Shotshells...

rmagill · February 22, 2006, 11:35 PM

In another thread, the idea of useing shotshells to stop a dog came up. This made me wonder what a shotshell is. My guess is that they are basically like a shotgun shell, except for a handgun. If this is accurate, this would raise a few questions:

1) Wouldn't the rifleing in the barrel cause the pellets to not scatter in a neat pattern, but rather out to the sides (like with a rifled shotgun)?

2) Since the pellets would be smaller than a single bullet, they do not seem very effective at stoping someone. What is the intended use of these, and what is their value in a defense setting?

Or, I could be completely off on this. Please let me know. Thanks.

Twycross · February 23, 2006, 01:16 AM

Quote:

1) Wouldn't the rifleing in the barrel cause the pellets to not scatter in a neat pattern, but rather out to the sides (like with a rifled shotgun)?

Yes.

Quote:

2) Since the pellets would be smaller than a single bullet, they do not seem very effective at stoping someone. What is the intended use of these, and what is their value in a defense setting?

I think they are intended for close-range small game and as a novelty item. At least those are the only uses I can see for them. For a defensive scenario, I don't see much practicality, unless for defending yourself from snakes.

#18indycolts · February 23, 2006, 02:57 AM

personal protection against a dog? I'm more worried about Billy Ray or Leroy trying to take me!

Ga Johnny · February 25, 2006, 11:41 PM

they work well on snakes

almark · February 26, 2006, 01:48 AM

Snakes are about all I've found 'em to be good for, and that only at close range (at least with the.22... higher caliber shotshells may be more effective). Honestly since they spread out quite a bit I always wondered how people even used them for snakes, but what I've found them to be really good for are snakes in a confined space such as a barn. You're already going to be close to the snake so killing it with the relatively weak shotshells isn't a problem, and the birdshot bounces relatively harmlessly off of corrugated tin walls instead of punching through (eye protection is a must).

I would NOT trust shotshells to stop anything larger than a snake or mouse (not even a rat, which is ironic considering that these loads are often called "ratshot"). As far as people using them for defensive loads, I've only heard of this being done with revolvers, and the first chamber is the only one loaded with ratshot... the rationale is that the ratshot could be shot into someone's face blinding them while you make a retreat. Personally I think that would be more of a liability than anything but that's my personal opinion... if I were going that route I would use pepper spray instead.

Now, there are reloads floating around (I've seen them in Cabela's at least) that are like shotshells, but they contain two or three balls of buckshot instead of the tiny birdshot found in most shotshells. These may be viable for dog defense, but I've never shot them and have no idea what their shooting characteristics are like. I would still probably choose a good JHP for defense against two legged critters.

As you can see in the picture I've attached, the shot inside these things is pretty tiny (this is a CCI .22 LR)... I believe it's #12 shot, but I could be wrong.

kozak6 · February 26, 2006, 02:32 AM

I think they were mentioned in the dog thread because they are more likely to discourage a dog rather than flat out kill it.

Nortonics · February 26, 2006, 08:52 AM

I could see the Speer Plastic Training bullets being a deterrent (rather than a deadly force bullet) against a dog - maybe.

These things are fired off with a primer only - either regular or magnum which typically yields around 400 and 500 fps respectively. Made in .45 ACP or 38 Spl. And no, they don't produce enough power to rack a 1911 slide so the only real choice in this matter would be a 38 Spl wheelgun.

I loaded up some of those 38 Spl's and tried 'em out in the garage - I was surprised by the power! At 20 feet with a 2" j-frame, with a cotton bath towel backstop, the damn things went right thorough the target AND the cotton towel, then proceeded to get deformed after hitting the motorcycle trailer behind that! And Speer says "careful 'cause they could break skin..."

February 26, 2006, 08:52 AM	#7
Nortonics Senior Member Join Date: December 2, 2004 Location: Murderapolis Posts: 521	I could see the Speer Plastic Training bullets being a deterrent (rather than a deadly force bullet) against a dog - maybe. These things are fired off with a primer only - either regular or magnum which typically yields around 400 and 500 fps respectively. Made in .45 ACP or 38 Spl. And no, they don't produce enough power to rack a 1911 slide so the only real choice in this matter would be a 38 Spl wheelgun. I loaded up some of those 38 Spl's and tried 'em out in the garage - I was surprised by the power! At 20 feet with a 2" j-frame, with a cotton bath towel backstop, the damn things went right thorough the target AND the cotton towel, then proceeded to get deformed after hitting the motorcycle trailer behind that! And Speer says "careful 'cause they could break skin..." __________________ Tom.

February 22, 2006, 11:35 PM	#1
rmagill Senior Member Join Date: March 29, 2005 Location: Pennsylvania Posts: 142	Shotshells... In another thread, the idea of useing shotshells to stop a dog came up. This made me wonder what a shotshell is. My guess is that they are basically like a shotgun shell, except for a handgun. If this is accurate, this would raise a few questions: 1) Wouldn't the rifleing in the barrel cause the pellets to not scatter in a neat pattern, but rather out to the sides (like with a rifled shotgun)? 2) Since the pellets would be smaller than a single bullet, they do not seem very effective at stoping someone. What is the intended use of these, and what is their value in a defense setting? Or, I could be completely off on this. Please let me know. Thanks.

February 23, 2006, 02:57 AM	#3
#18indycolts Junior member Join Date: January 3, 2006 Location: Indpls Posts: 1,159	personal protection against a dog? I'm more worried about Billy Ray or Leroy trying to take me!

February 25, 2006, 11:41 PM	#4
Ga Johnny Member Join Date: January 19, 2006 Posts: 75	they work well on snakes

February 26, 2006, 02:32 AM	#6
kozak6 Senior Member Join Date: June 16, 2005 Location: AZ Posts: 3,113	I think they were mentioned in the dog thread because they are more likely to discourage a dog rather than flat out kill it.