ak47 underfolder vs traditional stock

Dangerwing · March 31, 2014, 07:10 PM

So I'm looking at getting my first AK. I've more or less settled on a N-PAP. The question is underfolder or traditional wood stock? More specifically, how difficult is it to take one stock off and put the other one on? What say you?

AK103K · March 31, 2014, 08:42 PM

If you go with the standard stock, you can easily swap it out for a wire type side folder.

The under folder is always going to be an under folder.

TexAg · March 31, 2014, 10:04 PM

And there are some other really good side folders you can get later of you get the standard stock.

dvdcrr · March 31, 2014, 10:23 PM

The older yugo underfolders were very nice.

chris in va · March 31, 2014, 10:42 PM

Having owned an AK for a while, I never understood why a casual range plinker would have a folding stock. They are quite uncomfortable to shoot.

Get the wood or plastic stock.

ronl · March 31, 2014, 11:11 PM

I had a Polytech AK with the underfolder stock and I never shot it much because the stock was uncomfortable. I ended up selling it. I'd go with the regular stock. I still have one with a side folding East German stock and I really do like that one, but they have become difficult to find these days.

leadcounsel · April 1, 2014, 12:08 AM

What need do you honestly have for a space-saving folding stock, honestly?

I bought an underfolder Yugo and the thing wobbles.

I also have wire side-folding models and, while they do save space, what's the point? I'm not carrying them around in battle-ready trenchcoats, or riding in the back of Landrovers awaiting to assault an objective...

Can't get a good cheek weld with an underfolder or a wire side-folder.

Go with the standard fixed or adjustable stock for a solid cheek weld and sturdy platform.

Yung.gunr · April 1, 2014, 12:24 AM

Go with a traditional wood stock and leave it for at least a couple thousand rounds.

I did a Saiga conversion and put a plastic collapsible folding stock on it. Wishing I would have just gone with a Warsaw length (shorter than NATO) stock. Now I don't want to waste the money to change it. I originally wanted to get an underfolder. I shouldered one in the LGS and changed my mind. Like others have said, really not necessary for the trade offs in most of our situations.

Just get the regular wood stock, shoot it for a while and if you still get the urge to change it up, PM me and who knows... Maybe we can trade furniture.

Brotherbadger · April 1, 2014, 12:26 AM

Quote:

If you go with the standard stock, you can easily swap it out for a wire type side folder.

The under folder is always going to be an under folder.

Nailed it. I'd go wooden stock(or a side folder) all the way.

Quote:

What need do you honestly have for a space-saving folding stock, honestly?

I've found 90% of the time it's not about function, it's about the form. Some folks(myself included) just like the look of a folding stock on an AK.

sawdoff · April 1, 2014, 05:19 AM

Having both and a Draco... go with the fixed stock or a side folder. Underfolders can be fun but the full stock does help quite a bit. But if your doing it for size reasons get one of the AK pistols (PAP or Draco) put a sling on it and push pull it works pretty well for me.

Skans · April 2, 2014, 08:05 AM

When buying an AK, I always recommend buying the underfolder. You cannot swap out a wood stock for an underfolder - they use different rear trunions that are rivited to the receiver.

Buy the underfolder because some day......real soon, you won't be able to. And, in a SHTF scenario (which is what AK's are really good for), it's much easier to carry and possible to conceal an underfolder.

If you are looking for a rifle with a long stock that can bee aimed a little more accurately, then look for some other type of rifle. Embrace the AK for what it is, not what it wants to be.

Fishbed77 · April 2, 2014, 09:27 AM

Get a standard stock. If you really want a folding stock, you can easily install a Bonesteel folder that has much better ergos than the underfolder.

JD0x0 · April 2, 2014, 11:59 AM

What's the advantage of the side folder versus the under folder? Is it just the fact that you have the ability to swap to solid stocks?

I've always preferred the looks of the under folder, and I was always under the impression that the under folder was more fun and had an advantage because you could more easily operate the weapon with the stock folded compared to the side folder.(CQC advantage?)
Am I incorrect? I have never handled a folding stock AK, as they're not allowed where I live.

halfcocked · April 2, 2014, 12:41 PM

For me underfolders have the highest "cool factor" and I like the look the bese but are least functional for all the reasons stated. Also, to carry in the folded position, the stock under the forend is very wide and doesn't provide a good grip to carry.

Any AK collection should have an underfolder, but if you're just going to have one, the fixed stock (or the Arsenal side folder with the regular fixed stock is sweet) is the way to go.

Side folders are still hard to shoot if the fixed wire kind (Hungarian, Poland, Romania), but are a bit easier than the underfolder.

Side folders also lock up tighter and don't "wobble" like an underfolder.

Side folders can fold either way. Wire ones fold to the right, the triangular Russian style or the Arsenal ones fold to the left. Either one will function with the stock folded, but the ones folding to the left are easier since they don't partially block the controls.

Fishbed77 · April 2, 2014, 01:10 PM

Quote:

What's the advantage of the side folder versus the under folder? Is it just the fact that you have the ability to swap to solid stocks?

Cheek weld and comfort is VASTLY better on most varieties of side-folders versus the underfolders.

.

jonnyc · April 2, 2014, 01:38 PM

I have a Polish with a standard wood stock, and a Yugo Underfolder. I much prefer to shoot the U/F.

Bart Noir · April 2, 2014, 01:46 PM

Quote:

I also have wire side-folding models and, while they do save space, what's the point?

I live in an apartment and do not like all the neighbors seeing me take a rifle case out to the range. A folding AK fits in a non-gun shaped smaller bag. And my AR goes to the range in an even smaller bag, since I take it apart.

So there is a reason.

Bart Noir

Bart Noir · April 2, 2014, 01:52 PM

I voted with my feet, sort of.

My Yugo underfolder was sold. It locked up firmly and the paracord I put around the left arm of the stock made it not uncomfortable to shoot. The folding stock was angled more horizontal than some U/F guns, so I could get a good sight picture.

Come to think of it, I sold that before I grew my beard. The beard might not have played well with that underfolding stock. I suspect I would have found new and interesting ways to remove beard hairs...

But my new Arsenal folds to the left and is a solid stock that solidly locks up in the solidly open position. Really, it is so solid that I have to work hard at unlatching it. It is just right and I recommend that design.

Bart Noir

Bart Noir · April 2, 2014, 02:02 PM

For those with the wire type folding stocks, to include the East German & Egyptian "crutch" design, a company sells add-on cheek rests. I haven't used them but they look like a smart design. Go here to learn more: (search the site for wire stocks other than the Polish one shown)

Apex Gun Parts - cheek rest

A review:

Review of one wire stock - modified

Bart Noir

Destructo6 · April 2, 2014, 04:27 PM

Another vote for the fixed stock or side folder (if you must have a folder).

The best side folder I've used is the AK-10x series side folder. Extended, it looks and feels exactly like a fixed stock, but folds for storage or transport. The best of both worlds, IMO.

AK103K · April 2, 2014, 04:32 PM

I think the ideal side folder is one of the AK100 series "full stock" folders. Next best thing to the standard stock.

The Romanian side folders are rock solid open or closed, and give the same LOP and cheek weld as a standard stock. I never found them to be uncomfortable to shoot. While they are very functional, they arent real appealing aesthetically though.

Pretty much every under folder Ive shot has had a good bit of wobble in them, were not as comfortable to shoot with, and would be my last choice.

tahunua001 · April 2, 2014, 04:41 PM

swapping stocks is fairly simple. underfolders, in my experience kick like a mule.

Darker Loaf · April 2, 2014, 06:27 PM

+1 on the side folder.

But getting a fixed stock isn't a bad idea either. You can also swap a fixed stock for a good side-folder.

I have an Arsenal SAM7-SF (Side Folder) in 7.62x39, and I too was worried about a bad cheek weld, wobbliness, impracticality, and decreased accuracy. I am happy to say, though my particular gun has other problems, the side-folder is pretty damn nice. It's like a door-hinge, and when I first got the gun, I had the gun store hit the button with a polymer hammer to release it. So, it is totally solid and feels like a fixed stock. Also, I had no issues with the cheek weld being uncomfortable or even cold. Maybe it's that I'm used to cold, but the metal really wasn't an issue even at near 0 F conditions (deer hunting).

But really, fixed or side-folding, you can't go wrong. Heh. Get both!

As far as underfolders, I'd say "no." Then you will probably have the problems that others are mentioning: uncomfortability, wobbliness, and poor cheek weld. I'd ask: is this your only AK? If so, get something that's more comfortable to shoot. The point of having an AK (or heck really any gun) is to enjoy it. Especially since you are buying the cheapest centerfire rifle caliber, get a good stock and shoot it until it the gun breaks! Enjoy!

highpower3006 · April 4, 2014, 08:10 AM

I vote to get both. I have both a Yugo PAP and a M70AB2 underfolder. The fixed stock is hands down, more comfy to shoot and lines up your eye with the sights better. But.... the underfolder is so darn cool to look at, that it makes up for what ever ergonomic deficiencies it has while operating it.

I mean, how can you not like it?

TexAg · April 4, 2014, 10:18 PM

Bonesteel.

March 31, 2014, 07:10 PM	#1
Dangerwing Senior Member Join Date: April 9, 2007 Location: South Dakota Posts: 237	ak47 underfolder vs traditional stock So I'm looking at getting my first AK. I've more or less settled on a N-PAP. The question is underfolder or traditional wood stock? More specifically, how difficult is it to take one stock off and put the other one on? What say you? __________________ Alcohol Tobacco and Firearms should be an aisle at Wal-Mart, not a government agency! Only faithful men teach their wives to shoot.

April 2, 2014, 01:38 PM	#16
jonnyc Senior Member Join Date: July 20, 2009 Location: PA Posts: 1,731	I have a Polish with a standard wood stock, and a Yugo Underfolder. I much prefer to shoot the U/F. __________________ 2024 PA Cartridge Collector Show; Aug. 16-17, 2024!!! Buy...Sell...Trade All Types of Ammunition & Ordnance PM or email me for 2024 show details.

April 2, 2014, 01:52 PM	#18
Bart Noir Senior Member Join Date: August 5, 2000 Location: Puget Sound, USA Posts: 2,215	I voted with my feet, sort of. My Yugo underfolder was sold. It locked up firmly and the paracord I put around the left arm of the stock made it not uncomfortable to shoot. The folding stock was angled more horizontal than some U/F guns, so I could get a good sight picture. Come to think of it, I sold that before I grew my beard. The beard might not have played well with that underfolding stock. I suspect I would have found new and interesting ways to remove beard hairs... But my new Arsenal folds to the left and is a solid stock that solidly locks up in the solidly open position. Really, it is so solid that I have to work hard at unlatching it. It is just right and I recommend that design. Bart Noir __________________ Be of good cheer and mindful of your gun muzzle!

April 2, 2014, 02:02 PM	#19
Bart Noir Senior Member Join Date: August 5, 2000 Location: Puget Sound, USA Posts: 2,215	For those with the wire type folding stocks, to include the East German & Egyptian "crutch" design, a company sells add-on cheek rests. I haven't used them but they look like a smart design. Go here to learn more: (search the site for wire stocks other than the Polish one shown) Apex Gun Parts - cheek rest A review: Review of one wire stock - modified Bart Noir __________________ Be of good cheer and mindful of your gun muzzle!

April 2, 2014, 04:27 PM	#20
Destructo6 Senior Member Join Date: March 18, 1999 Location: Nogales, AZ USA Posts: 4,000	Another vote for the fixed stock or side folder (if you must have a folder). The best side folder I've used is the AK-10x series side folder. Extended, it looks and feels exactly like a fixed stock, but folds for storage or transport. The best of both worlds, IMO. __________________ God gave you a soul. Your parents, a body. Your country, a rifle. Keep all of them clean.

March 31, 2014, 08:42 PM	#2
AK103K Senior Member Join Date: May 1, 2001 Posts: 10,223	If you go with the standard stock, you can easily swap it out for a wire type side folder. The under folder is always going to be an under folder.

March 31, 2014, 10:04 PM	#3
TexAg Member Join Date: July 9, 2010 Posts: 79	And there are some other really good side folders you can get later of you get the standard stock.

March 31, 2014, 10:23 PM	#4
dvdcrr Senior Member Join Date: July 5, 2010 Posts: 665	The older yugo underfolders were very nice.

March 31, 2014, 10:42 PM	#5
chris in va Senior Member Join Date: December 26, 2004 Location: Louisville KY Posts: 13,806	Having owned an AK for a while, I never understood why a casual range plinker would have a folding stock. They are quite uncomfortable to shoot. Get the wood or plastic stock.

March 31, 2014, 11:11 PM	#6
ronl Senior Member Join Date: December 2, 2007 Posts: 1,100	I had a Polytech AK with the underfolder stock and I never shot it much because the stock was uncomfortable. I ended up selling it. I'd go with the regular stock. I still have one with a side folding East German stock and I really do like that one, but they have become difficult to find these days.

April 1, 2014, 12:08 AM	#7
leadcounsel Junior member Join Date: September 8, 2005 Location: Tacoma, WA Posts: 2,119	What need do you honestly have for a space-saving folding stock, honestly? I bought an underfolder Yugo and the thing wobbles. I also have wire side-folding models and, while they do save space, what's the point? I'm not carrying them around in battle-ready trenchcoats, or riding in the back of Landrovers awaiting to assault an objective... Can't get a good cheek weld with an underfolder or a wire side-folder. Go with the standard fixed or adjustable stock for a solid cheek weld and sturdy platform.

April 1, 2014, 12:24 AM	#8
Yung.gunr Senior Member Join Date: November 11, 2010 Location: Phoenix area Posts: 1,442	Go with a traditional wood stock and leave it for at least a couple thousand rounds. I did a Saiga conversion and put a plastic collapsible folding stock on it. Wishing I would have just gone with a Warsaw length (shorter than NATO) stock. Now I don't want to waste the money to change it. I originally wanted to get an underfolder. I shouldered one in the LGS and changed my mind. Like others have said, really not necessary for the trade offs in most of our situations. Just get the regular wood stock, shoot it for a while and if you still get the urge to change it up, PM me and who knows... Maybe we can trade furniture.

April 1, 2014, 05:19 AM	#10
sawdoff Junior Member Join Date: March 29, 2014 Posts: 12	Having both and a Draco... go with the fixed stock or a side folder. Underfolders can be fun but the full stock does help quite a bit. But if your doing it for size reasons get one of the AK pistols (PAP or Draco) put a sling on it and push pull it works pretty well for me.

April 2, 2014, 08:05 AM	#11
Skans Senior Member Join Date: November 20, 2008 Posts: 11,132	When buying an AK, I always recommend buying the underfolder. You cannot swap out a wood stock for an underfolder - they use different rear trunions that are rivited to the receiver. Buy the underfolder because some day......real soon, you won't be able to. And, in a SHTF scenario (which is what AK's are really good for), it's much easier to carry and possible to conceal an underfolder. If you are looking for a rifle with a long stock that can bee aimed a little more accurately, then look for some other type of rifle. Embrace the AK for what it is, not what it wants to be.

April 2, 2014, 09:27 AM	#12
Fishbed77 Senior Member Join Date: November 23, 2010 Posts: 4,862	Get a standard stock. If you really want a folding stock, you can easily install a Bonesteel folder that has much better ergos than the underfolder.

April 2, 2014, 11:59 AM	#13
JD0x0 Senior Member Join Date: January 30, 2013 Posts: 1,037	What's the advantage of the side folder versus the under folder? Is it just the fact that you have the ability to swap to solid stocks? I've always preferred the looks of the under folder, and I was always under the impression that the under folder was more fun and had an advantage because you could more easily operate the weapon with the stock folded compared to the side folder.(CQC advantage?) Am I incorrect? I have never handled a folding stock AK, as they're not allowed where I live.

April 2, 2014, 12:41 PM	#14
halfcocked Senior Member Join Date: June 26, 2001 Location: NE PA Posts: 140	For me underfolders have the highest "cool factor" and I like the look the bese but are least functional for all the reasons stated. Also, to carry in the folded position, the stock under the forend is very wide and doesn't provide a good grip to carry. Any AK collection should have an underfolder, but if you're just going to have one, the fixed stock (or the Arsenal side folder with the regular fixed stock is sweet) is the way to go. Side folders are still hard to shoot if the fixed wire kind (Hungarian, Poland, Romania), but are a bit easier than the underfolder. Side folders also lock up tighter and don't "wobble" like an underfolder. Side folders can fold either way. Wire ones fold to the right, the triangular Russian style or the Arsenal ones fold to the left. Either one will function with the stock folded, but the ones folding to the left are easier since they don't partially block the controls.

April 2, 2014, 04:32 PM	#21
AK103K Senior Member Join Date: May 1, 2001 Posts: 10,223	I think the ideal side folder is one of the AK100 series "full stock" folders. Next best thing to the standard stock. The Romanian side folders are rock solid open or closed, and give the same LOP and cheek weld as a standard stock. I never found them to be uncomfortable to shoot. While they are very functional, they arent real appealing aesthetically though. Pretty much every under folder Ive shot has had a good bit of wobble in them, were not as comfortable to shoot with, and would be my last choice.

April 2, 2014, 04:41 PM	#22
tahunua001 Senior Member Join Date: July 21, 2011 Location: Idaho Posts: 7,839	swapping stocks is fairly simple. underfolders, in my experience kick like a mule. __________________ ignore my complete lack of capitalization. I still have no problem correcting your grammar. I never said half the stuff people said I did-Albert Einstein You can't believe everything you read on the internet-Benjamin Franklin

April 2, 2014, 06:27 PM	#23
Darker Loaf Senior Member Join Date: October 25, 2012 Posts: 715	+1 on the side folder. But getting a fixed stock isn't a bad idea either. You can also swap a fixed stock for a good side-folder. I have an Arsenal SAM7-SF (Side Folder) in 7.62x39, and I too was worried about a bad cheek weld, wobbliness, impracticality, and decreased accuracy. I am happy to say, though my particular gun has other problems, the side-folder is pretty damn nice. It's like a door-hinge, and when I first got the gun, I had the gun store hit the button with a polymer hammer to release it. So, it is totally solid and feels like a fixed stock. Also, I had no issues with the cheek weld being uncomfortable or even cold. Maybe it's that I'm used to cold, but the metal really wasn't an issue even at near 0 F conditions (deer hunting). But really, fixed or side-folding, you can't go wrong. Heh. Get both! As far as underfolders, I'd say "no." Then you will probably have the problems that others are mentioning: uncomfortability, wobbliness, and poor cheek weld. I'd ask: is this your only AK? If so, get something that's more comfortable to shoot. The point of having an AK (or heck really any gun) is to enjoy it. Especially since you are buying the cheapest centerfire rifle caliber, get a good stock and shoot it until it the gun breaks! Enjoy!

April 4, 2014, 08:10 AM	#24
highpower3006 Senior Member Join Date: July 30, 2011 Location: Savannah TN Posts: 1,220	I vote to get both. I have both a Yugo PAP and a M70AB2 underfolder. The fixed stock is hands down, more comfy to shoot and lines up your eye with the sights better. But.... the underfolder is so darn cool to look at, that it makes up for what ever ergonomic deficiencies it has while operating it. I mean, how can you not like it?

April 4, 2014, 10:18 PM	#25
TexAg Member Join Date: July 9, 2010 Posts: 79	Bonesteel.