Have you ever noticed? - Page 2

roy reali · June 9, 2007, 01:42 PM

This morning I went out to do some starling population control. I would spot a flying pattern. I would move to be within shotgun range. The birds then altered their paths to be just out of shotgun range. I moved, then they moved. Doves have nothing on these birds.

A few years ago I read an interesting article about mountain lions. I can"t remember where I read it. But it had an interesting theory about cougar behavior.

Oregon has mountain lion hunting. California hasn't had it for more then two decades. California has many more lion human encounters then Oregon. The population of the cats in the two states are about the same. This article suggests Darwinism has been negatively impacted in California due to the hunting ban.

The author thinks that if a mountain lion is born with some sort of predisposition to not fear man, in a "normal" state, these cats are taken out by hunters. The lions that have the genetic makeup to avoid civilization live on and reproduce the same. In other words, the human-cougar encounters in California are due to the fact that the bolder cats reproduce bolder off springs. These cats are doing better because their proximity to humans provides them with more sources of food. Their genes are being passed on even more then the more wary cats.

I don't know if this true. I am not sure I completely buy it. But here in Nevada we have mountain lions. We also have mountain lion hunting. Like Oregon, encounters with them are very rare.

crowbeaner · June 13, 2007, 09:41 PM

You have to change tactics. Get a "Mr. Squirrel" squirrel call. The d****d thing works. Just don't use it all the time and be ready to shoot when the treerats start to scold. You could try bait or another shooting lie to confuse them.

skeeter1 · June 13, 2007, 10:13 PM

Quote:

Please don't bring up Racoons! I pray every night they don't decide to move in too.

Yeah, my dad used to love to feed the raccoons, much to the anger of his neighbors. I don't share his affection for them. Last summer I was sitting in my house and heard these noises on the roof. Four of the little beasts had crawled up a tree and jumped off onto the roof. I've heard they will teaar up the shingles looking for insects, and I just paid $5K for that roof. My first thought was to pull out a .22, but then my brighter side reminded me that my house would be the backstop if I missed. Solution was to use a super-soaker. They didn't like that and haven't been back since.

Benonymous · June 14, 2007, 09:24 PM

I posted the story about the crows. My Dad related it to me many years ago. Basically they were on a property doing dome electrical installation work and it was pretty dull on the weekends, miles from anywhere. My Dad and a couple of colleagues decided to have a crack at the crows with a rifle. Sheep farmers hate crows. Anyway, they decided to hole up in an out-building and shoot out of the window. There were crows in the trees all around but when the three of them went up to the shed with the rifle, all the crows cleared out. When they walked back to the house with the rifle, the crows came back. So the three of them walked up to the shed with a rifle and a broom. Then two of them walked back to the house with the broom. The crows came back and the remaining bloke in the shed popped one with the rifle. They did this trick over and over. Dad's take on this was simple "crows are smart but they can't count"

RsqVet · June 20, 2007, 11:45 PM

Roy ---

The study you referance is a pretty good example of bad science. For one thing the genetic basis of behavior predispositions is very, very weak to non-existant in any number of far better controleld and studies populations than wild cougars.

Furthermore thinking that 20 years would have any effect on adult populations of something as relitivily slow to reproduce as a cougar is pure folly, evolution and selection occurs over a much longer time scale than 2 decades with an animal that has the generational time that a cougar does.

Laslty what is obvious and with the theory does not address is that Oregon and Nevada are radically diffrent than california when it comes to human poulation density, encroachment and sub-division of natural habitat, this leads to most if not all of the encounters with wildlife we see in CA, to some small degree these factors may also play a role in adaptation which means a cougar is more liekly to have interactions with people or a suburban enviorment and learn to like it or live within it, but agian these are learned behaviors not genetic traits...

crowbeaner · June 22, 2007, 06:03 PM

Treerats, 'coons, crows, wabbits, PESTS! My old .222 is twitching in it's case! Crows are by far the smartest, and they can live 25 years or more! That's a lot of corn seedlings gone, and more than enough owl harassment and turkey aggravation. I don't believe you will see this thread on an Orkin commercial! Take 'em out! All of them! No prisoners! We all need help. LMAO

June 9, 2007, 01:42 PM	#26
roy reali Senior Member Join Date: August 23, 2005 Posts: 3,248	Great Thread!!! This morning I went out to do some starling population control. I would spot a flying pattern. I would move to be within shotgun range. The birds then altered their paths to be just out of shotgun range. I moved, then they moved. Doves have nothing on these birds. A few years ago I read an interesting article about mountain lions. I can"t remember where I read it. But it had an interesting theory about cougar behavior. Oregon has mountain lion hunting. California hasn't had it for more then two decades. California has many more lion human encounters then Oregon. The population of the cats in the two states are about the same. This article suggests Darwinism has been negatively impacted in California due to the hunting ban. The author thinks that if a mountain lion is born with some sort of predisposition to not fear man, in a "normal" state, these cats are taken out by hunters. The lions that have the genetic makeup to avoid civilization live on and reproduce the same. In other words, the human-cougar encounters in California are due to the fact that the bolder cats reproduce bolder off springs. These cats are doing better because their proximity to humans provides them with more sources of food. Their genes are being passed on even more then the more wary cats. I don't know if this true. I am not sure I completely buy it. But here in Nevada we have mountain lions. We also have mountain lion hunting. Like Oregon, encounters with them are very rare.

June 14, 2007, 09:24 PM	#29
Benonymous Senior Member Join Date: January 6, 2005 Location: NSW Australia Posts: 254	Crows I posted the story about the crows. My Dad related it to me many years ago. Basically they were on a property doing dome electrical installation work and it was pretty dull on the weekends, miles from anywhere. My Dad and a couple of colleagues decided to have a crack at the crows with a rifle. Sheep farmers hate crows. Anyway, they decided to hole up in an out-building and shoot out of the window. There were crows in the trees all around but when the three of them went up to the shed with the rifle, all the crows cleared out. When they walked back to the house with the rifle, the crows came back. So the three of them walked up to the shed with a rifle and a broom. Then two of them walked back to the house with the broom. The crows came back and the remaining bloke in the shed popped one with the rifle. They did this trick over and over. Dad's take on this was simple "crows are smart but they can't count"

June 13, 2007, 09:41 PM	#27
crowbeaner Senior Member Join Date: June 4, 2007 Location: Upstate SC Posts: 1,943	You have to change tactics. Get a "Mr. Squirrel" squirrel call. The d****d thing works. Just don't use it all the time and be ready to shoot when the treerats start to scold. You could try bait or another shooting lie to confuse them.

June 20, 2007, 11:45 PM	#30
RsqVet Senior Member Join Date: February 20, 2005 Posts: 2,474	Roy --- The study you referance is a pretty good example of bad science. For one thing the genetic basis of behavior predispositions is very, very weak to non-existant in any number of far better controleld and studies populations than wild cougars. Furthermore thinking that 20 years would have any effect on adult populations of something as relitivily slow to reproduce as a cougar is pure folly, evolution and selection occurs over a much longer time scale than 2 decades with an animal that has the generational time that a cougar does. Laslty what is obvious and with the theory does not address is that Oregon and Nevada are radically diffrent than california when it comes to human poulation density, encroachment and sub-division of natural habitat, this leads to most if not all of the encounters with wildlife we see in CA, to some small degree these factors may also play a role in adaptation which means a cougar is more liekly to have interactions with people or a suburban enviorment and learn to like it or live within it, but agian these are learned behaviors not genetic traits...

June 22, 2007, 06:03 PM	#31
crowbeaner Senior Member Join Date: June 4, 2007 Location: Upstate SC Posts: 1,943	Treerats, 'coons, crows, wabbits, PESTS! My old .222 is twitching in it's case! Crows are by far the smartest, and they can live 25 years or more! That's a lot of corn seedlings gone, and more than enough owl harassment and turkey aggravation. I don't believe you will see this thread on an Orkin commercial! Take 'em out! All of them! No prisoners! We all need help. LMAO