overengineered guns

[kcub]

I don't want to do anything unsafe for myself or recommend it to others. The following thoughts and questions have come to mind.

The beefy HK USP was designed for the .40; ergo, I would feel fine about shooting 9mm +P+ ammo in a USP 9mm giving you a gun with 357 power and maximum capacity. But would it need stronger recoil and firing pin springs? If so, would it still be reliable with standard 9mm?

Similar question about the HK Mark 23 in .45 ACP. Other than the Desert Eagle, I don't know of a more massive autopistol. Could it be converted to .45 Super, maybe with just heavier recoil and firing pin springs and would it still be reliable with standard .45 ACP? The premise for this is the following series of articles about converting a .45 Kimber to .45 Super for $8 that starts here:
http://www.realguns.com/rgsearch/sea...ch=1&x=60&y=16

[B.O.F.H.]

You don't need to swap any springs to shoot +p+ out of your 9mm. How much do you plan to shoot through it.?

[TunnelRat]

You've had a string of threads lately about essentially pushing certain firearms to their technical limits. I have to ask why?

[Venom1956]

cuz its moar POWERZ!

[wpsdlrg]

"cuz it's COOL"....say the "teenagers" in the crowd.

Glad I'm far removed from those days, to be sure......

[kcub]

a string of 2

just curiosity, just talk, thinking out loud

probably not a good idea

[TunnelRat]

just curiosity, just talk, thinking out loud

probably not a good idea

Hey it's your money and I'm not Diane Feinstein. It's no skin off my back.

But really I am just curious. Do you not find the standard pistol calibers up to your needs?

[kcub]

I've always got a mind towards hunting as well.

According to the HK USP manual they are very adamant about being able to withstand any amount of 9mm +P+ you want to throw at it. That being the case, who needs a .357 Sig if you can hold a few more rounds of 9mm +P+.

Regarding the MK23, it doesn't make sense to do that to a $2000 gun. Super up a much cheaper Glock or a beater 1911.

[TXAZ]

kcub scared the cr@& out of me by stating:

Other than the Desert Eagle, I don't know of a more massive autopistol. Could it be converted to .45 Super, maybe with just heavier recoil and firing pin springs and would it still be reliable with standard .45 ACP?

As a design engineer by training, I can't imagine taking any professionally designed product and 'converting it to XX SUPER' without knowing ALL OF THE ORIGINAL DESIGN PARAMETERS. In many products, the design margins are incredibly thin to maximize profits, minimize weight or meet other design or marketing criteria. Conversely, some products are grossly over-engineered specifically because they feel a consumer may 'do something stupid', or the product liability defense lawyers are managing the design process.

I'm aware first hand of systems designed for the military / intel community that were so high performance they never could be sold to the general public, not because of 'firepower', but because most consumers a) wouldn't read and follow the tech order, and b) probably wouldn't understand the nuances in slight operational mode differences, some of which may result in the death of the operator.

Minor differences in materials or tolerances can cause a simple or catastrophic failure, often with no overt difference to an untrained eye.

It's easy to experiment in minor increments and usually without permanent ramifications, but in the event others are thinking about 'wrapping piano wire around the barrel and doubling the powder', as one movie hero did, the chance for a disaster is very real.

{Thanks for letting me vent}

[kcub]

I respect your opinion but 45 super conversions have been around since the 80s. I have one done by Ace Hindman when he was still with us. Read the articles in the link in the op.

[Winchester_73]

+1 on NO REASON to convert a MK 23, which are no longer made TMK. I once had one of those, a first year example with the camo case. FWIW, the gun was DESIGNED to handle 45+P, which IMO is a nice compromise between thinking a 45 super would be cool in a MK 23 and of course, reality.

As for the H&K USP, I would simply go with (wait for it).....the factory recommendation for the gun! If its rated for +P, shoot that, and if rated +P+ you can shoot that. I wouldn't get into thinking "but the same model fires 357sig or 40 S&W so 2+2 it can take 9mm +P+."

In general, when power is discussed, I always come back to my thought that the most impressive thing with shooting such a pistol, or any pistol is your accuracy with it. Shooting it because its powerful never made sense to me. If you are good, and can handle it well, then go ahead. If you are someone who doesn't shoot a 45 acp well, or any pistol well, no need to think about bigger calibers.

If you really want a powerful 45 semi pistol, I suggest getting a 45 win mag.

[kcub]

I held a brand spank new mk23 in my hands Monday in my lgs, so they evidently are still made. $2050 plus tax. For my money, and we're talking half as much, I'd rather have the USP Expert or Tactical.

I agree with win_73. I need you guys to slap some sense into me from time-to-time.

[TunnelRat]

If you're shooting something the manufacturer says is no problem, go for it. The USP should take it.

I held a brand spank new mk23 in my hands Monday in my lgs, so they evidently are still made. $2050 plus tax. For my money, and we're talking half as much, I'd rather have the USP Expert or Tactical.

Agreed. To me the Mk23 is more of a collector.