Final Finish Bore Conditioning? - Page 2

mehavey · January 30, 2013, 11:26 AM

Fire Lapping is used for a very different pupose/diiferent end than Fire Polishing

Think 60 grit sandpaper to shape and uniform a surface.
Then 220-600 to make it mirror deep

reynolds357 · January 30, 2013, 04:18 PM

The Tubbs kit fits right into the definition I have always used and heard used for fire lapping. If you fire an abrasive or compound down the barrel, its fire lapping. Fire lapping, fire polishing, same difference. The last barrel I fire lapped, the final compound was 8000 grit.

mehavey · January 30, 2013, 04:33 PM

Tubbs is most definitely not firelapping -- it will not iron out constrictions in the bore, nor will
it swamp the barrel to get uniformly increasing grip on the bullet as it heads towards the muzzle.
It will merely polish existing surfaces and leave any disparity in dimensions alone.

On the other hand, the NECO system will firelap the bore -- big time. Given that you start w/ 220grit....
http://www.neconos.com/category/PRESSUREFIRELAPPING-20
You get the picture.

sc928porsche · January 31, 2013, 06:25 AM

I'm not about to put something like that down my lilja barrels.

radom · February 1, 2013, 04:10 AM

I have 130 year old guns I would not even let near that stuff that still shoot fine. A pitted up 1903 or trapdoor I would think of that but a decent bore ahh no.

reynolds357 · February 1, 2013, 08:06 PM

Porsche, I would certainly hope your Lilja barrel would not need any further lapping or polishing.

TheDutchman19 · February 1, 2013, 08:22 PM

My Tubbs kit showed up today. If the fowling issues improves, Im calling it a win. Any other benefits I would consider a bonus. I will let you folks know what the outcome is.

mehavey · February 2, 2013, 10:48 AM

Finally... someone who will have actually used the Fire-Polish kits and note results.

(postscript: I've used it. But my vote yea/nea is already a matter of double secret probationary record.)

mehavey · February 2, 2013, 11:02 AM

Finally... someone who will have actually used the Fire-Polish kits and note results.

(postscript: I've used it. But my vote yea/nea is already a matter of double secret probationary record.)

Eppie · February 2, 2013, 11:27 AM

So far from everything I've read in this post I'm inclined to try the Tubb system, but I'd like to hear what you have to say as well. So I'll be following this thread. Thanks for starting it.

coyota1 · February 2, 2013, 01:19 PM

I'm just reluctant to mess with it at this point. One of my favorite rifles is a 722 which I don't want to re barrel if I efft it up. It has that factory bulge where the rear sight is, and the stock is inletted around it. If I rebarreled it, it wouldn't look right.

TheDutchman19 · February 2, 2013, 05:43 PM

Here is a little more info about the kit. It comes with fifty bullets total. Ten for each of the varying abrasive steps. Much to my surprise, the coarsest bullets are not as coarse as I was expecting.

There is two different instructions depending on how your gun shoots. If your gun shoots bad, you shoot all fifty bullets, with cleaning between each abrasive step. If your gun shoots good, you skip the first two abrasive steps and start at step number three.

I took my rifle out this morning to evaluate it one more time. I would say that mine is somewhere between bad and good. I still need to go measure the groups. My rifles biggest issue is fowling. Because it fowls so bad, accuracy goes away after 30 or 40 rounds. I am leaning towards using the partial kit.

I will follow up on this post after I "pull the trigger". Meanwhile, I am going to go clean that damn gun!

MRL21 · February 2, 2013, 07:19 PM

I just wanted to let everyone know I didn't get a chance to shoot my rifle past 25 yards for 6 rounds. It cleaned a lot easier than ever after completing the system.

Not sure how it effected accuracy as I broke in the rifle with the Tubb system.

Txhillbilly · February 3, 2013, 11:15 PM

Dutchman,I'd just use the entire 5 sets of bullets.

I had the same thoughts before I shot my 1st rifle with them,but I'm glad I used the entire set.

My 25/06 shot like this before The Tubb's Final Finish bullets.And,It was a copper fouling SoB.

It shoots like this,all of the time now,and is simple to clean with hardly any copper fouling.
Berger 115gr Hunting VLD's. First shot off-Cold Clean Bore-

TheDutchman19 · February 3, 2013, 11:35 PM

Txhillbilly

Thanks for input. The pictures are great at telling the story.

TheDutchman19 · February 10, 2013, 11:01 PM

Update: Yesterday I went to the range and ran the Final Finish system through the gun. After thinking it through, and taking in all of the input from the forum, I opted for the complete kit.

Results: As promised, the gun cleans a lot easier. The last time I had the gun out, I put 5 shots through it, and it cleaned as of had been a hundred. This time after 5 shots, it cleaned quickly.

Accuracy: I only ran 5 shoots through it, but it was a sub MOA group (just barely). The entire process, including the range's line breaks, took 5 hours. I was done shooting before I took the five shots. I'm confident that I can do better when I'm fresh.

I'm happy with the results. I believe it cost approximately $35. I will use it again if I have a gun that fits that criteria.

Thanks for the input
David

January 31, 2013, 06:25 AM	#29
sc928porsche Senior Member Join Date: May 29, 2008 Location: now living in alabama Posts: 2,433	I'm not about to put something like that down my lilja barrels. __________________ No such thing as a stupid question. What is stupid is not asking it.

February 2, 2013, 11:27 AM	#35
Eppie Senior Member Join Date: January 7, 2010 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 802	TheDutchman19 So far from everything I've read in this post I'm inclined to try the Tubb system, but I'd like to hear what you have to say as well. So I'll be following this thread. Thanks for starting it. __________________ "Socialized Medicine is the Keystone to the Arch of the Socialist State.” -Vladimir Lenin "I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them." - Thomas Jefferson (An early warning to Obama care)

February 2, 2013, 05:43 PM	#37
TheDutchman19 Senior Member Join Date: August 30, 2012 Location: So Cal Posts: 117	Here is a little more info about the kit. It comes with fifty bullets total. Ten for each of the varying abrasive steps. Much to my surprise, the coarsest bullets are not as coarse as I was expecting. There is two different instructions depending on how your gun shoots. If your gun shoots bad, you shoot all fifty bullets, with cleaning between each abrasive step. If your gun shoots good, you skip the first two abrasive steps and start at step number three. I took my rifle out this morning to evaluate it one more time. I would say that mine is somewhere between bad and good. I still need to go measure the groups. My rifles biggest issue is fowling. Because it fowls so bad, accuracy goes away after 30 or 40 rounds. I am leaning towards using the partial kit. I will follow up on this post after I "pull the trigger". Meanwhile, I am going to go clean that damn gun! Last edited by TheDutchman19; February 2, 2013 at 07:26 PM.

February 3, 2013, 11:15 PM	#39
Txhillbilly Senior Member Join Date: July 5, 2008 Posts: 512	Dutchman,I'd just use the entire 5 sets of bullets. I had the same thoughts before I shot my 1st rifle with them,but I'm glad I used the entire set. My 25/06 shot like this before The Tubb's Final Finish bullets.And,It was a copper fouling SoB. It shoots like this,all of the time now,and is simple to clean with hardly any copper fouling. Berger 115gr Hunting VLD's. First shot off-Cold Clean Bore- Last edited by Txhillbilly; February 4, 2013 at 12:23 PM.

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January 30, 2013, 11:26 AM	#26
mehavey Senior Member Join Date: June 17, 2010 Location: Virginia Posts: 6,882	Fire Lapping is used for a very different pupose/diiferent end than Fire Polishing Think 60 grit sandpaper to shape and uniform a surface. Then 220-600 to make it mirror deep

January 30, 2013, 04:18 PM	#27
reynolds357 Senior Member Join Date: December 10, 2012 Posts: 6,164	The Tubbs kit fits right into the definition I have always used and heard used for fire lapping. If you fire an abrasive or compound down the barrel, its fire lapping. Fire lapping, fire polishing, same difference. The last barrel I fire lapped, the final compound was 8000 grit.

January 30, 2013, 04:33 PM	#28
mehavey Senior Member Join Date: June 17, 2010 Location: Virginia Posts: 6,882	Tubbs is most definitely not firelapping -- it will not iron out constrictions in the bore, nor will it swamp the barrel to get uniformly increasing grip on the bullet as it heads towards the muzzle. It will merely polish existing surfaces and leave any disparity in dimensions alone. On the other hand, the NECO system will firelap the bore -- big time. Given that you start w/ 220grit.... http://www.neconos.com/category/PRESSUREFIRELAPPING-20 You get the picture.

February 1, 2013, 04:10 AM	#30
radom Senior Member Join Date: January 21, 2000 Posts: 1,352	I have 130 year old guns I would not even let near that stuff that still shoot fine. A pitted up 1903 or trapdoor I would think of that but a decent bore ahh no.

February 1, 2013, 08:06 PM	#31
reynolds357 Senior Member Join Date: December 10, 2012 Posts: 6,164	Porsche, I would certainly hope your Lilja barrel would not need any further lapping or polishing.

February 1, 2013, 08:22 PM	#32
TheDutchman19 Senior Member Join Date: August 30, 2012 Location: So Cal Posts: 117	My Tubbs kit showed up today. If the fowling issues improves, Im calling it a win. Any other benefits I would consider a bonus. I will let you folks know what the outcome is.

February 2, 2013, 10:48 AM	#33
mehavey Senior Member Join Date: June 17, 2010 Location: Virginia Posts: 6,882	Finally... someone who will have actually used the Fire-Polish kits and note results. (postscript: I've used it. But my vote yea/nea is already a matter of double secret probationary record.)

February 2, 2013, 11:02 AM	#34
mehavey Senior Member Join Date: June 17, 2010 Location: Virginia Posts: 6,882	Finally... someone who will have actually used the Fire-Polish kits and note results. (postscript: I've used it. But my vote yea/nea is already a matter of double secret probationary record.)

February 2, 2013, 01:19 PM	#36
coyota1 Senior Member Join Date: April 6, 2008 Location: West Michigan Posts: 663	I'm just reluctant to mess with it at this point. One of my favorite rifles is a 722 which I don't want to re barrel if I efft it up. It has that factory bulge where the rear sight is, and the stock is inletted around it. If I rebarreled it, it wouldn't look right.

February 2, 2013, 07:19 PM	#38
MRL21 Member Join Date: December 15, 2005 Location: AZ Posts: 60	I just wanted to let everyone know I didn't get a chance to shoot my rifle past 25 yards for 6 rounds. It cleaned a lot easier than ever after completing the system. Not sure how it effected accuracy as I broke in the rifle with the Tubb system.

February 3, 2013, 11:35 PM	#40
TheDutchman19 Senior Member Join Date: August 30, 2012 Location: So Cal Posts: 117	Txhillbilly Thanks for input. The pictures are great at telling the story.

February 10, 2013, 11:01 PM	#41
TheDutchman19 Senior Member Join Date: August 30, 2012 Location: So Cal Posts: 117	Update: Yesterday I went to the range and ran the Final Finish system through the gun. After thinking it through, and taking in all of the input from the forum, I opted for the complete kit. Results: As promised, the gun cleans a lot easier. The last time I had the gun out, I put 5 shots through it, and it cleaned as of had been a hundred. This time after 5 shots, it cleaned quickly. Accuracy: I only ran 5 shoots through it, but it was a sub MOA group (just barely). The entire process, including the range's line breaks, took 5 hours. I was done shooting before I took the five shots. I'm confident that I can do better when I'm fresh. I'm happy with the results. I believe it cost approximately $35. I will use it again if I have a gun that fits that criteria. Thanks for the input David