AR 10 style suggestion

[last]

I'd like to buy a .308 black rifle. I only have experience with military M16.

I'd like it to be my "one rifle". I'd prefer 16 inch barrel.
I selected these models:

- HK MR762 (a bit too expensive)
- Bushmaster MOE .308
- DPMS G2 Recon
- S&W MP 10 (a bit too long 18 inch)
- Ruger SR762 (like adjustable gas feature)

My favourite would be the Ruger, my second the Bushmaster. What do you think?

[Palmetto-Pride]

Out of the ones you mentioned the only one I have experience with is the M&P10 and I love mine its very accurate, lightweight for a AR10 type rifle, has ambidextrous controls. I actually like the 18" barrel over a 16" barrel because IMO and I think most will agree it takes at least a 18" barrel for a 308 to burn most of its powder before the bullet exits the barrel and hey what the hell is 2" when that will give you better performance and consistency.

[madcratebuilder]

ArmaLite AR-10A, uses SR-25 mags. There are some used AR-10B carbines around for sale. I found one for a total of $650 after I sold the scope and scope mount it came with. I went B model because I already have a AR-10B rifle with about a dozen mags

Under $1200 with the MOE furniture and ACOG. I still need to swap out the brake for a flash hider.

[skizzums]

they all sound like fine options. everyone seems to be building accurate and reliable ar's these days. my only recommendation, and it's a very serious one, is DO NOT get something that takes proprietary parts. sorry S&W. I would go with the DPMS if I had only those options.

me personally, would just start with this and buy the upper that had the options that I wanted
http://palmettostatearmory.com/index...-receiver.html

[Tucker 1371]

I'm gonna echo what has already been said. You want that extra 2" of barrel, .308 loses a lot of velocity going from 18" to 16". And I also advocate shopping around for parts and building your own. Palmetto State Armory has some very good deals for those looking to build their own AR and you can get exactly what you want as opposed to the limited options manufacturers put out there.

But of the rifles you suggested I would go with the Ruger. If you're open to suggestions the Sig 716 and Armalite AR-10A would be the two best bang for you buck IMO. Other than building your own of course.

[mardanlin]

I have a DPMS LR308 build that I absolutely love.

[novamark]

I would stay away from the DPMS G2. I have one and it craters the primers badly and leaves 2 extractor marks on the brass so bad that the cases cannot be reloaded. It is currently sent back for repair. Patiently waiting.

[Orion6]

Armalite's got a fairly new model, the DEF10. It takes the cheaper SR25 mags (Magpul makes some) and it has a chrome-lined barrel.

I've seen them around $900.

[slim9300]

I just bought the Ruger SR-762 on Gunbroker brand new for $1530 plus $30 shipping. I think Tucker may be mistaken on the velocity loss. I was concerned about this myself and did quite a bit of research. Here is one example of what I found...

http://www.realguns.com/articles/549.htm





I bought the rifle because I wanted something that would shoot sub MOA and be accurate out to 800 yards with a small and reasonably weighted package. I bought the Timney single stage trigger and will be buying the Magpul UBR stock (with heavy buffer setup of course). I'll let you know what I think when I get to shoot it.

[mardanlin]

I'd go with the DPMS. I have an LR308 build that does sub MOA groups all day long, the interchangeable parts sealed the deal for me.

[4V50 Gary]

Hogan Guns if you want:

Ambidextrous bolt catch release (built in)
Accepts Mag-Pul mags

[ranger56528]

I went with a DPMS LR308 to keep cost down but still have a nice shooter it Came home yesterday and I'm going to the range Tues to see how it likes Prvi 165 grain and also try some Win 150 grain power points. The only other ARs I have are in .223/556 a Bushmaster and a Sig M400.

[R.Ph. 380]

One more vote for the DPMS LR308 upper at least. Mine is on a high end Red-X-Arms lower. Stable and rock solid and a 20"

[Duzell]

what about aero precision>?

they are dpms mod style and are forged and really good quality

just throwing that out

also have BCG forward assist and NiB BCG with forward assist slots

[Fishbed77]

DO NOT get something that takes proprietary parts.

Every AR-10 pattern rifle on the market has some proprietary parts.

I suppose if you wanted a DI rifle that has been standardized by the US military, though, you would have to get a KAC SR-25. That would be the closest thing to a modern "AR-10" that has been standardized.

[dakota1911]

Bought a Ruger SR-762 last year and really like it.

[Dirty_Harry]

Out of those the HK is going to be the nicest/best. If funds were of no concern it is what I would buy. That being said if I were going to buy one tomorrow it would be the Ruger. I hear nothing but rave reviews. It looks great, CHF chrome lined barrel, the handguard is really nice, piston (while some of you scoff at a piston it is more of a plus than a negative), and has nice standard sights. I think it's a lot of rifle for the money.

Another to add to the list is the LMT MWS. It's in between the Ruger and HK on price points. Noting but rave reviews on this rifle.

I don't have experience with 308 ar's, so take my opinion with a grain of salt. I do read a lot of info about them, and the Ruger seems like a steal to me. I might actually break down and buy a Ruger eventually. This is coming from an M1A guy.

[G.barnes]

I was the opposite about the ruger. I liked it when I got it. But being forced to only use that handguard and that huge gas block that makes up part of the rail. Nothing like a big hot gas block right where your support hand goes.

[A pause for the COZ]

Hey!! Thanks for posting that load data for 16inch AR10
I was curious how well the 16 inch barrel will hold up fps wise.
I suspect the longer barrel would come in handy when you need to shoot farther.
But if I get a 200 yard shot that will be along way for me.

OH, I have a PTAC Tach 10. So far so good after 500 rounds not even one fail to feed. Not bad for $699 complete ready to shoot.

[Tucker 1371]

I just bought the Ruger SR-762 on Gunbroker brand new for $1530 plus $30 shipping. I think Tucker may be mistaken on the velocity loss. I was concerned about this myself and did quite a bit of research. Here is one example of what I found...

Nope not mistaken. It's high school physics, you DO lose velocity with a 2" shorter barrel. And with all but one factory load that loss of barrel length was what I would consider significant, about 200fps. If you're going to hand load for it then go right ahead and get the 16", I'm sure you can work up a load that will match most factory loads from an 18" barrel. But that same load will perform better out of a 18" barrel.

I'm not saying 16" .308s are useless. I AM saying that the .308 Win/7.62 NATO round was developed back when folks thought soldiers should still be taking well aimed shots out to 600m and further in combat. Anything .308 is NOT a CQB rifle, trying to make it one will provide less than optimal results. What you have is a heavy, LOUD, hard recoiling, low capacity weapon in a situation where none of those things are really acceptable. Try shooting a 16" bbl .308 next to a wall, the muzzle blast will jack up your sinuses and dang near liquefy your eardrums. IMHO 16" .308s really only fill one role better than longer barreled .308s and that is for hog hunting.

If you want a DM rifle for SHTF an 18" is going to serve you best because it will push those 168gr match bullets further and flatter, or any bullet for that matter. If you want a hunting rifle 18" will serve you better for the same reason, heavier bullet go faster. If you want a match gun... Ditto. If you want a room clearing gun... Get a 5.56/5.45x39/7.62x39/6.8 SPC. If you want a rifle that will do everything in a compact package you need to go with a 6.5 Grendel and that ammo is just too dang expensive for my taste.

[Duzell]

or the ptr ? they work fine and are a good 308 as well and a lower cost to the h&K

[stagpanther]

I bought the original LRT SASS many years ago--still a phenomenal tack-driver. A little "secret" I learned when I shot factory ammo through it--the budget Atomic 168 with Nosler custom comp shot as well as any premium priced ammo I ever put through her--even though it's some of the nastiest looking stuff I've ever bought.

[slim9300]

Originally Posted by Tucker 1371

Nope not mistaken. It's high school physics, you DO lose velocity with a 2" shorter barrel. And with all but one factory load that loss of barrel length was what I would consider significant, about 200fps. If you're going to hand load for it then go right ahead and get the 16", I'm sure you can work up a load that will match most factory loads from an 18" barrel. But that same load will perform better out of a 18" barrel.

Tucker. Your reading comprehension is lacking. Those numbers I posted were a 24" barrel versus a 16.125" barrel. That's roughly an 8" difference in barrel length that caused 220-78 fps of velocity loss. The difference between an 18" and 16" barrel isn't going to be more that 20-50 fps. Which means nothing. I bet I could find a few different factory rounds with the same bullet weight that shoot faster out of a 16" barrel than say the Hornady Superformance out of an 18" barrel (The Remington Express being one of them).

And I do plan on buying a few types of high-end factory ammo and shooting them through my chrono and obviously for some groups at the same time. I am hoping my gun prefers the Nosler Match Grade 168 grain custom. My buddies REPR was capable of 2" groups at 300 yards with this ammo from a sub optimal shooter (me). I was very impressed. And my .300 RUM Sendero sure likes the same ammo in the 180 AB.

Furthermore, there have been guys that shot 1000 yard competitions with the 16" OBR 7.62 and decimated the competition. When I planned on buying the OBR in 7.62, I had LaRue telling me all about it over the phone. They specifically said, there is no evidence in their option that a longer barrel is more accurate than a 16" barrel in their platform. But my hunting rifle still has a 26" barrel and a bolt action. Just for fun I may shoot my Muley buck in Montana this year with my SR-762.

[buckhorn_cortez]

Here's a link to a test of barrel lengths with a .308.

The test is from 28-inches to 16.5-inches in 1-inch increments. The velocity loss from 18-inches to 16.5-inches is NEGLIBIBLE with all bullet weights tested - 147, 168, and 180 grain bullets.

For example, the velocity using 168 grain Federal Gold Medal ammunition is 2523 FPS from an 18-inch barrel, and 2466 from the 16-inch barrel - that's 57 FPS.

If you want a shorter barreled .308 - I don't think velocity loss difference between an 18-inch barrel and 16.5-inch barrel is really an important factor in the rifle choice.

[slim9300]

Originally Posted by buckhorn_cortez

Here's a link to a test of barrel lengths with a .308.



The test is from 28-inches to 16.5-inches in 1-inch increments. The velocity loss from 18-inches to 16.5-inches is NEGLIBIBLE with all bullet weights tested - 147, 168, and 180 grain bullets.



For example, the velocity using 168 grain Federal Gold Medal ammunition is 2523 FPS from an 18-inch barrel, and 2466 from the 16-inch barrel - that's 57 FPS.



If you want a shorter barreled .308 - I don't think velocity loss difference between an 18-inch barrel and 16.5-inch barrel is really an important factor in the rifle choice.

Exactly. Thank you for posting that!