be torched too ??? Thanks in advance

January 28, 2009, 09:28 AM	#3
goodspeed(TPF) Senior Member Join Date: January 19, 2009 Location: WI Posts: 1,162	Good thing no one knows he lives at 123 Elm st. Springfield Il. __________________ It's a trick. Get an axe. http://www.thepiratefleet.com/index.shtml

January 28, 2009, 07:21 PM	#6
sundance43.5 Senior Member Join Date: March 6, 2001 Posts: 327	That sound outside your house is the black choppers coming to get you. __________________ "When in doubt, cut it out." - Roger Peterson, local doctor "Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote." - Benjamin Franklin, 1759

January 28, 2009, 10:29 PM	#8
David Hineline Senior Member Join Date: December 23, 1999 Location: South Sioux City, Nebraska Posts: 704	Not taking Californication into account By federal law frame building is fine untill you put in the holes or parts in the frame that make it a machine gun, open bolt fireing semi autos are also considered a machinegun. If you build it to accept the full auto parts then you already broke the law. When you speak of your friends powder springs 45 receiver, is it a machine gun receiver or a semi auto receiver. If machinegun it better find some paper. If an older pre-ban open bolt semi auto receiver then it will have some value, compared to a current production gun.

January 29, 2009, 09:03 AM	#9
sammy1234 Junior Member Join Date: January 28, 2009 Location: southern Cal Posts: 6	David, THANK YOU! At last a response I can use. Believe it or not, I called the BATF to ask about this and got a response that "if it does not have a trigger group, or a hole drilled for a selector and or a final 3rd fold on the flat , it is ok > Furthermore, the agent told me that it is perfectly legal to own and make a closed bolt pistol without BATF approval if its for your own personal use. The problem comes in if you sell the weapon. Then you have to serial # it. Last edited by sammy1234; January 29, 2009 at 01:45 PM.

January 28, 2009, 09:25 AM	#2
PTK Senior Member Join Date: March 20, 2008 Posts: 442	That frame is an illegal MG and you just admitted ownership on a public forum. Not the brightest thing you've ever done.

January 28, 2009, 09:45 AM	#4
jmorris Senior Member Join Date: November 22, 2006 Posts: 3,077	You can’t make it into an SMG or an open bolt semi. There are “kits” (- the frame) out there for closed bolt M11’s that would be legal. You might contact http://www.ftfindustries.com/mac_kits.htm and see if they can put anything together for your Mac 10 frame.

January 28, 2009, 10:10 AM	#5
sammy1234 Junior Member Join Date: January 28, 2009 Location: southern Cal Posts: 6	Well, I guess that means the torch gets lit ! My question WAS, at what point does the frame or frame flat become an illegal thing to posess????

January 28, 2009, 09:55 PM	#7
rabidgoldfish Junior Member Join Date: May 30, 2006 Posts: 3	Does it have the holes drilled for auto parts or semi parts? If it has the right set of holes you should be ok. IANAL tho

January 29, 2009, 09:18 AM	#10
johnwilliamson062 Junior member Join Date: May 16, 2008 Posts: 9,995	you have an unregistered receiver. If it was a 10/22 receiver it would be illegal.

January 29, 2009, 09:22 AM	#11
armsmaster270 Senior Member Join Date: November 25, 2008 Location: California Posts: 1,951	In CA unless it was registered with DOJ prior to the assault weapon ban It is an illegal assault weapon full auto or semi auto no difference go to http://ag.ca.gov/firearms/dwcl/12275.php __________________ http://www.armsmaster.net-a.googlepages.com http://s239.photobucket.com/albums/f...aster270/Guns/ Retired LE, M.P., Sr. M.P. Investigator F.B.I. Trained Rangemaster/Firearms Instructor & Armorer, Presently Forensic Document Examiner for D.H.S.