Turkey load for vintage Model 12

Gascozark · March 6, 2012, 06:12 AM

Spring turkey season is a little over a month away here in Missouri. I am planning on using my great Grandfather's 1924 vintage Winchester model 12. It has a 28" full choke barrel, marked nickel steel if that makes a difference. Since the gun is 2 3/4", I know that I'm going to be limited to 25-30 yards and I'm okay with that. The limited range just adds to the challenge.
My question is, does anyone have a similar combination who could recommend a good 2 3/4" turkey load that would be safe for the barrel?
Thanks!

jrothWA · March 6, 2012, 11:17 AM

BUT recommend visiting a smith just to give a better thumbs-up, in case there's a broke part or something.

With the full choke best to look at the #4 or #6 shot for best pattern density.

Use no 2-3/4" magnum shells.

eastbank · March 6, 2012, 11:31 AM

first of all make sure its a 2-3/4 chamber. there are quite a few 1.5 oz turkey shells in 2-3/4 available. i use 1.5 oz #6 copper plated and they will kill turkeys out to 40 yds with the right choke. this full choke model 12 has bolled turkeys over at 40yds. eastbank.

oneounceload · March 6, 2012, 05:09 PM

Quote:

Since the gun is 2 3/4", I know that I'm going to be limited to 25-30 yards

HUH? One has nothing to do with the other - choke determines pattern distance and density, not shell length. Killed many a pheasant at 40+ yards with a modified choke and simple 2-3/4" shells loaded with #4

Gascozark · March 6, 2012, 06:39 PM

Quote:

first of all make sure its a 2-3/4 chamber.

Sorry, I guess I should have mentioned that. Besides being marked "nickel steel" both barrels that I have for the gun are marked 2 3/4. The other barrel is a cylinder bore barrel. Both barrels are serial number matching to the receiver, so it is a factory 2 barrel set.

I just figured that the range would be a bit limited due to the fact that it wasn't the latest, greatest, whiz-bang 3 1/2" shoulder killer like all the guys that I work with have.... :-)

jmr40 · March 6, 2012, 06:46 PM

If you pattern your gun you might be surprised. Often 2.75" shells shoot better patterns than 3" shells. There is absolutely no need for 3.5" shells for turkey hunting. I generally use 3" but would not feel handicapped at all with 2.75"

Gascozark · March 7, 2012, 05:13 PM

As I look around, I notice that most of the 2 3/4 "turkey" loads that are marketed say "mag" or "magnum" on the box. So I should avoid these shells for my old Model 12? Is there really that big a difference in a "magnum" that shoots at 1200 fps vs. a non-magnum load that shoots 1100 fps?

jimbob86 · March 7, 2012, 05:33 PM

You don't need a magnum load to kill a turkey. Just a load and choke combination to put a pattern with no head sized holes in it where you aim it, at a range you can call the bird to.

Folk that insist on they need a special superduper gun and load to take a turkey are gear-junkies, and are trying to buy hunting succes. They'd be better off with investing a bit more time scouting and learning to use the tools they have, rather than buying a solution that is not really necessary.

I took 2 toms last fall with 2 3/4" Winchester SuperX pheasant loads- #6 shot. Headshots are the key.

markj · March 7, 2012, 05:48 PM

I use winchester super X in 6 shot, the good ones not the low brass cheapies. 3 3/4 dram eq, 1 1/4 oz shot.

jimbob86 · March 7, 2012, 05:59 PM

The box of Super X I used last fall were 3 /14 dr eq, 1 oz. shot ....... seemed to work.

I have also killed turkeys with 7 1/2 shot dove loads ..... daughter Eldest killed a boss hen with a 7/8 oz load of 6's from her 20 guage ......

jmr40 · March 7, 2012, 07:07 PM

Quote:

As I look around, I notice that most of the 2 3/4 "turkey" loads that are marketed say "mag" or "magnum" on the box. So I should avoid these shells for my old Model 12? Is there really that big a difference in a "magnum" that shoots at 1200 fps vs. a non-magnum load that shoots 1100 fps?

I seriously doubt that the 2 3/4" magnum turkey loads will hurt your gun. If the extra 100 fps helps is hard to say. The only problem would be firing 3" shells in your gun. They will chamber, and fire. Shotshell length is measured "AFTER" the shell is fired. The actual length of 2 3/4" shells before firing is actually about 2 1/4 ", 3" shells are actually about 2 1/2". The chambers are cut 1/2" longer to allow room for the crimp to unfold.

The 3" shells will fit in the chamber and fire in 2 3/4" guns, but since there is limited room for the crimp to unfold, pressures are very high and you risk blowing up the barrel.

I don't completely agree with some other posters. While I don't see the need for the 3.5" shells, it doesn't hurt to have more pellets in each shell. The idea is to put as many pellets into a turkey's head and neck area as possible. At closer ranges most any shell will work. But you don't always get those 20 yard shots, especially when hunting public land where the birds are often educated early. At longer 30-40 yard shots bigger pellets carry more energy, and more of them increase the number of hits.

I prefer 3" shells with 1 3/4 oz of #5 shot. Shooting at pattern boards has shown this combination to provide dense enough patterns for a 35-40 yard shot if that is all I can get. I like the #5's as a good compromise between the larger number of pellets in a #6 load and the better retainied energy at longer range of the #4's.

If my gun would only take 2 3/4" shells it would be at most a small handicap, and maybe none at all. You just have to get out and shoot different shells and see what works best in your gun. It is not unusual at all to see better pattens from 2 3/4" shells than 3". Many of the 3.5" shells and guns don't shoot good patterns at all.

jimbob86 · March 7, 2012, 09:41 PM

Quote:

While I don't see the need for the 3.5" shells, it doesn't hurt to have more pellets in each shell.

Oh, but it does hurt: Those 3.5 inch uber mags recoil like a howitzer.

Nothing will cause a miss more readily than a flinch. It's darn hard to hit anything if your eyes are closed and you are running away from your gun at the shot........

Those buggers don't wear helmets (though their feathers make pretty good body armor vs. shot) ..... even at 40 yards, a #6 pellet will penetrate the skull, and be lethal (provided it hits it square*)........ the neck vertabrae are equally fragile.....

* the first bird I killed was hit by a single #2 pellet at 40ish yards, on the top of the head- it hit at a shallow angle, almost a graze- the bird keeled over, with it's feet in the air, quivering..... I laid the gun down, ran to it and hoisted it in the air in triumph by one foot.... whereupon it revived into a 23 pound kicking, scratching, pecking, wing beating fury ..... I fell on it and cut it's throat with my hunting knife ..... he beat me black and blue.

johnbt · March 8, 2012, 10:51 AM

My father used to kill turkeys with 2.75" #6 high brass using his Model 12 20 ga. One time he got two big toms with two shots as they were flying between the trees in the apple orchard. He was a good shot though.

Gascozark · March 9, 2012, 12:59 PM

Thanks for the encouraging replies. I'm going to go grab some various brands of high brass game loads in #4,5, & 6 and see how they pattern. I'll try to update this post with some pics later.
Thanks!

Greybeard · March 10, 2012, 10:55 PM

You may want to try and find some of the Federal loads with the "Flight Control" shot cup. While I have only used them in "low recoil" 00 loads, it is some amazing new "back braking" technology for holding the pellets together longer even out of a "cylinder" or "improved cylinder" barrel. If you can, pattern them (or anything else you buy) on something like the "Shoot and See" turkey head targets to learn your proper sight picture and pellet density at various distances.

March 6, 2012, 06:12 AM	#1
Gascozark Junior Member Join Date: February 14, 2012 Posts: 4	Turkey load for vintage Model 12 Spring turkey season is a little over a month away here in Missouri. I am planning on using my great Grandfather's 1924 vintage Winchester model 12. It has a 28" full choke barrel, marked nickel steel if that makes a difference. Since the gun is 2 3/4", I know that I'm going to be limited to 25-30 yards and I'm okay with that. The limited range just adds to the challenge. My question is, does anyone have a similar combination who could recommend a good 2 3/4" turkey load that would be safe for the barrel? Thanks!

March 10, 2012, 10:55 PM	#15
Greybeard Senior Member Join Date: April 7, 2002 Location: Denton County Texas Posts: 686	You may want to try and find some of the Federal loads with the "Flight Control" shot cup. While I have only used them in "low recoil" 00 loads, it is some amazing new "back braking" technology for holding the pellets together longer even out of a "cylinder" or "improved cylinder" barrel. If you can, pattern them (or anything else you buy) on something like the "Shoot and See" turkey head targets to learn your proper sight picture and pellet density at various distances. __________________ www.dentoncountysports.com A Private Palace for Pistol Proficiency

March 6, 2012, 11:17 AM	#2
jrothWA Senior Member Join Date: November 11, 2006 Posts: 2,519	You are genrally safe with STANDARD 2-3/4" shells,... BUT recommend visiting a smith just to give a better thumbs-up, in case there's a broke part or something. With the full choke best to look at the #4 or #6 shot for best pattern density. Use no 2-3/4" magnum shells.

March 6, 2012, 06:46 PM	#6
jmr40 Senior Member Join Date: June 15, 2008 Location: Georgia Posts: 10,809	If you pattern your gun you might be surprised. Often 2.75" shells shoot better patterns than 3" shells. There is absolutely no need for 3.5" shells for turkey hunting. I generally use 3" but would not feel handicapped at all with 2.75"

March 7, 2012, 05:13 PM	#7
Gascozark Junior Member Join Date: February 14, 2012 Posts: 4	As I look around, I notice that most of the 2 3/4 "turkey" loads that are marketed say "mag" or "magnum" on the box. So I should avoid these shells for my old Model 12? Is there really that big a difference in a "magnum" that shoots at 1200 fps vs. a non-magnum load that shoots 1100 fps?

March 7, 2012, 05:33 PM	#8
jimbob86 Junior member Join Date: October 4, 2007 Location: All the way to NEBRASKA Posts: 8,722	You don't need a magnum load to kill a turkey. Just a load and choke combination to put a pattern with no head sized holes in it where you aim it, at a range you can call the bird to. Folk that insist on they need a special superduper gun and load to take a turkey are gear-junkies, and are trying to buy hunting succes. They'd be better off with investing a bit more time scouting and learning to use the tools they have, rather than buying a solution that is not really necessary. I took 2 toms last fall with 2 3/4" Winchester SuperX pheasant loads- #6 shot. Headshots are the key.

March 7, 2012, 05:48 PM	#9
markj Senior Member Join Date: October 27, 2005 Location: Crescent Iowa Posts: 2,971	I use winchester super X in 6 shot, the good ones not the low brass cheapies. 3 3/4 dram eq, 1 1/4 oz shot.

March 7, 2012, 05:59 PM	#10
jimbob86 Junior member Join Date: October 4, 2007 Location: All the way to NEBRASKA Posts: 8,722	The box of Super X I used last fall were 3 /14 dr eq, 1 oz. shot ....... seemed to work. I have also killed turkeys with 7 1/2 shot dove loads ..... daughter Eldest killed a boss hen with a 7/8 oz load of 6's from her 20 guage ......

March 8, 2012, 10:51 AM	#13
johnbt Senior Member Join Date: December 6, 1999 Location: Richmond, Virginia USA Posts: 6,004	My father used to kill turkeys with 2.75" #6 high brass using his Model 12 20 ga. One time he got two big toms with two shots as they were flying between the trees in the apple orchard. He was a good shot though.

March 9, 2012, 12:59 PM	#14
Gascozark Junior Member Join Date: February 14, 2012 Posts: 4	Thanks for the encouraging replies. I'm going to go grab some various brands of high brass game loads in #4,5, & 6 and see how they pattern. I'll try to update this post with some pics later. Thanks!