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September 2, 2011, 01:56 AM | #1 | |
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Clarence Thomas and the 2nd Amendment
Real Clear Politics has an interesting article on U.S. Supreme Court Justice Clarence Thomas, which delves into his beliefs on the 2nd Amendment and how he has influenced SCOTUS in this matter.
Quote:
I think all we who value the 2nd Amendment owe a debt of gratitude to Constitutional Originalists like Clarence Thomas
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September 2, 2011, 06:04 AM | #2 | ||
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Limbaugh tore into the subject for 1/2 an hour the other day, I think they are friends and it was a great little segment.
Transcript: http://www.rushlimbaugh.com/home/dai...111.guest.html Part of what stood out was this particular Thomas quote, what it means moving forward, and how he seems to be on a pathway towards bringing some clarity or definition to 2 and 10, regardless of precedent which may lean to the contrary. Quote:
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Last edited by alloy; September 2, 2011 at 07:43 AM. |
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September 2, 2011, 08:11 AM | #3 |
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Not surprised. Justice Thomas is one of my most admired individuals.
Jerry
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September 2, 2011, 08:38 AM | #4 | |
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As much as I enjoy Scalia's temperment, I think a Supreme Court full of Thomases would better fufill its function. His view of his role is modest and many of his opinions are brief and direct.
For all the oxygen we used in L-school yacking about the commerce clause, it is shocking in retrospect that no one in my class, me included, made an observation as simple as Thomas' in his dissent in Raich. Quote:
The idea that "interstate commerce" means actual commerce that is interstate would be embarrassingly obvious had the observation not gone missing for so long.
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September 2, 2011, 09:48 AM | #5 |
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The type of individual that a candidate will nominate or vote to confirm should be a major consideration when you vote.
Thomas is the type of judge that is protecting our rights. We need more like him. |
September 2, 2011, 08:31 PM | #6 |
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When Justice Thomas was first nominated I was not a supporter. I was not a supporter, though I admired him, of his mentor Sen. John Danforth.
Over the years I have come to admire and respect the Justice for his strength of character, courage to face brutal attacks, and his sense of history and judicial temprament. |
September 2, 2011, 10:06 PM | #7 | |
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Quote:
That said, I've grown to be a great admirer of Justice Thomas. He writes little, and speaks less, but when he does, it's worth listening. His dissent in McDonald was the conclusion I sorely wish the rest of the Court had come to.
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September 3, 2011, 10:56 AM | #8 | |
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Justice Thomas is the only true originalist, currently on the Supreme Court.
Regardless of whether or not I agree or disagree with his written opinions, I appluad him in his steadfast adherence to the Constitution. In Gonzales v. Raich, Justice Thomas started his dissent with this: Quote:
Fortunately, the Court appears to be shifting towards the views of Thomas, as Jeffrey Toobin writes in The New Yorker. |
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September 3, 2011, 12:21 PM | #9 |
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amen
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September 3, 2011, 12:38 PM | #10 |
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One of the best threads I've read on any forum, bar none.
Thanks for this. It tends to give me some hope to cling to. --Wag--
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September 3, 2011, 02:22 PM | #11 | ||
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Link to Walter Russell Mead's blog, reviewing the Toobin atricle.
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Counting on a little common sense could go a long ways these days, and I'd have to agree with Wag.
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September 3, 2011, 03:08 PM | #12 |
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Clarence Thomas--not exactly the stereotypical guy Obama thought of as back in the hills, clinging to guns, religion, Coca-Cola and other groovy things. A far out dude in his own right, Clarence Thomas.
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September 4, 2011, 08:39 AM | #13 |
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I don't trust any of those Supreme Court judges.... they've spent their whole lives paid by government.... how in the world can they more often than not divide 5 to 4.... most of these decisions are decided as a group in the back.... if it was really serious there is not way they would constantly have that 5-4.
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September 4, 2011, 10:18 AM | #14 | |
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September 4, 2011, 10:36 AM | #15 | |
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It is bothersome to me that the nominations are handled as they are today. Every American should be an "originalist" in the sense that the basic principles of the COTUS are unchanging. Liberal, Conservative, all should want honest, original, interpretations. Nominations should not be "who will further my agenda". It should be "Who will protect the Constitution?" I like Justice Thomas. A few more like him would be nice. Last edited by Brian Pfleuger; September 4, 2011 at 04:35 PM. Reason: spelling |
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September 4, 2011, 03:37 PM | #16 |
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So many decisions are 5-4 rather than 7-2 or 8-1 because too many of the sitting justices were nominated as much for their political leanings as for their legal acumen. ALL cases before the SCOTUS are supposed to be decided on the basis of what the Constitution says is and is not allowed for government to do. If ALL cases were, in fact, decided on this basis, a lot more cases would be unanimous or nearly unanimous. The fact that so many are cliff-hangers and that one moderate justice is so often the "swing vote" is proof positive that many of the justices are NOT reading what the Constitution says, they are reading what they want it to say or what they wish it says.
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September 4, 2011, 05:34 PM | #17 | |
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Did you catch his evidence that the Court is moving toward Thomas on the commerce power? Very, very thin. He mentions the Lopez case, without mentioning that it overturned a previous version of the law, leaving the current one in place, where it remains. He did NOT mention Morrison, another significant commerce case. He most certainly was not going to mention Raich, because that subject is pretty much taboo everywhere these days. Had he mentioned it, he would have been faced with the inconvenient fact that Scalia, the other "originalist" in his article, voted the other way, and the fact that Thomas was in dissent. Two pretty big clues that "The Court" is not going his way; he can't even get Scalia! Toobin's evidence was also thin in other areas. He quoted from an opinion without naming it. Does anyone know which opinion it was? Kelo. Another toxic, taboo subject. In addition to omitting the case in question with his quote, Toobin omitted the fact that Thomas was again in dissent. |
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September 4, 2011, 06:47 PM | #18 |
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Scalia is the firebrand we hear about on the evening news. Thomas' influence runs just as deep, but it's far more subtle. It was his opinion in the Printz case that influenced the Emerson decision, which in turn gave impetus to the Heller case.
The New Yorker article is actually quite respectful. The parallels between Thomas and Hugo Black hand't occurred to me before, but I can see that now.
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September 4, 2011, 08:53 PM | #19 | |
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Basically Thomas has cheated on his taxes for 13 years and lied about it in official government forms. If you or I did the same we would be in front of the bench not behind it as Thomas is. As has become more apparent. Thomas perjured himself during his confirmation hearing. http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1010/44051.html http://articles.latimes.com/2001/jul/03/news/cl-18003 There would be an active investigation if you or I were accused of the same thing. Thomas has signed onto some of the most activist decisions in the history of the court. "Citizens United" made it legal for corporations to make unlimited anonymous contributions to political campaigns. Find an originalist argument for that. "Alabama v. Garrett" Thomas sides with the decision that makes it illegal to sue your state in federal court. "Ledbetter v. Goodyear" Thomas sided with the majority decision that Ledbetter could not sue for the wages she had been cheated out of, because she wasn't aware she was being cheated by Goodyear from time Goodyear started cheating. Thomas is the antithesis of either a conservative or an originalist. That is unless your definition of "conservative" means pro-business political functionary and "originalist" means finding expedient justifications for political activism. |
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September 4, 2011, 09:30 PM | #20 | ||
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Suffice it to say that without getting into the politics angle that isn't a subject for conversation here, several of your other accusations are subject to a different interpretation than the one you gave. Quote:
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September 4, 2011, 09:36 PM | #21 |
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And for the record, even before Citizens United, corporations could do all kinds of political favors - the New York Times being a prime example of a corporation who wields its power for political influence free of any campaign finance rule. Reason did an excellent article about why Citizens United isn't a disaster
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September 4, 2011, 10:05 PM | #22 | |
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That's the catch, and the single biggest error of interpretation today. The COTUS is not intended (primarily, substantially) to limit people or companies. It is intended to limit government interference with people and companies. So many people see it backwards. How can I use this to influence, add power, usurp authority, enforce my will? No. Wrong. The COTUS was intended to PREVENT undue government influence. LIMIT government power. MAINTAIN the authority of the people. ENSURE the will of THE PEOPLE. Fact is, the National government should have very little influence on the day to day lives of people and companies. It's primary interactions should be with the states themselves and foreign powers. The states should have more, but still limited, influence and power over people within their borders. The local governments should have yet more, but even still limited, influence over the people directly. The people were to control the government. Not what we have today. THAT is the originalist argument.
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September 4, 2011, 10:13 PM | #23 |
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Money is only part of the picture where influence is concerned. When the mainstream media (read: groups of individuals) supports a candidate or a piece of legislation, they are, in effect, throwing the entire weight of their assets behind that cause. And they have a right to do it under the first amendment.
So, now, do individuals or groups of individuals NOT in the media business. |
September 4, 2011, 11:03 PM | #24 | |
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Ryan |
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September 4, 2011, 11:14 PM | #25 | |
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As far as 2A is concerned, I think we've got a pretty good bunch with the five-justice majority of both Heller and McDonald. The originalists like Thomas and to a slightly lesser degree Scalia are persuasive enough to ensure that 2A cases go our way, but the more moderate justices, Roberts and Kennedy in particular, temper them so that they don't "legislate from the bench" with unforeseen consequences. |
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