M1A national match

kcub · October 18, 2015, 04:20 AM

What accuracy out of the box with good ammo can be expected?

Kosh75287 · October 18, 2015, 05:45 AM

With the 173 grain military match ammo, mine puts 5 rounds in a circle slightly less than an inch (0.898", if memory serves) at 100 yards, from a bench. A 200 yards, benched, 1.75", when I'm on my game. Best group was 1.42", but I've never shot a group that size, since. The 100 yd group size is larger than 1/2 the average 200 yard group, which tells me I wobble some at 100 yards. Don't know why.

dvdcrr · October 18, 2015, 09:55 AM

^ This was my experience also.

bobn · October 18, 2015, 09:59 AM

my national match did not shoot any better than the loaded special I had. however the sights were much more consistent. no glitches in vertical or windage adjustments. bob

4EVERM-14 · October 18, 2015, 04:51 PM

Out of the box accuracy is going to be very dependent on the ammo you choose. Foreign ball may work but the real test will be something like Federal GMM or Black Hills .
Congrads on picking a great rifle.

kcub · October 19, 2015, 03:49 AM

How is shooting it, about like a Garand?

gyvel · October 19, 2015, 04:11 AM

I've had two: One I bought used from a Cuban guy at a gun show in Miami back in '89 that had NM sights installed on it, and I couldn't hit the broadside of a barn with it. Kind of soured me on the whole M1A thing for a while. The gun was all over the paper and I was getting 6-8" groups at 100 yds. from a bench. I just couldn't get it to zero, and I have NO idea what the problem was.

Ca. 2000, I bought another in AZ brand new from Davidsons and was able to hit a grapefruit size rock with it at about 120 yds., offhand standing, right out of the box. That gun has vindicated the M1A in my eyes. One of these days, I'll bench it and see what it can do from a rest.

BTW: The first one is long gone now; Sold it during the dark times of the AWB years. At least I got my money back.

kcub · October 29, 2015, 07:22 AM

I snoozed and losed on the one in the store.

I hate the chop shop look of the plastic handguard and know there are aftermarket wood replacements. They require fitting and sometimes finishing, cutting for op rods, etc.

Is there someplace I could buy one completed? In other words, the shop fits it to a new M1A and they ship completed gun to my FFL.

Thanks!

COSteve · October 30, 2015, 12:40 PM

Quote:

With the 173 grain military match ammo, ... A 200 yards, benched, 1.75", when I'm on my game. Best group was 1.42", but I've never shot a group that size, since.

I've got a standard, wood stocked Springfield M1A I bought new for my birthday in November, 2011. By that time Springfield was fixing all their M1As with NM front sights and a 'NM aperture ready' rear sight base so all I did was buy a NM rear aperture, fit it to my base, and I have great sights. Anyway, I use it off the bench to shoot bowling pins at 200yds using my 168grn handloads. The pins are slightly over 2 MOA wide targets (4¾" at their widest) and almost 15" tall but for the most part they are under 2 MOA wide and make great reactive targets.

Hitting those pins with my M1A isn't difficult so my point is that the standard version ain't no slouch either, not NM accurate but not that far off either. Further, I also shoot at a 12" steel target at 450yds with it. While I'm not that great at that long of a range with an iron sighted rifle (being 68) I can still hit the steel if I'm on my game. No, the standard model even with NM sights, isn't up to the accuracy of the full NM, but it can hold it's own too. Just sayin.

kraigwy · October 31, 2015, 09:51 AM

The M1A/M14 NM rifles arnt bench rest rifles. You shoot them like they are suppose to be shot. Position shooting, using a sling, unless something is wrong they are good for 2 MOA.

That doesn't sound like much, but its reality. If you can keep it in 2MOA you'll win just about every HP match you shoot in. The gun can do it, its the shooter that's the weakest link.

You see all sorts of sub min. groups posted on the internet. You just don't see them on the rifle range. The X-10 ring on the 1000 yard LR NRA target is 20 inches. That's 2 MOA. How many cleaned 1000 yard targets have you seen?

drobs · October 31, 2015, 10:17 AM

Check out Fred's M14 Stocks if you want some original wood.
http://www.fredsm14stocks.com/

IIRC I paid around $35 for this excellent condition stock from him:

dvdcrr · October 31, 2015, 02:50 PM

Other things come into play at 1000 yds than just the accuracy of the rifle.

kcub · October 31, 2015, 03:29 PM

I was just talking about the hand guard being plastic which looks janky next to the nice wood. Looking for one with wood handguard. I know they did the plastic to keep full auto from catching fire, but that's not a concern for a semi.

4EVERM-14 · October 31, 2015, 08:43 PM

Quote:

kraigwy
The M1A/M14 NM rifles arnt bench rest rifles. You shoot them like they are suppose to be shot. Position shooting, using a sling, unless something is wrong they are good for 2 MOA.

That doesn't sound like much, but its reality. If you can keep it in 2MOA you'll win just about every HP match you shoot in. The gun can do it, its the shooter that's the weakest link.

You see all sorts of sub min. groups posted on the internet. You just don't see them on the rifle range. The X-10 ring on the 1000 yard LR NRA target is 20 inches. That's 2 MOA. How many cleaned 1000 yard targets have you seen?

+1

highpower3006 · November 1, 2015, 11:47 AM

I had a M1A with the wood hand guard and it looked very easy to do any minor fitting that it may require.

An M14/M1A with the plastic hand guard and a wood stock looks pretty good to me.......

RKG · November 1, 2015, 02:02 PM

I understand that the M1A/M14 was not intended to be a bench rest rifle, and frankly I don't shoot mine off the bench much simply because of the added recoil effect.

That said, I have been amazed at how well the M1A shoots. Firing prone at 200 yards, the first time I recorded a 1" group -- which, incidentally, I couldn't see through the scope because they were all in the black -- I thought it was a fluke. After all, the precision of my high mileage eyes and milspec iron sights is greater than 1 MOA.

But then it happened again, and the rifle has fired even more groups in the 1-1/2 to 2" range -- again, at 200 yards. So it may not be a bench rest rifle, but apparently it is trying!

For the record, rounds were my handloads: 168 SMK, 42.2 grains RL-15, CCI LR primer, mixed brass (but mainly Win.). Cases are all sized in SB RCBS die, and all primers are checked for NLT .005" sub-flush. And, of course, all rounds were loaded from the magazine.

October 18, 2015, 04:20 AM	#1
kcub Senior Member Join Date: October 24, 2010 Location: Austin, Texas Posts: 3,318	M1A national match What accuracy out of the box with good ammo can be expected?

October 18, 2015, 05:45 AM	#2
Kosh75287 Senior Member Join Date: October 15, 2007 Posts: 820	With the 173 grain military match ammo, mine puts 5 rounds in a circle slightly less than an inch (0.898", if memory serves) at 100 yards, from a bench. A 200 yards, benched, 1.75", when I'm on my game. Best group was 1.42", but I've never shot a group that size, since. The 100 yd group size is larger than 1/2 the average 200 yard group, which tells me I wobble some at 100 yards. Don't know why. __________________ GOD BLESS JEFF COOPER, whose instructions, consultations, and publications have probably saved more lives than can ever be reliably calculated. DVC, sir. انجلو. المسلحة. جاهزة. Carpe SCOTCH!

October 18, 2015, 09:55 AM	#3
dvdcrr Senior Member Join Date: July 5, 2010 Posts: 665	^ This was my experience also. __________________ "All warfare is based on deception. Hence when we are able to attack we must seem unable....when using our forces we must appear inactive. When we are near we must make the enemy believe we are far away."Sun Tzu The Art of War.

October 18, 2015, 04:51 PM	#5
4EVERM-14 Senior Member Join Date: November 12, 2006 Location: Pennsy Posts: 720	Out of the box accuracy is going to be very dependent on the ammo you choose. Foreign ball may work but the real test will be something like Federal GMM or Black Hills . Congrads on picking a great rifle. __________________ David NRA Benefactor Member Distinguished Rifleman #731 Presidents 100

October 19, 2015, 04:11 AM	#7
gyvel Senior Member Join Date: August 30, 2009 Location: Northern AZ Posts: 7,172	I've had two: One I bought used from a Cuban guy at a gun show in Miami back in '89 that had NM sights installed on it, and I couldn't hit the broadside of a barn with it. Kind of soured me on the whole M1A thing for a while. The gun was all over the paper and I was getting 6-8" groups at 100 yds. from a bench. I just couldn't get it to zero, and I have NO idea what the problem was. Ca. 2000, I bought another in AZ brand new from Davidsons and was able to hit a grapefruit size rock with it at about 120 yds., offhand standing, right out of the box. That gun has vindicated the M1A in my eyes. One of these days, I'll bench it and see what it can do from a rest. BTW: The first one is long gone now; Sold it during the dark times of the AWB years. At least I got my money back. __________________ As always, YMMV. __________________________________________ MIIAA SIFE

October 18, 2015, 09:59 AM	#4
bobn Senior Member Join Date: December 30, 2006 Location: midwest Posts: 1,105	my national match did not shoot any better than the loaded special I had. however the sights were much more consistent. no glitches in vertical or windage adjustments. bob

October 19, 2015, 03:49 AM	#6
kcub Senior Member Join Date: October 24, 2010 Location: Austin, Texas Posts: 3,318	How is shooting it, about like a Garand?

October 29, 2015, 07:22 AM	#8
kcub Senior Member Join Date: October 24, 2010 Location: Austin, Texas Posts: 3,318	I snoozed and losed on the one in the store. I hate the chop shop look of the plastic handguard and know there are aftermarket wood replacements. They require fitting and sometimes finishing, cutting for op rods, etc. Is there someplace I could buy one completed? In other words, the shop fits it to a new M1A and they ship completed gun to my FFL. Thanks!

October 31, 2015, 09:51 AM	#10
kraigwy Senior Member Join Date: June 16, 2008 Location: Wyoming Posts: 11,061	The M1A/M14 NM rifles arnt bench rest rifles. You shoot them like they are suppose to be shot. Position shooting, using a sling, unless something is wrong they are good for 2 MOA. That doesn't sound like much, but its reality. If you can keep it in 2MOA you'll win just about every HP match you shoot in. The gun can do it, its the shooter that's the weakest link. You see all sorts of sub min. groups posted on the internet. You just don't see them on the rifle range. The X-10 ring on the 1000 yard LR NRA target is 20 inches. That's 2 MOA. How many cleaned 1000 yard targets have you seen? __________________ Kraig Stuart CPT USAR Ret USAMU Sniper School Distinguished Rifle Badge 1071

October 31, 2015, 10:17 AM	#11
drobs Senior Member Join Date: July 17, 2015 Location: South Central MO / Africa Posts: 1,111	Check out Fred's M14 Stocks if you want some original wood. http://www.fredsm14stocks.com/ IIRC I paid around $35 for this excellent condition stock from him:

October 31, 2015, 02:50 PM	#12
dvdcrr Senior Member Join Date: July 5, 2010 Posts: 665	Other things come into play at 1000 yds than just the accuracy of the rifle. __________________ "All warfare is based on deception. Hence when we are able to attack we must seem unable....when using our forces we must appear inactive. When we are near we must make the enemy believe we are far away."Sun Tzu The Art of War.

October 31, 2015, 03:29 PM	#13
kcub Senior Member Join Date: October 24, 2010 Location: Austin, Texas Posts: 3,318	I was just talking about the hand guard being plastic which looks janky next to the nice wood. Looking for one with wood handguard. I know they did the plastic to keep full auto from catching fire, but that's not a concern for a semi.

November 1, 2015, 11:47 AM	#15
highpower3006 Senior Member Join Date: July 30, 2011 Location: Savannah TN Posts: 1,220	I had a M1A with the wood hand guard and it looked very easy to do any minor fitting that it may require. An M14/M1A with the plastic hand guard and a wood stock looks pretty good to me.......

November 1, 2015, 02:02 PM	#16
RKG Senior Member Join Date: June 18, 2009 Location: Boston Posts: 562	I understand that the M1A/M14 was not intended to be a bench rest rifle, and frankly I don't shoot mine off the bench much simply because of the added recoil effect. That said, I have been amazed at how well the M1A shoots. Firing prone at 200 yards, the first time I recorded a 1" group -- which, incidentally, I couldn't see through the scope because they were all in the black -- I thought it was a fluke. After all, the precision of my high mileage eyes and milspec iron sights is greater than 1 MOA. But then it happened again, and the rifle has fired even more groups in the 1-1/2 to 2" range -- again, at 200 yards. So it may not be a bench rest rifle, but apparently it is trying! For the record, rounds were my handloads: 168 SMK, 42.2 grains RL-15, CCI LR primer, mixed brass (but mainly Win.). Cases are all sized in SB RCBS die, and all primers are checked for NLT .005" sub-flush. And, of course, all rounds were loaded from the magazine.