9mm for deer

Spadone · September 4, 2000, 12:45 PM

Last year I took my camp 9, loaded with 147gr. Hydra shoks deer hunting. Never shot one, but my buddies said it was way underpowered. The local deer only weigh an average of 100#, and the range is usually under 30 yards. Is this setup humane?

pete80 · September 4, 2000, 01:25 PM

Check your local laws on the legality of using 9mm for deer hunting. Some states require certain calibers for big game hunting.
You should go with a larger caliber when taking deer. The 9mm does not have the range or penetration needed for a clean kill.

Robert the41MagFan · September 4, 2000, 01:34 PM

It will work for the situation you have described, providing that you do your job. Just check your state reg's and make sure that it is legal to use this cartridge.

Robert

September 4, 2000, 02:13 PM

It will work. Placement, placement, placement!!! If you are a reloader load some as hot as you can.

9x19 · September 4, 2000, 02:47 PM

In Texas, anything centerfire is legal for taking deer.

My Camp 9 launches Triton's 115 grain HiVel at 1673 fps with excellent accuracy. I would not hesitate to take a deer with it inside 100 yards, which is often a long shot here.

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Make mine lean, mean, and 9x19!

Gunslinger · September 4, 2000, 02:50 PM

I, personally, would not recommend it.

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Gunslinger

I was promised a Shortycicle and I want a Shortycicle!

tatters · September 4, 2000, 05:56 PM

9mm is quite illegal in Indiana

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"Any world that I'm welcome to.....Is better than the one I come from"

labgrade · September 4, 2000, 09:43 PM

"Placement, placement, placement!!! "

Load as accurately as you can.

Wouldn't be my choice but bigger stuff has been killed outright with less.

PJR · September 4, 2000, 11:51 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Spadone:
[ Is this setup humane?[/B][/quote]

No, it isn't. And just because some jurisdictions permit any centerfire for big game doesn't mean that you should hunt moose with a .22 Hornet. As Robert Ruark advised many years ago, "Use enough gun."

bk40 · September 5, 2000, 12:46 AM

just my .02¢

humane? no.

416Rigby · September 5, 2000, 08:10 AM

Don't do it.

9x19 was never designed to penetrate an animal's shoulder and reach its vitals. Sure, you may kill it. It's been done with a 22LR as well.....

Even a .357 Magnum is considered marginal for such use. Remember, it's the animal who suffers - and the sportsman's job to make sure he does not.

Use a rifle caliber.

James K · September 5, 2000, 12:13 PM

Hi, Spadone,

I hope you are not one of those people who do something just to defy conventional ideas, and to hell with anything else. The fact that you are even concerned about humaneness indicates you are not, so why go that route? The 9mm is not suitable for deer over 50 feet, for several reasons aside from legality.

If you are a stalker who can approach within a few feet of a deer and take a clean head shot, maybe. If not, leave the 9mm at home and use a more suitable cartridge.

Jim

Schmit · September 5, 2000, 03:33 PM

OK, seeing most everyone over here in The Art is opposed to hunting with a 9 mm lets see what the people over in Hunting have to say about this.

Everyone strap themselves in... Here we go....

------------------
Schmit
GySgt, USMC(Ret)
NRA Life, Lodge 1201-UOSSS
"Si vis Pacem Para Bellum"

Good Guy · September 5, 2000, 09:12 PM

I don't like the 9mm Para for anything, let alone hunting. The 9mm just isn't accurate enough for me in my experience (YMMV). In my book, medium-size game handgun cartridges begin with the 357 Mag, loaded HOT!

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Just one of the Good Guys

Johnny Guest · September 5, 2000, 09:54 PM

I learned what I needed to know on the subject some years back--

Medina County, Texas---I took a small hill country buck, under 100 pounds---Sierra 150 gr JHC .357 bullet at 1200 fps from a 4" Colt .357, range 35 yards, good rest, perfect hit: lung shot involving off shoulder. Classic mushroom expansion. He staggered for about 20 seconds before my follow-up shot.

I wouldn't go hungry if armed with a good 9 mm, or even a .38 special or .22 Hornet. But survival is different from a sporting hunt.

Best,
Johnny

------------------
---The Second Amendment ensures the rest of the Bill of Rights---

Ron Ankeny · September 5, 2000, 10:19 PM

No.

Erik · September 5, 2000, 10:21 PM

I would never advocate choosing a 9mm to hunt deer with.

For one, it is illegal in many (most?) places.

For another, there is a good argument that it is boarderline immoral.

For yet another, if all you have is a 9mm, then it is high time to use my first two reasons as an excuse to purchase a "real" hunting rifle.

September 5, 2000, 10:36 PM

9mm from a carbine length barrel, will it take deer up to 100 pounds? That is what was asked. The answer is yes it will. A 147 grain golddot handloaded very hot from the carbine length barrel should match a .357 mag revolver in terms of bullet weight and velocity correct? Follow up shots with the camp nine should be quick as well. Granted the range of the shot is limited, but it will work for deer up 100 pounds quite well.

ArmySon · September 5, 2000, 10:45 PM

Humane? NO

Why use a 9mm when there are decent rifles available for relatively cheap prices? You can even pickup a used .44 Mag for under $300 if you're intent on using a pistol. I occasionaly hunt deer with a Ruger Super Red Hawk. However, unless the deer is 50 yards in, I won't shoot it.

Most of the time, I use a .270 or 30-6.

jtduncan · September 6, 2000, 06:37 PM

Way too underpowered and the 9mm round was only designed for two-legged creatures.

I doubt whether at that range wind drift wouldn't cause a bad shot and then we have a wounded deer.

The Camp 9 and 45 were designed for emergency uses and defense of the "camp" hence the name.

Better get a rifle/shotgun capable of reliably killing a deer.

------------------
The Seattle SharpShooter - TFL/GT/UGW/PCT/KTOG

rr41mag · September 6, 2000, 06:43 PM

I have four pistols one of which is a ruger redhawk .41 mag 7 1/2 bbl I have been working with this gun for years now on the loads so I can trust it to take it deer hunting. No I wouldn't take the 9mm deer hunting.

patrickt66 · September 6, 2000, 10:10 PM

I'm a little confused; Many posters acknowledge that a 9mm out of a carbine-length barrel is equal to a .357 and endorse the .357 as adequate for deer out of a revolver, yet condemn the 9mm as a deer round even though Spadone pointed out that the range is under 30 yards. Could someone explain this discrepancy?

September 6, 2000, 10:51 PM

That's what I have been trying to point out as well. Perhaps I didn't make myself clear. Follow up shots, should they be needed, are going to be faster and more accurate than from a revolver as well. Thus it would seem to be a better choice.

Field-dressed · September 7, 2000, 01:19 AM

Will it reliably penetrate through fur, hide and scapula and still make a clean kill? I don't know but it seems underpowered to me. No way I'd try it and around here we shoot Sitka black-tailed deer that often weigh in near 100 pounds. I don't know where you're hunting but I only hunt deer with a load capable of stopping brown bears.

September 8, 2000, 01:09 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by patrickt66:
I'm a little confused; Many posters acknowledge that a 9mm out of a carbine-length barrel is equal to a .357 and endorse the .357 as adequate for deer out of a revolver, yet condemn the 9mm as a deer round even though Spadone pointed out that the range is under 30 yards. Could someone explain this discrepancy?[/quote]

No one can answer this?

September 4, 2000, 12:45 PM	#1
Spadone Member Join Date: July 3, 2000 Posts: 48	Last year I took my camp 9, loaded with 147gr. Hydra shoks deer hunting. Never shot one, but my buddies said it was way underpowered. The local deer only weigh an average of 100#, and the range is usually under 30 yards. Is this setup humane?

September 4, 2000, 01:25 PM	#2
pete80 Senior Member Join Date: July 4, 1999 Posts: 454	Check your local laws on the legality of using 9mm for deer hunting. Some states require certain calibers for big game hunting. You should go with a larger caliber when taking deer. The 9mm does not have the range or penetration needed for a clean kill.

September 4, 2000, 01:34 PM	#3
Robert the41MagFan Senior Member Join Date: November 18, 1999 Posts: 1,233	It will work for the situation you have described, providing that you do your job. Just check your state reg's and make sure that it is legal to use this cartridge. Robert

September 4, 2000, 02:13 PM	#4
KilgorII Guest Posts: n/a	It will work. Placement, placement, placement!!! If you are a reloader load some as hot as you can.

September 4, 2000, 02:47 PM	#5
9x19 Senior Member Join Date: October 15, 1998 Location: Sherman, TX USA Posts: 3,750	In Texas, anything centerfire is legal for taking deer. My Camp 9 launches Triton's 115 grain HiVel at 1673 fps with excellent accuracy. I would not hesitate to take a deer with it inside 100 yards, which is often a long shot here. ------------------ Make mine lean, mean, and 9x19!

September 4, 2000, 02:50 PM	#6
Gunslinger Junior member Join Date: January 5, 1999 Location: Springfield, Missouri Posts: 2,105	I, personally, would not recommend it. ------------------ Gunslinger I was promised a Shortycicle and I want a Shortycicle!

September 4, 2000, 05:56 PM	#7
tatters Senior Member Join Date: October 16, 1999 Location: Indiana Posts: 786	9mm is quite illegal in Indiana ------------------ "Any world that I'm welcome to.....Is better than the one I come from"

September 4, 2000, 09:43 PM	#8
labgrade Member In Memoriam Join Date: November 29, 1999 Location: west of a small town, CO Posts: 4,346	"Placement, placement, placement!!! " Load as accurately as you can. Wouldn't be my choice but bigger stuff has been killed outright with less.

September 4, 2000, 11:51 PM	#9
PJR Senior Member Join Date: May 31, 2000 Posts: 1,127	<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Spadone: [ Is this setup humane?[/B][/quote] No, it isn't. And just because some jurisdictions permit any centerfire for big game doesn't mean that you should hunt moose with a .22 Hornet. As Robert Ruark advised many years ago, "Use enough gun."

September 5, 2000, 12:46 AM	#10
bk40 Senior Member Join Date: January 12, 1999 Location: Mississippi Posts: 1,004	just my .02¢ humane? no.

September 5, 2000, 08:10 AM	#11
416Rigby Senior Member Join Date: August 21, 1999 Location: Virginia Posts: 450	Don't do it. 9x19 was never designed to penetrate an animal's shoulder and reach its vitals. Sure, you may kill it. It's been done with a 22LR as well..... Even a .357 Magnum is considered marginal for such use. Remember, it's the animal who suffers - and the sportsman's job to make sure he does not. Use a rifle caliber.

September 5, 2000, 12:13 PM	#12
James K Member In Memoriam Join Date: March 17, 1999 Posts: 24,383	Hi, Spadone, I hope you are not one of those people who do something just to defy conventional ideas, and to hell with anything else. The fact that you are even concerned about humaneness indicates you are not, so why go that route? The 9mm is not suitable for deer over 50 feet, for several reasons aside from legality. If you are a stalker who can approach within a few feet of a deer and take a clean head shot, maybe. If not, leave the 9mm at home and use a more suitable cartridge. Jim

September 5, 2000, 03:33 PM	#13
Schmit Staff Alumnus Join Date: March 11, 1999 Location: Masquito infested flatlands of Mid-FL Posts: 1,857	OK, seeing most everyone over here in The Art is opposed to hunting with a 9 mm lets see what the people over in Hunting have to say about this. Everyone strap themselves in... Here we go.... ------------------ Schmit GySgt, USMC(Ret) NRA Life, Lodge 1201-UOSSS "Si vis Pacem Para Bellum"

September 5, 2000, 09:12 PM	#14
Good Guy Senior Member Join Date: August 4, 1999 Posts: 638	I don't like the 9mm Para for anything, let alone hunting. The 9mm just isn't accurate enough for me in my experience (YMMV). In my book, medium-size game handgun cartridges begin with the 357 Mag, loaded HOT! ------------------ Just one of the Good Guys

September 5, 2000, 09:54 PM	#15
Johnny Guest Moderator in Memoriam Join Date: August 28, 1999 Location: North Texas Posts: 4,123	I learned what I needed to know on the subject some years back-- Medina County, Texas---I took a small hill country buck, under 100 pounds---Sierra 150 gr JHC .357 bullet at 1200 fps from a 4" Colt .357, range 35 yards, good rest, perfect hit: lung shot involving off shoulder. Classic mushroom expansion. He staggered for about 20 seconds before my follow-up shot. I wouldn't go hungry if armed with a good 9 mm, or even a .38 special or .22 Hornet. But survival is different from a sporting hunt. Best, Johnny ------------------ ---The Second Amendment ensures the rest of the Bill of Rights---

September 5, 2000, 10:19 PM	#16
Ron Ankeny Senior Member Join Date: April 3, 2000 Posts: 316	No.

September 5, 2000, 10:21 PM	#17
Erik Senior Member Join Date: December 24, 1999 Location: America Posts: 3,479	I would never advocate choosing a 9mm to hunt deer with. For one, it is illegal in many (most?) places. For another, there is a good argument that it is boarderline immoral. For yet another, if all you have is a 9mm, then it is high time to use my first two reasons as an excuse to purchase a "real" hunting rifle.

September 5, 2000, 10:36 PM	#18
KilgorII Guest Posts: n/a	9mm from a carbine length barrel, will it take deer up to 100 pounds? That is what was asked. The answer is yes it will. A 147 grain golddot handloaded very hot from the carbine length barrel should match a .357 mag revolver in terms of bullet weight and velocity correct? Follow up shots with the camp nine should be quick as well. Granted the range of the shot is limited, but it will work for deer up 100 pounds quite well.

September 5, 2000, 10:45 PM	#19
ArmySon Staff Alumnus Join Date: April 14, 2000 Posts: 2,926	Humane? NO Why use a 9mm when there are decent rifles available for relatively cheap prices? You can even pickup a used .44 Mag for under $300 if you're intent on using a pistol. I occasionaly hunt deer with a Ruger Super Red Hawk. However, unless the deer is 50 yards in, I won't shoot it. Most of the time, I use a .270 or 30-6.

September 6, 2000, 06:37 PM	#20
jtduncan Senior Member Join Date: December 5, 1999 Location: Seattle, Washington, USA Posts: 1,686	Way too underpowered and the 9mm round was only designed for two-legged creatures. I doubt whether at that range wind drift wouldn't cause a bad shot and then we have a wounded deer. The Camp 9 and 45 were designed for emergency uses and defense of the "camp" hence the name. Better get a rifle/shotgun capable of reliably killing a deer. ------------------ *The Seattle SharpShooter* - TFL/GT/UGW/PCT/KTOG

September 6, 2000, 06:43 PM	#21
rr41mag Senior Member Join Date: June 25, 2000 Location: Biloxi, Miss. Posts: 180	I have four pistols one of which is a ruger redhawk .41 mag 7 1/2 bbl I have been working with this gun for years now on the loads so I can trust it to take it deer hunting. No I wouldn't take the 9mm deer hunting.

September 6, 2000, 10:10 PM	#22
patrickt66 Senior Member Join Date: March 26, 2000 Posts: 115	I'm a little confused; Many posters acknowledge that a 9mm out of a carbine-length barrel is equal to a .357 and endorse the .357 as adequate for deer out of a revolver, yet condemn the 9mm as a deer round even though Spadone pointed out that the range is under 30 yards. Could someone explain this discrepancy?

September 6, 2000, 10:51 PM	#23
KilgorII Guest Posts: n/a	That's what I have been trying to point out as well. Perhaps I didn't make myself clear. Follow up shots, should they be needed, are going to be faster and more accurate than from a revolver as well. Thus it would seem to be a better choice.

September 7, 2000, 01:19 AM	#24
Field-dressed Senior Member Join Date: August 21, 2000 Location: Alaska Posts: 148	Will it reliably penetrate through fur, hide and scapula and still make a clean kill? I don't know but it seems underpowered to me. No way I'd try it and around here we shoot Sitka black-tailed deer that often weigh in near 100 pounds. I don't know where you're hunting but I only hunt deer with a load capable of stopping brown bears.

September 8, 2000, 01:09 PM	#25
KilgorII Guest Posts: n/a	<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by patrickt66: I'm a little confused; Many posters acknowledge that a 9mm out of a carbine-length barrel is equal to a .357 and endorse the .357 as adequate for deer out of a revolver, yet condemn the 9mm as a deer round even though Spadone pointed out that the range is under 30 yards. Could someone explain this discrepancy?[/quote] No one can answer this?