Question on .223 55gr. bullet seating?????

JROD82 · September 5, 2009, 05:01 AM

Need some advice on seating winchester 55gr. fmjbt w/c. Went to load up some cases that are trimmed to 1.750 give or take 5/1000ths. +/-. My data says to seat the bullets 2.250 oal but the crimp groove is no where close to the case mouth. Is there a MINIMUM oal to go buy. I'm loading LC 08 brass once fired, h335 @ 25.3grs with remington 7 1/2's (is this safe). I know majority of bullet companies vary in bullet design and I'm concerned about to high of pressure if going any further in the case. Lee states that min. oal is 2.200 with max being 2.260. Would it be safe to go on ahead and seat to where the case mouth is in the middle of the crimp groove and put a factory crimp in it. Any advice would be apreciated.

Doby45 · September 5, 2009, 07:25 AM

You need to disregard the cannelure and seat the bullet within the minimum/maximum data.

steve4102 · September 5, 2009, 09:02 AM

Seating depth (OAL) is rifle specific, not manual specific. Seat the bullets where they fit the mag, line up with the cannelure or wherever you like. As long as you are not pig jamming the bullet into the lands. The OAL listed by SAAMI and manuals is only a guide, the reloader is free to adjust the OAL to his specific rifle or bullet design.

This is from Accurate Powders web site.

SPECIAL NOTE ON CARTRIDGE OVERALL LENGTH “COL”
It is important to note that the SAAMI “COL” values are for the firearms and ammunition manufacturers industry and must
be seen as a guideline only.
The individual reloader is free to adjust this dimension to suit their particular firearm-component-weapon combination.
This parameter is determined by various dimensions such as 1) magazine length (space), 2) freebore-lead dimensions of
the barrel, 3) ogive or profile of the projectile and 4) position of cannelure or crimp groove.

This is from Hornady #7.

jepp2 · September 5, 2009, 10:07 AM

The 2.260" length is generally the longest OAL that will function through magazines. Higher grain bullets require longer OAL and hand feeding.

One thing to check. Shoot a couple, then remove the one currently in the chamber. You may find the bullet has moved forward due to the chambering action. Works just like an inertia bullet puller. I found to prevent this, I had to start putting a light crimp on my loads. But mine were lined up exactly with the cannelure ring. And my brass was full sized.

IllinoisCoyoteHunter · September 5, 2009, 10:22 AM

Quote:

You may find the bullet has moved forward due to the chambering action

Actually, you have that backwards!

When the round is chambered, the bullet can be pushed back into the case slightly if there is not enough neck tension or crimp. Do not disregard the cannelure...use it! Just don't go under published Min OAL, and as far as max OAL, make sure it fits in your mag and feeds reliably.

medalguy · September 5, 2009, 11:10 AM

No, he's right. The forward motion and sudden stop when hitting the chamber shoulder can sometimes result in the bullet being forced out of the neck a bit and forward, exactly like using an inertia bullet puller. I had this happen with one of my semi rifles one time, and that's when I started neck crimping all ammo that would be fired in an autoloader. This is not the problem with a bolt rifle, the opposite as you described happens there. The bullet may be pushed back into the neck slightly from the recoil.

steve4102 · September 5, 2009, 11:54 AM

Actually your both right! Here is how Sierra explains it.

Neck Tension

When we stop to consider the vigorous (read, downright violent) chambering cycle a loaded round endures in a Service Rifle, it becomes pretty clear it suffers abuse that would never happen in a bolt-action. This is simply the nature of the beast. It needs to be dealt with since there is no way around it.

There are two distinctly different forces that need to be considered: those that force the bullet deeper into the case, and those that pull it out of the case. When the round is stripped from the magazine and launched up the feed ramp, any resistance encountered by the bullet risks having it set back deeper into the case. Due to the abrupt stop the cartridge makes when the shoulder slams to a halt against the chamber, inertia dictates that the bullet will continue to move forward. This is exactly the same principle a kinetic bullet puller operates on, and it works within a chamber as well

IllinoisCoyoteHunter · September 5, 2009, 02:00 PM

Intereseting! I can definately see this. But, I have never had this happen in my AR. I guess it could if the neck tension was not there and no crimp was applied. Thank you for sharing that info!

September 5, 2009, 05:01 AM	#1
JROD82 Junior Member Join Date: March 8, 2009 Location: Lake Jackson, Tx Posts: 12	Question on .223 55gr. bullet seating????? Need some advice on seating winchester 55gr. fmjbt w/c. Went to load up some cases that are trimmed to 1.750 give or take 5/1000ths. +/-. My data says to seat the bullets 2.250 oal but the crimp groove is no where close to the case mouth. Is there a MINIMUM oal to go buy. I'm loading LC 08 brass once fired, h335 @ 25.3grs with remington 7 1/2's (is this safe). I know majority of bullet companies vary in bullet design and I'm concerned about to high of pressure if going any further in the case. Lee states that min. oal is 2.200 with max being 2.260. Would it be safe to go on ahead and seat to where the case mouth is in the middle of the crimp groove and put a factory crimp in it. Any advice would be apreciated.

September 5, 2009, 02:00 PM	#8
IllinoisCoyoteHunter Senior Member Join Date: December 23, 2008 Location: Southern Illinois Posts: 1,527	Intereseting! I can definately see this. But, I have never had this happen in my AR. I guess it could if the neck tension was not there and no crimp was applied. Thank you for sharing that info! __________________ ~~IllinoisCoyoteHunter~~ ~NRA LIFE MEMBER~ ~NRA CERTIFIED INSTRUCTOR~

September 5, 2009, 07:25 AM	#2
Doby45 Senior Member Join Date: January 19, 2009 Location: Powder Springs, GA Posts: 213	You need to disregard the cannelure and seat the bullet within the minimum/maximum data.

September 5, 2009, 09:02 AM	#3
steve4102 Senior Member Join Date: December 23, 2005 Location: Minnesota Posts: 2,955	Seating depth (OAL) is rifle specific, not manual specific. Seat the bullets where they fit the mag, line up with the cannelure or wherever you like. As long as you are not pig jamming the bullet into the lands. The OAL listed by SAAMI and manuals is only a guide, the reloader is free to adjust the OAL to his specific rifle or bullet design. This is from Accurate Powders web site. SPECIAL NOTE ON CARTRIDGE OVERALL LENGTH “COL” It is important to note that the SAAMI “COL” values are for the firearms and ammunition manufacturers industry and must be seen as a guideline only. The individual reloader is free to adjust this dimension to suit their particular firearm-component-weapon combination. This parameter is determined by various dimensions such as 1) magazine length (space), 2) freebore-lead dimensions of the barrel, 3) ogive or profile of the projectile and 4) position of cannelure or crimp groove. This is from Hornady #7.

September 5, 2009, 10:07 AM	#4
jepp2 Senior Member Join Date: December 24, 2008 Location: Loveland, CO Posts: 1,476	The 2.260" length is generally the longest OAL that will function through magazines. Higher grain bullets require longer OAL and hand feeding. One thing to check. Shoot a couple, then remove the one currently in the chamber. You may find the bullet has moved forward due to the chambering action. Works just like an inertia bullet puller. I found to prevent this, I had to start putting a light crimp on my loads. But mine were lined up exactly with the cannelure ring. And my brass was full sized.

September 5, 2009, 11:10 AM	#6
medalguy Senior Member Join Date: August 31, 2009 Location: New Mexico Posts: 1,033	No, he's right. The forward motion and sudden stop when hitting the chamber shoulder can sometimes result in the bullet being forced out of the neck a bit and forward, exactly like using an inertia bullet puller. I had this happen with one of my semi rifles one time, and that's when I started neck crimping all ammo that would be fired in an autoloader. This is not the problem with a bolt rifle, the opposite as you described happens there. The bullet may be pushed back into the neck slightly from the recoil.

September 5, 2009, 11:54 AM	#7
steve4102 Senior Member Join Date: December 23, 2005 Location: Minnesota Posts: 2,955	Actually your both right! Here is how Sierra explains it. Neck Tension When we stop to consider the vigorous (read, downright violent) chambering cycle a loaded round endures in a Service Rifle, it becomes pretty clear it suffers abuse that would never happen in a bolt-action. This is simply the nature of the beast. It needs to be dealt with since there is no way around it. There are two distinctly different forces that need to be considered: those that force the bullet deeper into the case, and those that pull it out of the case. When the round is stripped from the magazine and launched up the feed ramp, any resistance encountered by the bullet risks having it set back deeper into the case. Due to the abrupt stop the cartridge makes when the shoulder slams to a halt against the chamber, inertia dictates that the bullet will continue to move forward. This is exactly the same principle a kinetic bullet puller operates on, and it works within a chamber as well