Racist History of Handgun Bans in America - Page 3

skydiver3346 · April 20, 2009, 09:58 PM

Am I out of touch here? Maybe I just don't have all the facts? But I gotta go with Antipitas's comments myself.

18indycolts: I'm sure you are a good guy. But to me, these kind of statements (you just made here) are a little overboard. I'm sure you pushed a lot of folk's buttons with your comments. But I do respect your right to espouse your beliefs. It is good that we have a forum here on the Firing Line to do just that.

**44 AMP** · April 20, 2009, 11:37 PM

To discuss our opinions of the Founding Fathers, I fear that the continued drift from the OP would lead to thread closure.

However, before I leave this subject (perhaps we might discuss these things privately? or in a different thread?) I would like to explain two things in my point of view.

1) That I consider the "Founding Fathers" to be more than just those individuals signing the Declaration of Independence, and so well remembered in history. To me, our Founding Fathers includes all those who joined in and made the Revolution successful. Not just the "wealthy elitist males", but the rank and file citizen soldiers too. And those at home who supported them and their cause, men and women.

2) "All men are created equal" A true phrase. All of us are created equal, through the biological act of procreation. The same for the rich and powerful as it is for the poor and powerless. It doesn't mean that all men are equal, and it never did. Only that since we are all created equal, we should all be equally treated under the law.

As to the origins of our gun control laws, I see them as racist, broadly as the term is commonly used today, by application, if not outright design. Even the Sullivan Laws, aimed at ethnic groups racially white, would be in that category, as well.

It is a well recognised fact that laws always have unintended consequences. Even though many of the laws originators fail to behave as if they understand this. I think the "racist" originators of our early gun control laws would be quite upset at how their laws are being applied today! Too bad for us they didn't think of that, and kept their pens and their votes to themselves.

The law is the law, and must be applied to everyone equally. I don't agree with the need or the usefulness of most gun control laws, but until they are changed, they are the law, and what we must comply and live with.

Until they pass a law saying I can't complain about them, I will continue to do so. And I think you should too!

#18indycolts · April 21, 2009, 10:13 AM

Quote:

Just because someone pickets and questions power doesn't make them wise.

Tell that to the women that fought for their rights, tell that to the working class that fought for better conditions, shorter work days, workmans comp and PAID holidays and vacations. Tell that to the blacks that fought for equality and civil rights. Those that picket and question power are those that bled and died for others rights. I'm sorry but I feel it to be a WONDERFUL thing for people to question power, especially Government power...if you don't then will you be ok for them to take your gun rights away? You have to fight and think for yourself.

Al Norris · April 21, 2009, 01:49 PM

It looks as if my comments have sidetracked this thread.

The only remedy I can apply, since everyone appears to want to discuss the side issue instead of the main issue, is to close the thread, due to thread veer.

April 20, 2009, 09:58 PM	#51
skydiver3346 Senior Member Join Date: December 22, 2007 Location: Florida Posts: 1,222	"Racism, Tyranny, Genocide and Class Warfare"??? Am I out of touch here? Maybe I just don't have all the facts? But I gotta go with Antipitas's comments myself. 18indycolts: I'm sure you are a good guy. But to me, these kind of statements (you just made here) are a little overboard. I'm sure you pushed a lot of folk's buttons with your comments. But I do respect your right to espouse your beliefs. It is good that we have a forum here on the Firing Line to do just that.

April 20, 2009, 11:37 PM	#52
44 AMP Staff Join Date: March 11, 2006 Location: Upper US Posts: 28,846	Much as I would like to continue... To discuss our opinions of the Founding Fathers, I fear that the continued drift from the OP would lead to thread closure. However, before I leave this subject (perhaps we might discuss these things privately? or in a different thread?) I would like to explain two things in my point of view. 1) That I consider the "Founding Fathers" to be more than just those individuals signing the Declaration of Independence, and so well remembered in history. To me, our Founding Fathers includes all those who joined in and made the Revolution successful. Not just the "wealthy elitist males", but the rank and file citizen soldiers too. And those at home who supported them and their cause, men and women. 2) "All men are created equal" A true phrase. All of us are created equal, through the biological act of procreation. The same for the rich and powerful as it is for the poor and powerless. It doesn't mean that all men are equal, and it never did. Only that since we are all created equal, we should all be equally treated under the law. As to the origins of our gun control laws, I see them as racist, broadly as the term is commonly used today, by application, if not outright design. Even the Sullivan Laws, aimed at ethnic groups racially white, would be in that category, as well. It is a well recognised fact that laws always have unintended consequences. Even though many of the laws originators fail to behave as if they understand this. I think the "racist" originators of our early gun control laws would be quite upset at how their laws are being applied today! Too bad for us they didn't think of that, and kept their pens and their votes to themselves. The law is the law, and must be applied to everyone equally. I don't agree with the need or the usefulness of most gun control laws, but until they are changed, they are the law, and what we must comply and live with. Until they pass a law saying I can't complain about them, I will continue to do so. And I think you should too! __________________ All else being equal (and it almost never is) bigger bullets tend to work better.

April 21, 2009, 01:49 PM	#54
Al Norris Moderator Emeritus Join Date: June 29, 2000 Location: Rupert, Idaho Posts: 9,660	It looks as if my comments have sidetracked this thread. The only remedy I can apply, since everyone appears to want to discuss the side issue instead of the main issue, is to close the thread, due to thread veer.