Would this idea be useful?

Correia · February 26, 2002, 02:52 PM

I thought of kind of an odd idea for a shotgun feeding device today. It is actually kind of simple.

Would anybody be interested in a shotgun that was tube fed, but had an attached 2 or 3 round magazine, and a selector that allowed the user to switch between feed systems easily?

Just brainstorming, I would think that this could be handy because you could keep the tube stoked with shot, and have a couple of slugs on hand if desired. Selecting between the mag and the tube would be pretty straight forward and easy to do. When the action was then worked it would feed from the chosen feed device. Kind of like a select slug drill, only already on the gun.

The actual action would be based on the Browning BPS or Ithica bottom ejectors.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not into gimmicks or anything like that, I just wonder if this would be worth it. My shotgun is the same 870 that I've used since I was 12 years old.

C.R.Sam · February 26, 2002, 03:44 PM

If it is a bottom ejector......where you gonna put the box magazine ? Side ?

Sam

Correia · February 26, 2002, 03:55 PM

Yep, but it wouldn't be bad.

Maybe it is just a dumb idea.

Quartus · February 26, 2002, 04:06 PM

ALL ideas are useful.

Some are good for a laugh!

Actually, if the mechanics could be worked out, I like this idea.

Correia · February 26, 2002, 04:22 PM

I'm at work right now, but I'll expound on it later. Side mounted, short mag. But the action is bullpuped, so the side mag is over the grip, like the old German Fg42. Weird, but I think it is workable. BPS or Ithica allow downward ejection on a bullpup for ambi use.

Benjamin · February 26, 2002, 05:50 PM

European American Armory sold such a shotgun (but side ejection) in 1998. I am unsure if they still carry it, but have not seen it advertised recently.

Cthulhu · February 27, 2002, 04:56 PM

If it were a true bullpup, the side magazine would, most likely, be protruding where the firer's shoulder is placed, depending on which side it feeds from and the handedness of the user. If not, it would have to be well forward of the grip to allow for ambi use, which negates the benefit of the bullpup desingn, short OAL length with a longer barrel than a conventionally laid out weapon of the same length. If its a short magazine only for slug/specialty ammo use, I suppose it could be mounted vertically above the gun. Most bullpups require elevated sights to provide a proper sighting arrangement. If the magazine did not stick the user in the face and did not extend past the height of sights, it would probably work.

An 18" BBL'd conventionally arranged gun with a 5 or 6 round tube mag and your short detachable magazine would probably be short/handy and still give superior firepower to a similarly sized Rem 870.

Dave R · February 27, 2002, 05:24 PM

Didn't I see a conversion kit for Remington 870 that would do this? Convert a pump to magazine feed? Was I hallucinating?

The picture I saw (or hallucinated) had the tubular mag in place. Maybe there was a selector or cutover?

If true, then Larry is late to market.

Correia · February 27, 2002, 06:27 PM

Dave, you didn't hallucinate. It is from the same folks who make that folding cop stock. I played with one of these mounted on an 870 at SHOT. The mag attaches to the bottom of the tube, just forward of the receiver. However the tube no longer feeds shells. It is now only mag fed. This is not a new thing, Winchester actually made a prototype gun that did this during Vietnam.

Cthulhu, (man that is a cool name for those of us given bad nightmares by Lovecraft)

The short mag does not attach to the receiver. It attaches to the base of the mag tube just forward of the receiver. So the mag is actually not anywhere on the stock/receiver of the gun, but is horizontal above the pistol grip, like the old German Fg42. I've held an Fg42, the mag above the pistol grip doesn't interfere with shouldering the gun. They wouldn't let me shoot the priceless antique Fg42 though, go figure.

The barrel is on top of the mag tube, like a normal shotgun so a top fed extra mag would not work. One advantage of having the barrel on top of the tube on a bullpup is that the sights would be closer to the muzzle as opposed to a higher elevation, allowing more natural pointing.

I hope that clarifies my idea a bit. I would still like to build a HD bullpup on a BPS bottom ejecting action, with or with out the slug mag. Anybody want to loan me a large sum of venture capital?

Anyway, looking at the my slug mag idea, I'm afraid that it would probably be too complicated to build. And complicated is bad, simple is good. But I still think the basic idea has some potential.

Tol · February 27, 2002, 06:54 PM

I like it!!

I hunt waterfowl with a guy that has a Benelli M1. He can drop in a jucier load for the occasional goose that happens by on a duck hunt, and do it with a minimum of hassle. But he's got one shot, maybe two if he's obscenely fast. But a fresh magazine full of goose loads, by golly... now that would do the trick.

My 870 and I await,
Tol

February 26, 2002, 02:52 PM	#1
Correia Senior Member Join Date: December 3, 1998 Location: SLC Utah Posts: 3,740	Would this idea be useful? I thought of kind of an odd idea for a shotgun feeding device today. It is actually kind of simple. Would anybody be interested in a shotgun that was tube fed, but had an attached 2 or 3 round magazine, and a selector that allowed the user to switch between feed systems easily? Just brainstorming, I would think that this could be handy because you could keep the tube stoked with shot, and have a couple of slugs on hand if desired. Selecting between the mag and the tube would be pretty straight forward and easy to do. When the action was then worked it would feed from the chosen feed device. Kind of like a select slug drill, only already on the gun. The actual action would be based on the Browning BPS or Ithica bottom ejectors. Don't get me wrong, I'm not into gimmicks or anything like that, I just wonder if this would be worth it. My shotgun is the same 870 that I've used since I was 12 years old.

February 26, 2002, 04:06 PM	#4
Quartus Senior Member Join Date: May 8, 2001 Location: Virginia Posts: 3,823	ALL ideas are useful. Some are good for a laugh! Actually, if the mechanics could be worked out, I like this idea. __________________ . Better to know what you don't know than to think you know what you don't know.

February 27, 2002, 05:24 PM	#8
Dave R Senior Member Join Date: January 7, 2000 Location: Idaho Posts: 6,073	Didn't I see a conversion kit for Remington 870 that would do this? Convert a pump to magazine feed? Was I hallucinating? The picture I saw (or hallucinated) had the tubular mag in place. Maybe there was a selector or cutover? If true, then Larry is late to market. __________________ I am Pro-Rights (on gun issues).

February 26, 2002, 03:44 PM	#2
C.R.Sam Senior Member Join Date: October 29, 1999 Location: Dewey, AZ Posts: 12,858	If it is a bottom ejector......where you gonna put the box magazine ? Side ? Sam

February 26, 2002, 03:55 PM	#3
Correia Senior Member Join Date: December 3, 1998 Location: SLC Utah Posts: 3,740	Yep, but it wouldn't be bad. Maybe it is just a dumb idea.

February 26, 2002, 04:22 PM	#5
Correia Senior Member Join Date: December 3, 1998 Location: SLC Utah Posts: 3,740	I'm at work right now, but I'll expound on it later. Side mounted, short mag. But the action is bullpuped, so the side mag is over the grip, like the old German Fg42. Weird, but I think it is workable. BPS or Ithica allow downward ejection on a bullpup for ambi use.

February 26, 2002, 05:50 PM	#6
Benjamin Senior Member Join Date: December 27, 1999 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 358	European American Armory sold such a shotgun (but side ejection) in 1998. I am unsure if they still carry it, but have not seen it advertised recently.

February 27, 2002, 04:56 PM	#7
Cthulhu Senior Member Join Date: April 12, 2001 Location: Illinois Posts: 132	If it were a true bullpup, the side magazine would, most likely, be protruding where the firer's shoulder is placed, depending on which side it feeds from and the handedness of the user. If not, it would have to be well forward of the grip to allow for ambi use, which negates the benefit of the bullpup desingn, short OAL length with a longer barrel than a conventionally laid out weapon of the same length. If its a short magazine only for slug/specialty ammo use, I suppose it could be mounted vertically above the gun. Most bullpups require elevated sights to provide a proper sighting arrangement. If the magazine did not stick the user in the face and did not extend past the height of sights, it would probably work. An 18" BBL'd conventionally arranged gun with a 5 or 6 round tube mag and your short detachable magazine would probably be short/handy and still give superior firepower to a similarly sized Rem 870.

February 27, 2002, 06:27 PM	#9
Correia Senior Member Join Date: December 3, 1998 Location: SLC Utah Posts: 3,740	Dave, you didn't hallucinate. It is from the same folks who make that folding cop stock. I played with one of these mounted on an 870 at SHOT. The mag attaches to the bottom of the tube, just forward of the receiver. However the tube no longer feeds shells. It is now only mag fed. This is not a new thing, Winchester actually made a prototype gun that did this during Vietnam. Cthulhu, (man that is a cool name for those of us given bad nightmares by Lovecraft) The short mag does not attach to the receiver. It attaches to the base of the mag tube just forward of the receiver. So the mag is actually not anywhere on the stock/receiver of the gun, but is horizontal above the pistol grip, like the old German Fg42. I've held an Fg42, the mag above the pistol grip doesn't interfere with shouldering the gun. They wouldn't let me shoot the priceless antique Fg42 though, go figure. The barrel is on top of the mag tube, like a normal shotgun so a top fed extra mag would not work. One advantage of having the barrel on top of the tube on a bullpup is that the sights would be closer to the muzzle as opposed to a higher elevation, allowing more natural pointing. I hope that clarifies my idea a bit. I would still like to build a HD bullpup on a BPS bottom ejecting action, with or with out the slug mag. Anybody want to loan me a large sum of venture capital? Anyway, looking at the my slug mag idea, I'm afraid that it would probably be too complicated to build. And complicated is bad, simple is good. But I still think the basic idea has some potential.

February 27, 2002, 06:54 PM	#10
Tol Member Join Date: November 21, 2001 Posts: 92	I like it!! I hunt waterfowl with a guy that has a Benelli M1. He can drop in a jucier load for the occasional goose that happens by on a duck hunt, and do it with a minimum of hassle. But he's got one shot, maybe two if he's obscenely fast. But a fresh magazine full of goose loads, by golly... now that would do the trick. My 870 and I await, Tol