Best media to stop a bullet and observe

ATPBULLETS · February 8, 2015, 08:10 AM

What is in your opinion,,, the best CHEAP media to stop a bullet and observe its expansion.?
Don't need accurate penetration... just a way to save the bullet and see a semi reliable expansion profile.
Powerful revolver... 45 colt ruger loadings, 45acp+p and the 460 smith and Wesson..maybe 357mag as well.
thanks in advance

ps... with different powder loads..and velocities... I would like to see the difference of these adjustments.

Bart B. · February 8, 2015, 08:26 AM

Buy a few cases of cooking gelatin then mix it thick to pour into plastic lined cubic foot boxes. After it hardens, cut the box off then put two in a row. Shoot into the end one. If the bullet goes through both, use three next time.

Ballistic gelatin is commercially available from Midway.

ATPBULLETS · February 8, 2015, 08:47 AM

Thank you for the idea, I will head to the grocery now. that should work well.

Geezerbiker · February 8, 2015, 08:47 AM

In the past I've used water soaked phone books. Soak them for an hour or so then put in a box to keep them upright and shoot. The results are not 100% real world but they do give you a good means of comparison...

Tony

wogpotter · February 8, 2015, 09:32 AM

Dihydrogen monoxide.
Free from the tap.

I put it into rinsed out 5 lit wine boxes for easy transport, just stack them together for depth the un-penetrated ones can be reused even.

g.willikers · February 8, 2015, 11:00 AM

Sand or hard packed dirt, about six inches worth will stop most anything.

Wreck-n-Crew · February 8, 2015, 01:19 PM

Not sure about sand and dirt but FME water will deform some bullets more than BG and the Home Made Gelatin does work well. The expansion in water does surpass gelatin in some of my tests. Go figure! and YMMV

I got into shooting pig carcasses back in the 90's. I had a few sources from whole wild hogs to expired meat from a butcher or two. Seemed to me to be the more realistic at the time. Seeing what a bullet would do traveling through some kind of flesh and rib bone. I was really surprised at what a .357 would to both pig sources. Really made some nasty holes! However none of the ones that people rumored about. You know the 1" entry wound and the 6" exit wound? It, well...never happened.

Kountzer0 · February 9, 2015, 12:42 PM

I used water as well, but I bought a few cases of the gallon sized jugs from the local mart for less than a dollar per jug. I needed many because I was testing the penetration of non expanding flat nosed lead alloy 265grain bullets in the ruger 45colt loads. Ended up finding the bullet in the 12th jug, which were 6inches deep. I also compared that to the nosler 255gr jhp, which was in the 7th jug and retained 75% mass and expanded to 1inch in diameter. 180 gr accubonds in 30-06 hand loads were similar, and all 3 have performed very well on elk, but I didn't want to shoot an elk without knowing the potential of each bullet. You could always save your milk jugs and do the same. For even less money.

Marco Califo · February 9, 2015, 01:04 PM

Google Ballistic Gelatin. There are recipes and an FBI accepted calibration procedure that as I recall involved a certain air rifle pumped a certain number of times to penetrate X inches. A chronograph would also be useful to know the FPS of the BB or pellet.

That said, to test hollow-point pistol ammo for expansion, I have found a combination of dirt and water, commonly known as mud, to be most useful. Sand in the mix, or below, will aid recovery by reducing penetration.

Good place to start your research: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ballistic_gelatin

$36.30 for 5 pounds of bulk gelatin powder: https://www.azurestandard.com/shop/product/345/
versus $100 for 5 pounds in little envelopes at Walmart.

Mike / Tx · February 9, 2015, 01:22 PM

I use the sandy loam up at the farm. It is super fine sand about the size of baby powder. It sifts REALLY well and with about 8oz of water added to it is just about perfect. I fill up 5 gallon buckets put the top on, lay it on it's side across the top of a 55 gallon barrel, and fire into the top. At 25yds it will stop most stuff from the 41 down, but bigger I have to move to 50yds.

I have been digging bullets out of this stuff my whole life and it is close enough to what I have recovered from game that I trust it completely.

I'm sure if you look through some of my post you will see plenty of expanded cast bullets I have shot into it.

Here are some more showing the bucket as well,
Alloy Testing

skizzums · February 9, 2015, 11:24 PM

I always use plain old water and I get great expansion results. it seems a little more violent than gelatin though. I have three five gallon buckets with a circle cut out of two of the bottoms. I put a piece f duct tape over the holes when I do the test. the buckets stand about 3" from each other when stacked. so if it breaks the first duct tape I am in the 10-13" range, second 13-16". I don't know how water penetration equates to gel, it just gives me a way to compare my own personal loads against each other quick and free.

other than getting really wet, it easy and useful. I do it from my second story deck now because the water goes so high.

TXAZ · February 9, 2015, 11:38 PM

~250 pages of a telephone book stops a 30.06'

ATPBULLETS · February 10, 2015, 08:25 AM

mud and water...would have never thought it.... thanks,,, that's cheap enough

A pause for the COZ · February 10, 2015, 09:44 AM

I am interested in finding that Gel that can be remelted and used over and over.
I have seen it, just cant remember were.

wogpotter · February 10, 2015, 10:41 AM

This maybe?
http://clearballistics.com/

FITASC · February 10, 2015, 10:48 AM

Big pickle barrel or 55 gallon drum with water - bullet will be perfectly preserved

ATPBULLETS · February 10, 2015, 12:46 PM

Quote:

mud and water...would have never thought it.... thanks,,, that's cheap enough

That didnt work.....blew the 5gal bucket up and exited the rear....about a 1 inch hole out the back....
Did produce what looks like a 3 inch cavity all the way thru from about 4 inches in.......wild!!!

Marco Califo · February 10, 2015, 12:53 PM

Quote:

That didnt work.....blew the 5gal bucket up

Specifically, what did not work was the 5 gallon bucket part.
And a loose nut behind the trigger.
Always have an adequate backstop for shooting safety.

oldpapps · February 10, 2015, 01:41 PM

I've used gallon plastic milk jugs filled with water.
I was able to catch three 30 caliber cast lead and powder coated bullets fired from my 300 BlackOut. Each shot would split 3 to 5 jugs. The rainbows were nice. It took a long time for me to collect that many milk jugs.
After using up most of the jugs, my granddaughter just shot one jug at a time. That was splashing fun.

Note, bullets when hitting water sometimes do strange things like turning corners.

Load with care,

OSOK

wogpotter · February 10, 2015, 05:23 PM

Quote:

That didnt work.....blew the 5gal bucket up and exited the rear

That's why I used the wine boxes. You can just stack as many as you need & you can move them about in manageable weights. Being unsure of penetration I used 7 boxes

For example a 125 Gr .357 Mag @ 1350 FPS at 7 yds The bullet penetrated 4 boxes for a total distance of 16” & struck, but didn’t penetrate the rear wall of box #4.

Before & after pictures.
(all images are (c) Wogpotter 2011)

FrankenMauser · February 10, 2015, 06:38 PM

Gallon milk jugs full of water...

Soaked newsprint (not just wet - soaked)...

Soaked phone books...

Sand traps (dry or wet - the difference is just the depth of penetration)...

Soaked rags...

Just remember that while 10" of one of these mediums might be adequate to stop most bullets, other mediums might require 24-48" to do the job.

WVMountaineer · February 10, 2015, 08:02 PM

Good ole, cheap, easy to find sand. God Bless

30Cal · February 10, 2015, 08:40 PM

Snow bank. Cheapest thing going.

May have to wait until May to observe the results though. Come one by; I've got a couple of them.

4runnerman · February 10, 2015, 08:59 PM

Get a bunch of old Phone books,Put in box. Soak with water and shoot

9MMand223only · February 11, 2015, 05:46 PM

I use 1 gallon water juggs I buy at wallmart for 88 cents each.

The bullets will settle, perfectly flowered, perfectly, in 3rd or 4th jugg depending on load.I shoot top of jugg area with 1, then shoot bottom with another real quick. Doesn't always work, but can get 1-2 per 4 juggs pretty good. So if you take 16 juggs to range, expect you can get 4-6 tests.

February 8, 2015, 08:10 AM	#1
ATPBULLETS Senior Member Join Date: July 31, 2012 Location: Land between the Lakes Posts: 267	Best media to stop a bullet and observe What is in your opinion,,, the best CHEAP media to stop a bullet and observe its expansion.? Don't need accurate penetration... just a way to save the bullet and see a semi reliable expansion profile. Powerful revolver... 45 colt ruger loadings, 45acp+p and the 460 smith and Wesson..maybe 357mag as well. thanks in advance ps... with different powder loads..and velocities... I would like to see the difference of these adjustments. __________________ http://i805.photobucket.com/albums/y...e/photo-25.jpg

February 8, 2015, 08:26 AM	#2
Bart B. Senior Member Join Date: February 15, 2009 Posts: 8,927	Buy a few cases of cooking gelatin then mix it thick to pour into plastic lined cubic foot boxes. After it hardens, cut the box off then put two in a row. Shoot into the end one. If the bullet goes through both, use three next time. Ballistic gelatin is commercially available from Midway. Last edited by Bart B.; February 8, 2015 at 08:35 AM.

February 8, 2015, 08:47 AM	#3
ATPBULLETS Senior Member Join Date: July 31, 2012 Location: Land between the Lakes Posts: 267	Thank you for the idea, I will head to the grocery now. that should work well. __________________ http://i805.photobucket.com/albums/y...e/photo-25.jpg

February 8, 2015, 09:32 AM	#5
wogpotter Senior Member Join Date: September 27, 2004 Posts: 4,811	Dihydrogen monoxide. Free from the tap. I put it into rinsed out 5 lit wine boxes for easy transport, just stack them together for depth the un-penetrated ones can be reused even. __________________ Allan Quatermain: “Automatic rifles. Who in God's name has automatic rifles”? Elderly Hunter: “That's dashed unsporting. Probably Belgium.”

February 8, 2015, 11:00 AM	#6
g.willikers Senior Member Join Date: September 28, 2008 Posts: 10,442	Sand or hard packed dirt, about six inches worth will stop most anything. __________________ Walt Kelly, alias Pogo, sez: “Don't take life so serious, son, it ain't nohow permanent.”

February 8, 2015, 08:47 AM	#4
Geezerbiker Senior Member Join Date: March 20, 2011 Location: Willamina, OR Posts: 1,908	In the past I've used water soaked phone books. Soak them for an hour or so then put in a box to keep them upright and shoot. The results are not 100% real world but they do give you a good means of comparison... Tony

February 8, 2015, 01:19 PM	#7
Wreck-n-Crew Senior Member Join Date: March 8, 2013 Location: Ohio Posts: 1,820	Not sure about sand and dirt but FME water will deform some bullets more than BG and the Home Made Gelatin does work well. The expansion in water does surpass gelatin in some of my tests. Go figure! and YMMV I got into shooting pig carcasses back in the 90's. I had a few sources from whole wild hogs to expired meat from a butcher or two. Seemed to me to be the more realistic at the time. Seeing what a bullet would do traveling through some kind of flesh and rib bone. I was really surprised at what a .357 would to both pig sources. Really made some nasty holes! However none of the ones that people rumored about. You know the 1" entry wound and the 6" exit wound? It, well...never happened. __________________ If you ever have to use a firearm, *you don't get to pick the scenario!* Last edited by Wreck-n-Crew; February 9, 2015 at 10:51 PM.

February 9, 2015, 12:42 PM	#8
Kountzer0 Junior Member Join Date: February 9, 2015 Posts: 3	I used water as well, but I bought a few cases of the gallon sized jugs from the local mart for less than a dollar per jug. I needed many because I was testing the penetration of non expanding flat nosed lead alloy 265grain bullets in the ruger 45colt loads. Ended up finding the bullet in the 12th jug, which were 6inches deep. I also compared that to the nosler 255gr jhp, which was in the 7th jug and retained 75% mass and expanded to 1inch in diameter. 180 gr accubonds in 30-06 hand loads were similar, and all 3 have performed very well on elk, but I didn't want to shoot an elk without knowing the potential of each bullet. You could always save your milk jugs and do the same. For even less money.

February 9, 2015, 01:04 PM	#9
Marco Califo Senior Member Join Date: April 4, 2011 Location: LA (Greater Los Angeles Area) Posts: 2,598	Google Ballistic Gelatin. There are recipes and an FBI accepted calibration procedure that as I recall involved a certain air rifle pumped a certain number of times to penetrate X inches. A chronograph would also be useful to know the FPS of the BB or pellet. That said, to test hollow-point pistol ammo for expansion, I have found a combination of dirt and water, commonly known as mud, to be most useful. Sand in the mix, or below, will aid recovery by reducing penetration. Good place to start your research: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ballistic_gelatin $36.30 for 5 pounds of bulk gelatin powder: https://www.azurestandard.com/shop/product/345/ versus $100 for 5 pounds in little envelopes at Walmart. __________________ ............ Last edited by Marco Califo; February 9, 2015 at 01:12 PM.

February 9, 2015, 01:22 PM	#10
Mike / Tx Senior Member Join Date: April 8, 2000 Posts: 2,101	I use the sandy loam up at the farm. It is super fine sand about the size of baby powder. It sifts REALLY well and with about 8oz of water added to it is just about perfect. I fill up 5 gallon buckets put the top on, lay it on it's side across the top of a 55 gallon barrel, and fire into the top. At 25yds it will stop most stuff from the 41 down, but bigger I have to move to 50yds. I have been digging bullets out of this stuff my whole life and it is close enough to what I have recovered from game that I trust it completely. I'm sure if you look through some of my post you will see plenty of expanded cast bullets I have shot into it. Here are some more showing the bucket as well, Alloy Testing __________________ LAter, Mike / TX

February 9, 2015, 11:24 PM	#11
skizzums Senior Member Join Date: July 1, 2013 Location: Douglasville, Ga Posts: 4,615	I always use plain old water and I get great expansion results. it seems a little more violent than gelatin though. I have three five gallon buckets with a circle cut out of two of the bottoms. I put a piece f duct tape over the holes when I do the test. the buckets stand about 3" from each other when stacked. so if it breaks the first duct tape I am in the 10-13" range, second 13-16". I don't know how water penetration equates to gel, it just gives me a way to compare my own personal loads against each other quick and free. other than getting really wet, it easy and useful. I do it from my second story deck now because the water goes so high. __________________ My head is bloody, but unbowed

February 9, 2015, 11:38 PM	#12
TXAZ Senior Member Join Date: September 5, 2010 Location: McMurdo Sound Texas Posts: 4,322	~250 pages of a telephone book stops a 30.06' __________________ Cave illos in guns et backhoes

February 10, 2015, 08:25 AM	#13
ATPBULLETS Senior Member Join Date: July 31, 2012 Location: Land between the Lakes Posts: 267	mud and water...would have never thought it.... thanks,,, that's cheap enough __________________ http://i805.photobucket.com/albums/y...e/photo-25.jpg

February 10, 2015, 09:44 AM	#14
A pause for the COZ Senior Member Join Date: October 11, 2012 Location: Braham, Minnesota Posts: 1,314	I am interested in finding that Gel that can be remelted and used over and over. I have seen it, just cant remember were.

February 10, 2015, 10:41 AM	#15
wogpotter Senior Member Join Date: September 27, 2004 Posts: 4,811	This maybe? http://clearballistics.com/ __________________ Allan Quatermain: “Automatic rifles. Who in God's name has automatic rifles”? Elderly Hunter: “That's dashed unsporting. Probably Belgium.”

February 10, 2015, 10:48 AM	#16
FITASC Senior Member Join Date: December 6, 2014 Posts: 6,441	Big pickle barrel or 55 gallon drum with water - bullet will be perfectly preserved

February 10, 2015, 01:41 PM	#19
oldpapps Senior Member Join Date: September 22, 2011 Location: Middle America Posts: 518	I've used gallon plastic milk jugs filled with water. I was able to catch three 30 caliber cast lead and powder coated bullets fired from my 300 BlackOut. Each shot would split 3 to 5 jugs. The rainbows were nice. It took a long time for me to collect that many milk jugs. After using up most of the jugs, my granddaughter just shot one jug at a time. That was splashing fun. Note, bullets when hitting water sometimes do strange things like turning corners. Load with care, OSOK

February 10, 2015, 06:38 PM	#21
FrankenMauser Senior Member Join Date: August 25, 2008 Location: In the valley above the plain Posts: 13,424	Gallon milk jugs full of water... Soaked newsprint (not just wet - soaked)... Soaked phone books... Sand traps (dry or wet - the difference is just the depth of penetration)... Soaked rags... Just remember that while 10" of one of these mediums might be adequate to stop most bullets, other mediums might require 24-48" to do the job. __________________ Don't even try it. It's even worse than the internet would lead you to believe.

February 10, 2015, 08:02 PM	#22
WVMountaineer Senior Member Join Date: January 11, 2015 Posts: 330	Good ole, cheap, easy to find sand. God Bless

February 10, 2015, 08:40 PM	#23
30Cal Senior Member Join Date: December 3, 2002 Posts: 1,264	Snow bank. Cheapest thing going. May have to wait until May to observe the results though. Come one by; I've got a couple of them.

February 10, 2015, 08:59 PM	#24
4runnerman Senior Member Join Date: January 16, 2010 Location: Minnesota Posts: 3,577	Get a bunch of old Phone books,Put in box. Soak with water and shoot __________________ NRA Certified RSO NwCP- Performance Isn't Optional

February 11, 2015, 05:46 PM	#25
9MMand223only Senior Member Join Date: November 30, 2014 Posts: 283	I use 1 gallon water juggs I buy at wallmart for 88 cents each. The bullets will settle, perfectly flowered, perfectly, in 3rd or 4th jugg depending on load.I shoot top of jugg area with 1, then shoot bottom with another real quick. Doesn't always work, but can get 1-2 per 4 juggs pretty good. So if you take 16 juggs to range, expect you can get 4-6 tests.