Rant+Question... Chokes.

Cowled_Wolfe · December 27, 2004, 11:19 PM

Ok, the other day I was looking at guns in Wally World while they mixed up some paint (which, might I add, isn't quite the color I wanted afterall...

), so the guy asks what kind of guns I'm looking at, and I mention an SKS would be nice. Somehow, before I know it, we're looking at shotguns... As soon as someone with keys to the gun case comes by, half the shotguns come out (ok, not quite half...)... I asked what the deal is with chokes, and the guy starts explaining... Roughly 5 seconds later, he changes over to how nice an 870 is, and how they were great when he was stationed in south America..

To end this rant, what's the deal with chokes?

All I know is that they're tubes that change shot patterns... Aside from that, I don't know anything... What end of the gun do they go in? Are they really useful? Who came up with these things? What do they cost?

rogerwilco · December 27, 2004, 11:35 PM

You are correct when you say they change the shot pattern. Usually you have 3 different chokes, Full choke, Modified choke and improved cylinder. Full choke usually holds the closest pattern and down the line to the improved cylinder, the widest pattern. Depending on what gun you buy and barrel you get, is what kinda choke you will get . Fixed chokes are barrels that only have 1 choke , no settings. Others have adjustable chokes, Usually a piece that screws over the end of the barrel that adjusts the choke. Then you have removable chokes, the end of the barrel is threaded and the chokes just screw down into the end of the barrel.
As far as price goes, buying extra chokes are not that expensive. Depending on what you use you gun for pretty much determines what choke you need.

sm · December 27, 2004, 11:39 PM

http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/...ghlight=Chokes

http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/...ghlight=Chokes

http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/...ghlight=Chokes

I recommend Bob Brister's Book Shotgunning: The Art and the Science - he also explains Chokes and most questions asked.

The bore of a shotgun is the # of lead ball of bore diameter that equal 1 pound.
Hence the 12 ga ( 12 lead balls) 20 ga ( 20 lead balls)

Choke is nothing more than constriction at the muzzle. Before screw in chokes we called the bbls "fixed choke". Custom was 26" = IC , 28" = Mod, and 30" = Full . Exceptions do exist - just trying to keep simple.

Cylinder Bore meant no Choke , Full meant approx 40 thoussandths of restriction. Sometimes one reads "POC" , for points of choke - each point is a thousandths.

HTH

HunterTRW · December 28, 2004, 01:13 PM

Here's a simplified way of understanding what choke, or barrel constriction, does in a shotgun: On your garden hose at home chances are that you have an adjustable nozzle that will change the shape of the stream of water issuing from it from a wide cone-shaped pattern to a sharp stream. Choke in a shotgun works in a similar manner. By constricting (or not) the end of the barrel, the shape (and hence, the density) of the emerging shot pattern is changed.

The degrees of barrel constriction are measured in thousands of an inch and have been given names. The major ones are: Cylinder, Improved Cylinder, Modified, Improved Modified, and Full. "Cylinder" means no constriction, while at the other extreme "Full" means a constriction of about 30 thousandths of an inch smaller than the bore diameter. The intermediate ones provide increasing degrees of constriction as we move from Cylinder to Full.

When you go to your local gun shop you will see a wide variety of shells for your shotgun. The basic variables are shot size (the smaller the number, the larger the diameter), quantity of shot, and amount of powder to propel the shot. At various degrees of choke, each of these shells will deliver X-percentage of their total number of shot into a 30-inch diameter circle at a distance of 40 yards. Typically, these percentages are: Cylinder 25-35%, Improved Cylinder 35-45%, Modified 45-55%, Improved Modified 55-65%, and Full 65-75%.

This gives us a basic framework for understanding the best combinations of shell and choke for each shooting situation. For example, if you wanted to kill a turkey, Winchester recommends size 4, 5, or 6 shot used with a full choke. Why? Turkeys are wary birds, hence they are generally shot at a distance. They are also heavy and heavily feathered so you want to hit them with the maximum number of larger shot to insure a clean kill. The full choke will deliver the greatest percentage of this shot (in the sizes mentioned) at the greatest distances. On the other hand, suppose you want to kill a quail: Winchester recommends size 7.5 or 8 shot used with an improved cylinder or modified choke. Why? Obviously, quail are smaller birds, hence the need for smaller shot (you want something left to clean and prepare for the table!). Also, quail are typically killed at a closer distance, but because they are agile you want a broader pattern with as many shot in it as possible to insure a clean kill.

This is an oversimplification of a rather complex concept; however, I hope that it will help you to understand the basics. I recommend that you obtain a copy of Winchester's (or any of the other manufacturers') Ammunition Product Guide (available from your local gun shop) and study its Shotshell Game Guide. This guide will detail the shot size and choke recommended for various types of game.

Good luck and good shooting!

Picher · December 28, 2004, 09:43 PM

To simplify things, if you're not a great shotgun shooter/hunter, use the most open choke you have (usually Improved Cylinder). You'll get more birds that way. Shoot when they are closer than 40 yards and not closer than 10.

I usually use a Skeet Choke for the first couple of weeks of bird season, when leaves are on the trees and shots are close, but difficult. The skeet choke produces the widest pattern of any choke and it's easier to hit birds with one up to 30 yards. Beyond that the pattern is so wide that birds can fly through it, or get away with wounds that don't kill immediately, but may suffer and/or become coyote fodder.

Swing and point to a spot ahead of the bird. Shoot only if the bird flushes upward if there's a chance that other people or dogs are around; shoot quick, shoot often, and keep shooting even if you can no longer see the bird flying through the leaves. Someday you may get one. That's early grouse/woodcock hunting in Maine.

Picher

December 27, 2004, 11:19 PM	#1
Cowled_Wolfe Senior Member Join Date: November 26, 2004 Location: Washington... Land of the apple, and the apple maggot! Posts: 803	Rant+Question... Chokes. Ok, the other day I was looking at guns in Wally World while they mixed up some paint (which, might I add, isn't quite the color I wanted afterall... ), so the guy asks what kind of guns I'm looking at, and I mention an SKS would be nice. Somehow, before I know it, we're looking at shotguns... As soon as someone with keys to the gun case comes by, half the shotguns come out (ok, not quite half...)... I asked what the deal is with chokes, and the guy starts explaining... Roughly 5 seconds later, he changes over to how nice an 870 is, and how they were great when he was stationed in south America.. To end this rant, what's the deal with chokes? All I know is that they're tubes that change shot patterns... Aside from that, I don't know anything... What end of the gun do they go in? Are they really useful? Who came up with these things? What do they cost? __________________ [Your ad could be here! Call 555-0122 for details.] (\__/) (='.'=)This is Bunny. Copy and paste bunny into (")_(")your signature to help him gain world domination.

December 27, 2004, 11:39 PM	#3
sm Senior Member Join Date: February 5, 2002 Posts: 1,819	http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/...ghlight=Chokes http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/...ghlight=Chokes http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/...ghlight=Chokes I recommend Bob Brister's Book Shotgunning: The Art and the Science - he also explains Chokes and most questions asked. The bore of a shotgun is the # of lead ball of bore diameter that equal 1 pound. Hence the 12 ga ( 12 lead balls) 20 ga ( 20 lead balls) Choke is nothing more than constriction at the muzzle. Before screw in chokes we called the bbls "fixed choke". Custom was 26" = IC , 28" = Mod, and 30" = Full . Exceptions do exist - just trying to keep simple. Cylinder Bore meant no Choke , Full meant approx 40 thoussandths of restriction. Sometimes one reads "POC" , for points of choke - each point is a thousandths. HTH __________________ Use Enough Gun TFL Alumni

December 28, 2004, 01:13 PM	#4
HunterTRW Senior Member Join Date: December 3, 2004 Location: The Lower Forty of Hill Country Posts: 177	Here's a simplified way of understanding what choke, or barrel constriction, does in a shotgun: On your garden hose at home chances are that you have an adjustable nozzle that will change the shape of the stream of water issuing from it from a wide cone-shaped pattern to a sharp stream. Choke in a shotgun works in a similar manner. By constricting (or not) the end of the barrel, the shape (and hence, the density) of the emerging shot pattern is changed. The degrees of barrel constriction are measured in thousands of an inch and have been given names. The major ones are: Cylinder, Improved Cylinder, Modified, Improved Modified, and Full. "Cylinder" means no constriction, while at the other extreme "Full" means a constriction of about 30 thousandths of an inch smaller than the bore diameter. The intermediate ones provide increasing degrees of constriction as we move from Cylinder to Full. When you go to your local gun shop you will see a wide variety of shells for your shotgun. The basic variables are shot size (the smaller the number, the larger the diameter), quantity of shot, and amount of powder to propel the shot. At various degrees of choke, each of these shells will deliver X-percentage of their total number of shot into a 30-inch diameter circle at a distance of 40 yards. Typically, these percentages are: Cylinder 25-35%, Improved Cylinder 35-45%, Modified 45-55%, Improved Modified 55-65%, and Full 65-75%. This gives us a basic framework for understanding the best combinations of shell and choke for each shooting situation. For example, if you wanted to kill a turkey, Winchester recommends size 4, 5, or 6 shot used with a full choke. Why? Turkeys are wary birds, hence they are generally shot at a distance. They are also heavy and heavily feathered so you want to hit them with the maximum number of larger shot to insure a clean kill. The full choke will deliver the greatest percentage of this shot (in the sizes mentioned) at the greatest distances. On the other hand, suppose you want to kill a quail: Winchester recommends size 7.5 or 8 shot used with an improved cylinder or modified choke. Why? Obviously, quail are smaller birds, hence the need for smaller shot (you want something left to clean and prepare for the table!). Also, quail are typically killed at a closer distance, but because they are agile you want a broader pattern with as many shot in it as possible to insure a clean kill. This is an oversimplification of a rather complex concept; however, I hope that it will help you to understand the basics. I recommend that you obtain a copy of Winchester's (or any of the other manufacturers') Ammunition Product Guide (available from your local gun shop) and study its Shotshell Game Guide. This guide will detail the shot size and choke recommended for various types of game. Good luck and good shooting! Last edited by HunterTRW; December 28, 2004 at 04:33 PM.

December 27, 2004, 11:35 PM	#2
rogerwilco Junior member Join Date: December 7, 2004 Location: Chesterfield,Virginia Posts: 152	You are correct when you say they change the shot pattern. Usually you have 3 different chokes, Full choke, Modified choke and improved cylinder. Full choke usually holds the closest pattern and down the line to the improved cylinder, the widest pattern. Depending on what gun you buy and barrel you get, is what kinda choke you will get . Fixed chokes are barrels that only have 1 choke , no settings. Others have adjustable chokes, Usually a piece that screws over the end of the barrel that adjusts the choke. Then you have removable chokes, the end of the barrel is threaded and the chokes just screw down into the end of the barrel. As far as price goes, buying extra chokes are not that expensive. Depending on what you use you gun for pretty much determines what choke you need.

December 28, 2004, 09:43 PM	#5
Picher Senior Member Join Date: December 14, 2004 Location: Maine Posts: 3,694	To simplify things, if you're not a great shotgun shooter/hunter, use the most open choke you have (usually Improved Cylinder). You'll get more birds that way. Shoot when they are closer than 40 yards and not closer than 10. I usually use a Skeet Choke for the first couple of weeks of bird season, when leaves are on the trees and shots are close, but difficult. The skeet choke produces the widest pattern of any choke and it's easier to hit birds with one up to 30 yards. Beyond that the pattern is so wide that birds can fly through it, or get away with wounds that don't kill immediately, but may suffer and/or become coyote fodder. Swing and point to a spot ahead of the bird. Shoot only if the bird flushes upward if there's a chance that other people or dogs are around; shoot quick, shoot often, and keep shooting even if you can no longer see the bird flying through the leaves. Someday you may get one. That's early grouse/woodcock hunting in Maine. Picher