What bird dog to get?

[TopGun]

Hey Fellas,

I’m new to this forum, but thought id try to put some input. I currently own a German Short Haired Pointer and in my opinion they are one of the best upland dogs out there. They can take a little time to mature, but with some hard training you can achieve wonders. The only issue with children is these dogs like to jump and play a lot and may injure young children because they can be a little too rough.

In regards to duck hunting I’ve known duck hunters who have used GSP who have achieved exceptional results, only problem is the cold water as already stated where in the long run these dogs can suffer. A German Wired Haired Pointer might be an option.

I am living in Australia and a new law has been introduced where tail docking is now illegal. I am now contemplating on breeding my dog as I don’t know whether I would like to see GSP's with long tails. What do you'z guys think on this matter? I am not sure what the laws are like over there in America.

Thanks Steve

Beretta 687 SPII
Miroku 9000

[Striker]

Was and still am a lab guy. But.....I'm the more I see them, the more I'm impressed with water spaniels (Irish and American versions). Might be my next dog.

Just my thought.

[Limeyfellow]

The English Cockerspaniel is an awesome dog for just what you want.

[fisherman66]

I am living in Australia and a new law has been introduced where tail docking is now illegal. I am now contemplating on breeding my dog as I don’t know whether I would like to see GSP's with long tails. What do you'z guys think on this matter? I am not sure what the laws are like over there in America.

I am of the understanding that the nerves have not fully developed at birth when tail docking and ear cropping (see Dobermans) is done. I do not have strong feelings regarding this issue; but I do like the asthetic of the docked tail. I only support docking if done immediately after birth.

I'd breed if you think you have a superior dog. I'd not dock the tail, but if the law ever changed you would be fine for future generations. I do feel strongly that dogs should only be breed if they characterize the breed, or if they offer enhancements to the breed. Those yahoos who puppy farm have no concern for the dogs the breed. They should be driven into bankruptcy by consumers who refuse to partonize their establishments. Hunters especially should pay top dollar for a fine puppy from parents who hunt and hunt very well. They should also be of top temperment and trainability.

[gdeal]

Siberian Huskie makes a great Bird Doggie.

[superpelly]

http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e2...y/HPIM0562.jpg
This is DEE DEE(German Shorthair) she was rescued form my local shelter. She is about 1.5 yrs old. Great pheasant dog, points like a dream and a great family dog. She loves to hunt and play with our cat!!!!!! But, you can't go wrong with a GSP !!!

[Russ5924]

You said a friend had a Lab he didn't want, I will say DON'T get a Puppy and raise him your way.Any breed of hunting dog has to be trained properly I have seen many good dogs ruined from people that just take there shotgun and start shooting over the dogI used to hunt my three Brittany's all at the same time,but they all had there Electronic Collars.Some may find them cruel but for most dogs is a great training aid.My female Brittany was one of the best hunting dogs I have ever had but to put her in the field with out that Collar just wouldn't have worked. You know they do have a POINTING lab that has become popular over the last few years.

[TopGun]

Russ is right in saying that a fair bit of effort and training needs to be put in before you can see the benefits of a gun dog. I have never heard of the electronic collars down under but a good method that I have used on my GSP to initially use a rope and have a choker chain on the dog. Go find a few paddocks without a shotgun and let the dogs instincts come into action. The rope is good to train with because when the dog runs too far for your liking you can pull on it harshly while calling out with a fierce "BACK". Keep this up and the dog eventually realises that every time you call out "BACK" something bad is going to happen. I have heard of hunters who buy a dog or get given one and if they don't do what their blood line says then they are given the bullet. If your a keen hunter and want a gun dog for this pure reason then it is better to spend that bit extra and buy a pure breed from a recognized breeder then to be disappointed and end up with a dog that only can eat, sleep and ****.

Steve

Beretta SP II
Miroku 9000

[dgc940]

I'm confused! he asked quote pheasant, quail, and maybe duck!
is there a good dog for all three? will a lab point? and is a lab going to hunt singles on quail? or phestent and hold on them till you get there?
doesent he need a dog that will hunt out singles and point? and retrieve over water? Im not a duck hunter! they taste like %&^* to me! I do like quail and dove! I have hunted over good german sh's.

[Art Eatman]

dgc940, for some folks its the retrieve that's more important than the finding and pointing. Depends on where and how you hunt, and how many birds there are. I don't any one dog can do everything perfectly, so you prioritize.

I guess.

, Art

[Pointer]

Are there no bird doggers out there who recognize the very real abilities of the Brittany Spaniel?

As bird dogs go, they do everything well...

Hell, if for no other reason, they're not "inbred".

[roy reali]

In Germany, shorthairs are considered all around hunting dogs. Here is what they have to do to be certified there: point and retrieve upland game, retrieve water fowl, track wounded animals, hunt small game, assist in locating large game.

That sound pretty versatile to me.

[dgc940]

Thanks Art I was just wondering. Im not very versed in bird dog hunting!
I do think in my brushy country I would wont a sort haired dog! would hate keeping lh brushed?

[Jibaholic]

I don't have any specific experience with Chesapeake bays

My family has always been a Chessie family for generations so I'm a little biased. The conventional wisdom is that if you want a tough dog that will plow through the roughest, cold icy water you can find, then you want a Chessie. But they are more stubborn, less trainable (not less intelligent), and less friendly to strangers than Labs. In computer terms, this is not a bug, it is a feature.

Chessies were bred during the no limits days of hunting when skilled hunters with a good dog would back literally hundreds of ducks per day. The hunters were dirt poor so you wanted a combo retreiver/guard dog to guard your stash of ducks. Good retreivers also had a tendency to get stolen from their owners because they were so valuable. Chessies were bred to be strong one-family dogs that are intensely loyal to their owner and aloof (or worse) to strangers.

I think most people would be happiest with a Lab. They are the most versitile retreiver. But labs are also for people like to joke that their dog would wag their tale and lead a burgler to the silver and china. For the most part you will never get that from chessie.

From a Chessie Rescue League, Don't buy a Chessie ...

[Shorthair]

Most bird-doggers will tell you that you will "mess up the hunt" in the dog... if you make the dog a house pet...

Couldn't disagree more. This dog, Tustin , practically grew up in my son's diapers, but he is a very capable, hard-going all-around birddog.
The fact that the potential owner, however, has limited land to raise the dog on leads me to believe that a Brittany may be a better dog for the family. Most lines of GSPs are a lot larger and more high-strung than Brits, and if he isn't willing to invest the time to give the dog regular, vigorous romps on a daily basis he might better be suited getting a less turbo-charged beast for field and family. Brits make excellent hunters, are easily groomed, and make wonderful house pets.

[roy reali]

Did you ever watch that hunting show called, Hunting With Hank?

It was kind of hokey, but you have to admit the Hank, the Setter, was an awesome hunting dog. Do you remember his tag line? He always said, "Never, ever, spoil your birddog."

[Pointer]

Shorthair

From my post #25

Of course, you are right as far as it goes...

I guess the difference is in how we rate a good hunting dog.

rarely take him out that dog will be a poor hunter. Dogs need exposure to the outdoors

Any serious bird-dogger will "work" his dog routinely and often...
He will want the dog to range close and work hard...
He will want the dog to hold over the upland bird and watch the birds fall in order to find and retrieve them quickly so the hunt, or shoot, can continue in a timely manner.

If the dog gets easily distracted from these things it is a "poor" bird dog.

However, if the hunter is satisfied with the way his dog performs around other hunting dogs, and under the watchful eyes of his fellow hunters...
Who can fault that?

[870 wingmaster]

I say any retriver,''kind of says it all'' wheather it is a black lab.chocolate.yellow,golden!! they are all great dogs with great personality and great with kids,people!! They love to please there owners.

[fisherman66]

dgc940, for some folks its the retrieve that's more important than the finding and pointing. Depends on where and how you hunt, and how many birds there are.

Our weather/rain (and 'yotes and hawks and...) have been very tough on the quail where we hunt that we might only find a covey per hunt session. I guess that makes me think that the point is more important that the retrieve. I want to bust the covey; not the dog..... With good training a good bird dog should be able to do each well, but with unseasoned dogs the hunt can go south fast (I also think the point is the easiest teach.)

I don't any one dog can do everything perfectly, so you prioritize.

I have seen GSP do almost everything perfect. Great nose, great points for long periods of time, great retrieves, trailing wounded game.....can you tell I like GSPs? They are also very social and even tempered in the bloodline I have worded with.

[armedandsafe]

Well, here goes the giggles, snorts and guffaws. I bred and trained hunting dogs for several years, many years ago. They were the best all-around dogs you could ask for. Swim in a cup of water, hunt close, range out, hound, trail, point, flush, guard and play with the kids. The biggest problem is that they are often smarter than the people owning them.

It is hard to find a good bloodline in the States, any more. However, if you are willinmg to put the work required into training, the Standard Poodle is hard to beat as a hunt-anything companion.

Pops

[fisherman66]

snort; guffaw; ahemm.

Do you cut hair for a living?

Just teasing; just teasing.

[BobR]

the Standard Poodle is hard to beat as a hunt-anything companion

I can't believe it took this long for this to be pointed out.

I learned by accident that poodles make excellent hunters. When growing up I would watch our minature (think beagle sized) poodle point at birds in the back yard. After some reading on the breed, I figured why not? I took her to a friend of my fathers that had bird dogs and we trained her for upland birds. She became a great quail flusher, and pheasant dog. My mother wasn't to thrilled that I took her pet and made it work for a living, but when all was said and done, she sure did like the birds we brought home.

bob

[roy reali]

A friend of mine has a standard poodle. Yes, they have hunting dog blood in them. In fact, my friend showed up to this retriever competition with his dog. They were tossing out bumpers and seeing which dog could get them fastest. He asked if his poodle could give it a try. They said okay, while smirking and some eye rolling.

After a couple of runs, they were not laughing at his standard p[oodle anymore.

[maas]

i have a german wirehaired pointer and shes a great hunting dog on all types of game (ducks upland and deer havnt taken her elk hunting yet lol) thier good house dogs and family dogs because they are verry freindly but protective of there family. thoses were the pros now some cons our family has had german wirehaired pointers for many years (i think like 1969 i dont know they have been around longer that me) they have a LOT of energy; just like labs to be know for hip problems, a couple of ours have had diabtis, they live to long... i know your saying what? mine (the youngest) is seven she still acts like a puppy and will out last all my buddies 2 year old labs on a hunt. but you get so attached to them over this long period thats its really hard to let them go. oh by the way a long time is 20 years was the oldest then all the rest made it from 16 to 18 and the youngest was 14 but all that beeing said ill never switch breeds
by the way has anyone seen a black one mine is

[TopGun]

Hey maas, my short haired is black. You dont see many of them around, most popular colour being liver. I personally think black looks heaps better.

Steve