Any info on this black powder rifle?

jkwidener · July 5, 2010, 04:21 PM

Got this rifle today and it has Debeaumont Roermond on the side of the barel and also a marking that has a * N --> "star N arrow" Here are some pictures of the markings and the rifle.

Doc Hoy · July 5, 2010, 04:36 PM

...welcome to the forum.

jkwidener · July 5, 2010, 04:42 PM

Thank You Doc, i have a feeling i will be on here pretty often. Have been into guns all my life "36 years old" and just got my C&R license last year.

bedbugbilly · July 5, 2010, 05:22 PM

Welcome to the forum - as you'll find . . . it's a neat place!

I'm just guessing on this so don't take it for gospel . . . . in looking at your photos, it appears to have a metal ramrod? It reminds me of some of the less expensive muzzleloaders that Dixie Gun Works used to sell in the 1960's. When I say "inexpensive" - they were back then but add the years and inflation, I'm sure they'd be more now. They used to have single barrel shotgun "kits" which if I remember correctly, were under $20.00 - various gauges, Belgium or Spanish barrels, locks, etc. Could you advise as to the caliber of this rifle and perhaps post a photo showing the entire rifle? It looks like a nice little rifle and I'm sure it would offer lots of fun as far as shooting - just check it out throroughly before you do. I'm curious as to what others have to say about it . . . maybe someone will know for sure!? At any rate, welcome and I hope that we'll see more of you on the forum! Be safe and have fun!

Jim Watson · July 5, 2010, 05:43 PM

Is this really a rifle?
I see no rear sight and a metal ramrod is more common on shotguns.

The (Star) N and the Peron you show as --> are Belgian proofmarks.

Edouard de Beaumont was a noted Dutch gunmaker in Maastricht, Holland, better known for the Beaumont service rifle. I found mention of him either using Belgian made shotgun barrels or selling Belgian made shotguns.

Roermond is in Holland 49 kilometers from Maastricht. Maybe he had a retail store there, but I cannot find mention of it.

I think the hammer is a replacement, the screw is not through the "fat" part of the hammer, but placed where it had to be to hit the percussion cap.

jkwidener · July 5, 2010, 06:25 PM

I dont have my micrometer here, but with a ruler, the bore at the end of the barel is 11/16. Are there any websites out there that show pictures of maker marks for these guns?

jkwidener · July 5, 2010, 06:29 PM

All of the de Beaumont rifles i am finding are lever action.

Doc Hoy · July 5, 2010, 06:32 PM

http://www.coreden.co.uk/page7.html

Appears to be from the Low Country. Both Debeaumont and Roermond are near Maastricht, NE.

Hawg · July 5, 2010, 06:32 PM

What you will find are proof marks of the country of origin. Remove the barrel and you will most likely find several underneath.
http://www.gunaccessory.com/Proof_Ma...oofmarks.htm#6.

Jim Watson · July 5, 2010, 07:29 PM

Quote:

the bore at the end of the barel is 11/16

.6875"
Probably a 14 gauge shotgun.

jkwidener · July 10, 2010, 10:14 PM

Here are several more markings and also the hammer mechanism.

jkwidener · July 10, 2010, 10:15 PM

More markings...

jkwidener · July 10, 2010, 10:17 PM

You will notice in one of these photos that the serial number, two digits were overstamped with other digits.

**4V50 Gary** · July 10, 2010, 10:33 PM

I'm sure you know that it is an industrial age gun. Locks were made by lockmaking firms. Sometimes the gunsmith would engrave his firm's name on it. Sometimes not. Markings on the barrel would be more reliable. Even then, the gun may have been assembled from parts salvaged from broken guns. Consider that thought.

That said, I think DocHoy and Jim Watson are on the right trail.

arcticap · July 11, 2010, 02:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jkwidener

You will notice in one of these photos that the serial number, two digits were overstamped with other digits.

To me it looks like there's a 3rd digit that was overstamped.

http://thefiringline.com/forums/atta...4&d=1278818218

July 5, 2010, 04:21 PM	#1
jkwidener Member Join Date: July 5, 2010 Posts: 18	Any info on this black powder rifle? Got this rifle today and it has Debeaumont Roermond on the side of the barel and also a marking that has a * N --> "star N arrow" Here are some pictures of the markings and the rifle.

July 5, 2010, 04:36 PM	#2
Doc Hoy Senior Member Join Date: October 24, 2008 Location: Naples, Fl Posts: 5,440	Can't help but..... ...welcome to the forum. __________________ Seek truth. Relax. Take a breath.

July 5, 2010, 05:22 PM	#4
bedbugbilly Senior Member Join Date: November 19, 2009 Posts: 3,287	Welcome to the forum - as you'll find . . . it's a neat place! I'm just guessing on this so don't take it for gospel . . . . in looking at your photos, it appears to have a metal ramrod? It reminds me of some of the less expensive muzzleloaders that Dixie Gun Works used to sell in the 1960's. When I say "inexpensive" - they were back then but add the years and inflation, I'm sure they'd be more now. They used to have single barrel shotgun "kits" which if I remember correctly, were under $20.00 - various gauges, Belgium or Spanish barrels, locks, etc. Could you advise as to the caliber of this rifle and perhaps post a photo showing the entire rifle? It looks like a nice little rifle and I'm sure it would offer lots of fun as far as shooting - just check it out throroughly before you do. I'm curious as to what others have to say about it . . . maybe someone will know for sure!? At any rate, welcome and I hope that we'll see more of you on the forum! Be safe and have fun! __________________ If a pair of '51 Navies were good enough for Billy Hickok, then a single Navy on my right hip is good enough for me . . . besides . . . I'm probably only half as good as he was anyways. Hiram's Rangers Badge #63

July 5, 2010, 06:32 PM	#8
Doc Hoy Senior Member Join Date: October 24, 2008 Location: Naples, Fl Posts: 5,440	Try this http://www.coreden.co.uk/page7.html Appears to be from the Low Country. Both Debeaumont and Roermond are near Maastricht, NE. __________________ Seek truth. Relax. Take a breath.

July 10, 2010, 10:33 PM	#14
4V50 Gary Staff Join Date: November 2, 1998 Location: Colorado Posts: 21,833	I'm sure you know that it is an industrial age gun. Locks were made by lockmaking firms. Sometimes the gunsmith would engrave his firm's name on it. Sometimes not. Markings on the barrel would be more reliable. Even then, the gun may have been assembled from parts salvaged from broken guns. Consider that thought. That said, I think DocHoy and Jim Watson are on the right trail. __________________ Vigilantibus et non dormientibus jura subveniunt. *Molon Labe!*

July 5, 2010, 04:42 PM	#3
jkwidener Member Join Date: July 5, 2010 Posts: 18	Thank You Doc, i have a feeling i will be on here pretty often. Have been into guns all my life "36 years old" and just got my C&R license last year.

July 5, 2010, 05:43 PM	#5
Jim Watson Senior Member Join Date: October 25, 2001 Location: Alabama Posts: 18,541	Is this really a rifle? I see no rear sight and a metal ramrod is more common on shotguns. The (Star) N and the Peron you show as --> are Belgian proofmarks. Edouard de Beaumont was a noted Dutch gunmaker in Maastricht, Holland, better known for the Beaumont service rifle. I found mention of him either using Belgian made shotgun barrels or selling Belgian made shotguns. Roermond is in Holland 49 kilometers from Maastricht. Maybe he had a retail store there, but I cannot find mention of it. I think the hammer is a replacement, the screw is not through the "fat" part of the hammer, but placed where it had to be to hit the percussion cap.

July 5, 2010, 06:25 PM	#6
jkwidener Member Join Date: July 5, 2010 Posts: 18	I dont have my micrometer here, but with a ruler, the bore at the end of the barel is 11/16. Are there any websites out there that show pictures of maker marks for these guns? Last edited by jkwidener; July 5, 2010 at 06:34 PM.

July 5, 2010, 06:29 PM	#7
jkwidener Member Join Date: July 5, 2010 Posts: 18	All of the de Beaumont rifles i am finding are lever action.

July 5, 2010, 06:32 PM	#9
Hawg Senior Member Join Date: September 8, 2007 Location: Mississippi Posts: 16,188	What you will find are proof marks of the country of origin. Remove the barrel and you will most likely find several underneath. http://www.gunaccessory.com/Proof_Ma...oofmarks.htm#6.