Cheating???

crankshop1000 · July 7, 2007, 05:01 PM

In my younger days when my eyes were much better, I shot at least twice a week 400 rounds or more year round.(LEO free ammo!!) I was a pretty fair shot holding NRA Distinguished Expert and Master ratings. After a lengthy period (25years) of no shooting, I'm back at it.The problem with the eyes is that even with glasses, you can't find a happy medium where the sights are visible without the target being a total blur. The reverse is true without the glasses. I bought a Bushnell Trophy red dot for mt S&W 22A target pistol and it's like I'm right back where I need to be. The difference is so great that I bought Crimson Trace laser grips for 2 of my other pistols. Is this considered cheating or something to be looked down on? Like I daid, I have been out of the loop for a while and don't want to show up somewhere and look dumber than normal.Thanks-Chuck.

tlm225 · July 7, 2007, 10:49 PM

Personally I don't think it's cheating. I'm in the same situation, sights are blurry but I practice as I carry. I've given thought to putting a red dot on a couple of pistols for target use only. Whether you use irons, red dots or laser you still have to use all the other skills like trigger control, grip and follow through to shoot tight groups. I'd say go for it.

MikeWrite · July 8, 2007, 12:52 AM

The purpose of shooting is hitting. If the optics and lasers help you get the hits you need, who cares what anyone thinks?

Fifteen or twenty years ago, everyone said red dot sights were gimmicks for "gamesmen" and would never be used on military/police/defense weapons. Shockingly, my Army-issue M4 has an issue Aimpoint red dot sight on it. Of course, some people still think iron-sighted M14s should be issued.

Go with what works.

revjen45 · July 8, 2007, 12:36 PM

In a life-or-death situation, there ain't no rules so you can't cheat. The object is to prevail without coming to harm. Go with whatever works for you.

Bob F. · July 8, 2007, 12:52 PM

If you're talking plinking, targets for fun, do what's fun and works. No rules apply unless it's some kind of organized competition.. For SD/CCW take all the advantages you can get; the only rule is "WIN"!

Stay safe.
Bob

armedandsafe · July 8, 2007, 02:03 PM

Many Many years ago, in the late 40s, early 50s, when I still had eyes, I shot 1000yd competition with peep rear, globe w/ring front sights. As the years wore on, that peep rear sight began to grow, gaining weight and girth (as is normal with advancing age.) That slim, nifty peep rear sight is now about 45mm in girth and 12 inches long and has taken to wearing glass (as is normal with advancing age.) It has produced offspring to take over many of my other long guns and some of them are smaller versions of it and others are even larger than the parent.

'Tis a normal progression of things, lad. Enjoy what you've got, while you've got it.

Pops

BikerRN · July 8, 2007, 06:22 PM

Nope, not cheating if your intention is to hit what you aim at.

I like your method better than Kentucky Windage.

Biker

Ian2005 · July 9, 2007, 11:10 AM

It's really cheating becuase where the laser is hitting, and where the bullet ends up are usually in difference places. Stance, hand position, recoil management, etc, all make the difference. I can have the laser placed on the eyeball of a target 25 yards out, doesn't mean I going to hit that spot though. - and like others have said - who cares what anyone else thinks anyway (I see plenty of people using lasers at the range).

USNavy_233 · July 9, 2007, 11:15 AM

As we used to say in BUD/S; if you're not cheating, you're not trying!

LightningJoe · July 12, 2007, 11:00 PM

Using a gun is cheating. You're supposed to use your bare hands!

crankshop1000 · July 13, 2007, 07:44 AM

Fortunately as I age and the eyesight starts to fail, my common sense and experience is heightened.It tells me that a gun is a far better way to defend myself than duking it out. Chuck.

WVanOmega · July 13, 2007, 03:35 PM

Some times things are obvious once they are pointed out.

In the early 80s I wore regular glasses. For the past three or four years I have used progressive scan/cut instead of bi-focals. I hated them. When I went to get a new prescription I was going to get bi-focals. The optician said that the lenses I had were made by company X, and that was a low-grade optical quality. That I should try a better grade.

A better grade of "optical quality". Well, duh...

He also said to get a smaller lens.

MUCH better. What I have now is so different.

There still is the knack of getting the site picture, but what a difference.

And of course right now I can't think of the name of the lens manufacturer for what I am wearing.

You might consider changing your glasses.

And no using sites that are useable is not cheating.

Wayne

AirForceShooter · July 13, 2007, 08:19 PM

What's wrong with cheating?
As you age it becomes a way of life.

AFS

July 7, 2007, 05:01 PM	#1
crankshop1000 Member Join Date: May 30, 2007 Posts: 58	Cheating??? In my younger days when my eyes were much better, I shot at least twice a week 400 rounds or more year round.(LEO free ammo!!) I was a pretty fair shot holding NRA Distinguished Expert and Master ratings. After a lengthy period (25years) of no shooting, I'm back at it.The problem with the eyes is that even with glasses, you can't find a happy medium where the sights are visible without the target being a total blur. The reverse is true without the glasses. I bought a Bushnell Trophy red dot for mt S&W 22A target pistol and it's like I'm right back where I need to be. The difference is so great that I bought Crimson Trace laser grips for 2 of my other pistols. Is this considered cheating or something to be looked down on? Like I daid, I have been out of the loop for a while and don't want to show up somewhere and look dumber than normal.Thanks-Chuck.

July 7, 2007, 10:49 PM	#2
tlm225 Senior Member Join Date: December 21, 2004 Location: Arkansas Posts: 962	Personally I don't think it's cheating. I'm in the same situation, sights are blurry but I practice as I carry. I've given thought to putting a red dot on a couple of pistols for target use only. Whether you use irons, red dots or laser you still have to use all the other skills like trigger control, grip and follow through to shoot tight groups. I'd say go for it. __________________ All that is neccessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing. Edmund Burke

July 8, 2007, 12:52 AM	#3
MikeWrite Member Join Date: January 2, 2001 Location: Back in AZ, baby! Posts: 98	The purpose of shooting is hitting. If the optics and lasers help you get the hits you need, who cares what anyone thinks? Fifteen or twenty years ago, everyone said red dot sights were gimmicks for "gamesmen" and would never be used on military/police/defense weapons. Shockingly, my Army-issue M4 has an issue Aimpoint red dot sight on it. Of course, some people still think iron-sighted M14s should be issued. Go with what works. __________________ Mike I am a leaf on the wind.

July 8, 2007, 02:03 PM	#6
armedandsafe Senior Member Join Date: January 9, 2005 Location: Moses Lake WA Posts: 1,001	Many Many years ago, in the late 40s, early 50s, when I still had eyes, I shot 1000yd competition with peep rear, globe w/ring front sights. As the years wore on, that peep rear sight began to grow, gaining weight and girth (as is normal with advancing age.) That slim, nifty peep rear sight is now about 45mm in girth and 12 inches long and has taken to wearing glass (as is normal with advancing age.) It has produced offspring to take over many of my other long guns and some of them are smaller versions of it and others are even larger than the parent. 'Tis a normal progression of things, lad. Enjoy what you've got, while you've got it. Pops __________________ Armed and Safe: Not just a theory If it time to bury them, it is time to dig them up. Remember, "Behind every blade of grass."

July 9, 2007, 11:15 AM	#9
USNavy_233 Senior Member Join Date: November 10, 2004 Location: Keystone Heights, Florida Posts: 115	As we used to say in BUD/S; if you're not cheating, you're not trying! __________________ He is greatest, who is trained in the severest school. -General Thucydides, 424 BC

July 8, 2007, 12:36 PM	#4
revjen45 Junior member Join Date: May 7, 2006 Location: Everett, WA Posts: 626	In a life-or-death situation, there ain't no rules so you can't cheat. The object is to prevail without coming to harm. Go with whatever works for you.

July 8, 2007, 12:52 PM	#5
Bob F. Senior Member Join Date: August 20, 2004 Location: Southeastern WV (left out "north") Posts: 195	If you're talking plinking, targets for fun, do what's fun and works. No rules apply unless it's some kind of organized competition.. For SD/CCW take all the advantages you can get; the only rule is "WIN"! Stay safe. Bob

July 8, 2007, 06:22 PM	#7
BikerRN Senior Member Join Date: February 11, 2007 Location: "State of Discombobulation" Posts: 1,333	Nope, not cheating if your intention is to hit what you aim at. I like your method better than Kentucky Windage. Biker

July 9, 2007, 11:10 AM	#8
Ian2005 Senior Member Join Date: October 24, 2005 Location: Texas Posts: 355	It's really cheating becuase where the laser is hitting, and where the bullet ends up are usually in difference places. Stance, hand position, recoil management, etc, all make the difference. I can have the laser placed on the eyeball of a target 25 yards out, doesn't mean I going to hit that spot though. - and like others have said - who cares what anyone else thinks anyway (I see plenty of people using lasers at the range).

July 12, 2007, 11:00 PM	#10
LightningJoe Senior Member Join Date: May 27, 2007 Location: DFW Metroplex (well, McKinney) Posts: 858	Using a gun is cheating. You're supposed to use your bare hands!

July 13, 2007, 07:44 AM	#11
crankshop1000 Member Join Date: May 30, 2007 Posts: 58	Fortunately as I age and the eyesight starts to fail, my common sense and experience is heightened.It tells me that a gun is a far better way to defend myself than duking it out. Chuck.

July 13, 2007, 03:35 PM	#12
WVanOmega Junior Member Join Date: June 1, 2007 Location: Pensacola, Fl Posts: 5	Some times things are obvious once they are pointed out. In the early 80s I wore regular glasses. For the past three or four years I have used progressive scan/cut instead of bi-focals. I hated them. When I went to get a new prescription I was going to get bi-focals. The optician said that the lenses I had were made by company X, and that was a low-grade optical quality. That I should try a better grade. A better grade of "optical quality". Well, duh... He also said to get a smaller lens. MUCH better. What I have now is so different. There still is the knack of getting the site picture, but what a difference. And of course right now I can't think of the name of the lens manufacturer for what I am wearing. You might consider changing your glasses. And no using sites that are useable is not cheating. Wayne

July 13, 2007, 08:19 PM	#13
AirForceShooter Senior Member Join Date: December 21, 2005 Location: Sarasota (sort of) Florida Posts: 1,296	What's wrong with cheating? As you age it becomes a way of life. AFS