Stove pipes with .45acp SWC

Casey · April 30, 2000, 09:58 PM

I am reloading .45acp with a Dillon SDB. I have reloaded about 10,000 round with 230 gr jacketed round nose, and had no problems other than usual; getting the right powder load, right OAL, etc...

I have just recently started shooting Rainer 200 gr SWC, and have been having problems. I load the round to 1.255 OAL, and use 3.8 gr of Clays. The accuracy is pretty good, but I have a problem with stove pipes (rounds stuck halfway into the chamber). I also have marks on roughly 75% of the brass that I use; a curved crease anywhere from 1/4 inch to 1/2 inch from the top of the case.

I am shooting a Kimber Gold Cup; the ramp has been polished. I usually shoot 300 to 400 rounds a week, and have been shooting this gun for about 9 monthes with no problems (of course, with either factory or my on reloads of 230 gr RN jacketed). Obviously, I know that John Browning designed this gun to shoot 230 gr RN, but I also know other Kimber .45 acp owners who shoot nothing but SWC.

Help!! Should I adjust the OAL up/down slightly, adjust the powder, give up???

Thanks.

Casey

alan · April 30, 2000, 10:55 PM

Have used neither the bullets nor powder you mentioned, but I load hard cast 200 grain SWC in a couple of 45 autos, without problems., I use an oal of 1.260 - 1.262, which seems to work fine. BTW, one of the 45's is a Kimber Classic Custom Target.

Your powder charge MIGHT be the problem. I shoot IPSC, and use 5.2 grains of Red Dot, (WORK UP FROM BELOW) which runs a 200 grain SWC at a bit over 900'/s, BALL EQUIVALENT LOAD.

char923 · April 30, 2000, 11:01 PM

Hi Casey
The curved crease on you brass is from it hitting your slide, The extractor is holding the case as the slide is moving back and when it hits the ejector, the ejector is trying to spin the case as it leaves the ejection port causing the case to hit the slide for it clear the gun. (The round stuck halfway into the camber),need more infor? A stone pipe is a case caught in the ejection port 90' to the barrel.

Steve Smith · April 30, 2000, 11:08 PM

I am NOT experienced enough to even call myself a reloader yet, however, I do have a little experience with guns. What you're describing doesn't sound like a "stovepipe." What you described is the loaded cartridge doesn't make it all the way into the chamber (it gets stuck half-way up the feed ramp, with the bullet inside the chamber...right?) Kimber has awfully tight chambers, and they do have feeding problems from time to time with SWC and such. Take it to a very competent 191 smith, and tell him you need the chamber reamed out throated)more. That'll fix you up. Sending it back to Kimber will get you an answer like, "The chamber is throated to our specs." So that won't do you any good. If this answer really bothers you, you can do two things: Find a 1911 that shoots SWC's reliably and measure the throating, and then measure yours (yours will be smaller I'd bet. Speak to Brian Bilby, either here or on TFL...he re-reams Kimber chambers all the time.

TaxPhd · May 1, 2000, 11:43 AM

Casey,

I think that Frontsight! has it right, and what you are experiencing is not a stovepipe, but a failure to go into battery.

This can be caused by a too tight chamber and poor/inadequate throating (as has been mentioned) as well as a too tight extractor, or a breech face that needs to be polished. Any competent 1911 'smith should be able to fix this.

Desert Dog · May 1, 2000, 12:41 PM

3.8 grs. of Clays is a pretty small charge... You may not be cycling the gun completely. Try some factory loads to make sure it's not the gun...

------------------
.45 Super... Fat and FAST...

"No provision in our Constitution ought to be dearer to man than that which protects the rights of conscience against the enterprises of the civil authority" - Thomas Jefferson

Casey · May 1, 2000, 12:56 PM

Yes, the 3.8 gr of Clays is a small load. And yes, I did try it with factory and it cycles just fine with factory. I am going to load some 1.260 and 1.265 OAL and see if a little more length will help.

If that is unsucessful, I will try upping the amount of Clays. I like the light load, it is very accurate but I usually load the 230gr RN with bigger loads of Clays or W231.

Just so no one will get any ammo to use against Kimber, shooting facory loads or any of the 230 gr RN that I load, this is an excellent pistol. Very accurate and VERY reliable. I own a Beretta 96 and a S&W 625, and the Kimber is the best (by far)!

Casey

Bill Daniel · May 1, 2000, 03:21 PM

Casey

For my 2 cents worth, my Kimber Gold Match with 18 lb. recoil spring will short shuck my loads as they approach "too light" and have failed to chamber when my OAL was "too short". My pistol likes OAL's around 1.265 +/- .005 in.

Bill Daniel

alan · May 1, 2000, 06:49 PM

Casey:

You might find 1.265 oal to long for slide to go to battery (fully locked). Depends on the individual pistol, however as I mentioned, I make an effort to hold to 1.260" oal, with 200 grain SWC, either H & G 68 mold, or "similar to".

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April 30, 2000, 09:58 PM	#1
Casey Senior Member Join Date: April 25, 2000 Location: Delaware, OH, USA Posts: 279	I am reloading .45acp with a Dillon SDB. I have reloaded about 10,000 round with 230 gr jacketed round nose, and had no problems other than usual; getting the right powder load, right OAL, etc... I have just recently started shooting Rainer 200 gr SWC, and have been having problems. I load the round to 1.255 OAL, and use 3.8 gr of Clays. The accuracy is pretty good, but I have a problem with stove pipes (rounds stuck halfway into the chamber). I also have marks on roughly 75% of the brass that I use; a curved crease anywhere from 1/4 inch to 1/2 inch from the top of the case. I am shooting a Kimber Gold Cup; the ramp has been polished. I usually shoot 300 to 400 rounds a week, and have been shooting this gun for about 9 monthes with no problems (of course, with either factory or my on reloads of 230 gr RN jacketed). Obviously, I know that John Browning designed this gun to shoot 230 gr RN, but I also know other Kimber .45 acp owners who shoot nothing but SWC. Help!! Should I adjust the OAL up/down slightly, adjust the powder, give up??? Thanks. Casey

April 30, 2000, 10:55 PM	#2
alan Senior Member Join Date: June 7, 1999 Posts: 3,847	Have used neither the bullets nor powder you mentioned, but I load hard cast 200 grain SWC in a couple of 45 autos, without problems., I use an oal of 1.260 - 1.262, which seems to work fine. BTW, one of the 45's is a Kimber Classic Custom Target. Your powder charge MIGHT be the problem. I shoot IPSC, and use 5.2 grains of Red Dot, (WORK UP FROM BELOW) which runs a 200 grain SWC at a bit over 900'/s, BALL EQUIVALENT LOAD.

April 30, 2000, 11:01 PM	#3
char923 Senior Member Join Date: February 18, 2000 Location: Anchorage AK Posts: 237	Hi Casey The curved crease on you brass is from it hitting your slide, The extractor is holding the case as the slide is moving back and when it hits the ejector, the ejector is trying to spin the case as it leaves the ejection port causing the case to hit the slide for it clear the gun. (The round stuck halfway into the camber),need more infor? A stone pipe is a case caught in the ejection port 90' to the barrel.

April 30, 2000, 11:08 PM	#4
Steve Smith Senior Member Join Date: December 9, 1999 Posts: 4,131	I am NOT experienced enough to even call myself a reloader yet, however, I do have a little experience with guns. What you're describing doesn't sound like a "stovepipe." What you described is the loaded cartridge doesn't make it all the way into the chamber (it gets stuck half-way up the feed ramp, with the bullet inside the chamber...right?) Kimber has awfully tight chambers, and they do have feeding problems from time to time with SWC and such. Take it to a very competent 191 smith, and tell him you need the chamber reamed out throated)more. That'll fix you up. Sending it back to Kimber will get you an answer like, "The chamber is throated to our specs." So that won't do you any good. If this answer really bothers you, you can do two things: Find a 1911 that shoots SWC's reliably and measure the throating, and then measure yours (yours will be smaller I'd bet. Speak to Brian Bilby, either here or on TFL...he re-reams Kimber chambers all the time.

May 1, 2000, 11:43 AM	#5
TaxPhd Senior Member Join Date: October 29, 1998 Location: Colorado Posts: 534	Casey, I think that Frontsight! has it right, and what you are experiencing is not a stovepipe, but a failure to go into battery. This can be caused by a too tight chamber and poor/inadequate throating (as has been mentioned) as well as a too tight extractor, or a breech face that needs to be polished. Any competent 1911 'smith should be able to fix this.

May 1, 2000, 12:41 PM	#6
Desert Dog Senior Member Join Date: September 22, 1999 Location: Deep East Texas Posts: 474	3.8 grs. of Clays is a pretty small charge... You may not be cycling the gun completely. Try some factory loads to make sure it's not the gun... ------------------ .45 Super... Fat and FAST... "No provision in our Constitution ought to be dearer to man than that which protects the rights of conscience against the enterprises of the civil authority" - Thomas Jefferson

May 1, 2000, 12:56 PM	#7
Casey Senior Member Join Date: April 25, 2000 Location: Delaware, OH, USA Posts: 279	Yes, the 3.8 gr of Clays is a small load. And yes, I did try it with factory and it cycles just fine with factory. I am going to load some 1.260 and 1.265 OAL and see if a little more length will help. If that is unsucessful, I will try upping the amount of Clays. I like the light load, it is very accurate but I usually load the 230gr RN with bigger loads of Clays or W231. Just so no one will get any ammo to use against Kimber, shooting facory loads or any of the 230 gr RN that I load, this is an excellent pistol. Very accurate and VERY reliable. I own a Beretta 96 and a S&W 625, and the Kimber is the best (by far)! Casey

May 1, 2000, 03:21 PM	#8
Bill Daniel Senior Member Join Date: February 10, 2000 Location: Bowling Green, KY. Posts: 518	Casey For my 2 cents worth, my Kimber Gold Match with 18 lb. recoil spring will short shuck my loads as they approach "too light" and have failed to chamber when my OAL was "too short". My pistol likes OAL's around 1.265 +/- .005 in. Bill Daniel

May 1, 2000, 06:49 PM	#9
alan Senior Member Join Date: June 7, 1999 Posts: 3,847	Casey: You might find 1.265 oal to long for slide to go to battery (fully locked). Depends on the individual pistol, however as I mentioned, I make an effort to hold to 1.260" oal, with 200 grain SWC, either H & G 68 mold, or "similar to".