Anybody Handload 7.65X53mm ammo?

Sportdog · September 25, 2006, 10:32 PM

I presently own a Model 98 8X57mm very sporterized mauser and am looking at a 7.65X53mm mauser of unknown origin. I handload middle of the road high pressure loads in the 8X57 and it handles them with no signs of excessive pressure. The only reloading manual that I have is a Speer No. 9 that shows loading for the 7.65X53mm and it only shows low pressure loadings. Are there any rifles in this caliber that are capable of more intense loading (like the 8X57mm is)? This rifle is also somewhat sporterized and belonged to my father but he had never even shot it although he has ammo for it. I will for sure take it to a gunsmith and have it checked out but just wondered if there is any hope for better ballistic performance in any rifles chambered for this round. Thanks.

T. O'Heir · September 25, 2006, 10:58 PM

Hi. It's likely a 7.65 Argentine Mauser. My old 45th Edition Lyman manual has data. It says the bullet is .311" to .313" diameter. Same bullet as a .303 Brit or 7.62 x 54. Easy enough to get.
Slug the bore before you do anything else. The bore size can vary. Hammer a cast .30 cal bullet through from the chamber and measure it with a micrometer.
My manual has data for 150, 180 and 215 grain jacketed and 155 gr gas checked cast, 205 gr gas checked and 214 gr gas checked cast bullets. An 8mm Mauser it ain't, but it's close. About 100fps less with the same bullet weight.
Shoot me an email and I'll send you the data. [email protected]

Al Norris · September 25, 2006, 11:51 PM

Are there any markings at all on the receiver?

I ask, because if it is a "modelo 1909," then you can duplicate curent .308 loads, as the reciever and barrel are heat treated for mid to high pressure loads. Plus, it has a true '98 mauser action.

Chances are that it is the more common "modelo 1889" or "modelo 1891," in which case you will want to stick to the low to mid pressure loads.

I've owned both and prefer the 1909 for reasons of strength and accuracy - I still have my 1909.

Norma used to make factory ammo for this rifle in a 150gr. at 2,920 fps and a 180gr. at 2,590 fps. Now, IIRC, they are selling 174gr soft points - probably to accomodate both grades of rifle. Military surplus ammo also comes in two flavors. A 211gr. at 2123 fps and a 185gr. at 2467 fps. All are FMJ. The Norma cartridges are made for the 1909 model, while the military stuff was designed for the earlier versions.

Norma brass is reloadable (boxer primed). Most surplus cartridges are not (berdan primed). They are also generally corrosive.

Your bore should be .301 with a grove diameter of .311. The standard 29 inch barrell will have a right hand twist of 1/9.8 inches.

Scorch · September 26, 2006, 12:43 PM

A 1909 Argentine or Argentine Police (Carabineros) rifle will handle any load you can put in a 98, since it is a Mauser 98 action. If you have a 1885(?) Rem rolling block, 1891, 1893, or 1895 do not try heavy loads as the bolt will peen into the receiver.

For a 1909, you can match 308 or approach 30-06 performance.

Al Norris · September 27, 2006, 01:48 PM

Sportdog, I just came in from my reloading bench. Here is what I've used in the past that worked well in my 1909 Argentine Mauser:

Hornady 150gr Spire Point (.312 dia.); 42.5gr Varget; Norma Brass; CCI #34 (mil spec) primer; 2.815 OAL. This cartridge shot a nice 2632 fps w/2.5" groups at 100 yards.

Hornady 174gr InterLock RN (.312 dia.); 41gr Varget; Norma Brass; CCI #34 (mil spec) primer; 2.820 OAL. 2369 fps with <2" groups at 100 yards. Shot several mule deer with this load, out to about 150 yards.

Rem 180gr Core-Lokt RNSP (.311 dia.); 40.2GR Varget; Norma Brass; CCI #34 (mil spec) primer; 2.870 OAL. 2310 fps with >2" groups at 100 yards.

All of my shooting with this rifle has been with the original iron sights.

Notes: 1) I used the mil-spec primers because of a recommendation of a long time C&R friend of mine. You could probably use standard Large Rifle primers, but I never have with this cartridge. 2) Because of the Mausers original military sights, the POA/POI on this rifle is set to 300 meters. At 100yds POI will be just about 4in above POA - adjust your aim accordingly. 3) These loads are not maximum loads but they are not minimum either. Mid-range would be a better description. 4) And finally, I used Varget because it seems to be the one powder that is consistent with my rifles (.223/30-06/.300wm/.300wby) at the altitude and temperatures here in Idaho. You may wish to use something different, but get at least the Lyman's book to check your workup loads with.

Sportdog · September 28, 2006, 11:30 PM

I really want to thank all of you for the replies and information. I received way more information than I expected and really appreciate you taking the time to help me out. Again, Thanks alot!

September 25, 2006, 10:32 PM	#1
Sportdog Junior member Join Date: February 28, 2006 Location: Southwestern Michigan Posts: 369	Anybody Handload 7.65X53mm ammo? I presently own a Model 98 8X57mm very sporterized mauser and am looking at a 7.65X53mm mauser of unknown origin. I handload middle of the road high pressure loads in the 8X57 and it handles them with no signs of excessive pressure. The only reloading manual that I have is a Speer No. 9 that shows loading for the 7.65X53mm and it only shows low pressure loadings. Are there any rifles in this caliber that are capable of more intense loading (like the 8X57mm is)? This rifle is also somewhat sporterized and belonged to my father but he had never even shot it although he has ammo for it. I will for sure take it to a gunsmith and have it checked out but just wondered if there is any hope for better ballistic performance in any rifles chambered for this round. Thanks.

September 26, 2006, 12:43 PM	#4
Scorch Senior Member Join Date: February 13, 2006 Location: Washington state Posts: 15,248	A 1909 Argentine or Argentine Police (Carabineros) rifle will handle any load you can put in a 98, since it is a Mauser 98 action. If you have a 1885(?) Rem rolling block, 1891, 1893, or 1895 do not try heavy loads as the bolt will peen into the receiver. For a 1909, you can match 308 or approach 30-06 performance. __________________ Never try to educate someone who resists knowledge at all costs. But what do I know? Summit Arms Services

September 25, 2006, 10:58 PM	#2
T. O'Heir Senior Member Join Date: February 13, 2002 Location: Canada Posts: 12,453	Hi. It's likely a 7.65 Argentine Mauser. My old 45th Edition Lyman manual has data. It says the bullet is .311" to .313" diameter. Same bullet as a .303 Brit or 7.62 x 54. Easy enough to get. Slug the bore before you do anything else. The bore size can vary. Hammer a cast .30 cal bullet through from the chamber and measure it with a micrometer. My manual has data for 150, 180 and 215 grain jacketed and 155 gr gas checked cast, 205 gr gas checked and 214 gr gas checked cast bullets. An 8mm Mauser it ain't, but it's close. About 100fps less with the same bullet weight. Shoot me an email and I'll send you the data. [email protected]

September 25, 2006, 11:51 PM	#3
Al Norris Moderator Emeritus Join Date: June 29, 2000 Location: Rupert, Idaho Posts: 9,660	Are there any markings at all on the receiver? I ask, because if it is a "modelo 1909," then you can duplicate curent .308 loads, as the reciever and barrel are heat treated for mid to high pressure loads. Plus, it has a true '98 mauser action. Chances are that it is the more common "modelo 1889" or "modelo 1891," in which case you will want to stick to the low to mid pressure loads. I've owned both and prefer the 1909 for reasons of strength and accuracy - I still have my 1909. Norma used to make factory ammo for this rifle in a 150gr. at 2,920 fps and a 180gr. at 2,590 fps. Now, IIRC, they are selling 174gr soft points - probably to accomodate both grades of rifle. Military surplus ammo also comes in two flavors. A 211gr. at 2123 fps and a 185gr. at 2467 fps. All are FMJ. The Norma cartridges are made for the 1909 model, while the military stuff was designed for the earlier versions. Norma brass is reloadable (boxer primed). Most surplus cartridges are not (berdan primed). They are also generally corrosive. Your bore should be .301 with a grove diameter of .311. The standard 29 inch barrell will have a right hand twist of 1/9.8 inches.

September 27, 2006, 01:48 PM	#5
Al Norris Moderator Emeritus Join Date: June 29, 2000 Location: Rupert, Idaho Posts: 9,660	Sportdog, I just came in from my reloading bench. Here is what I've used in the past that worked well in my 1909 Argentine Mauser: Hornady 150gr Spire Point (.312 dia.); 42.5gr Varget; Norma Brass; CCI #34 (mil spec) primer; 2.815 OAL. This cartridge shot a nice 2632 fps w/2.5" groups at 100 yards. Hornady 174gr InterLock RN (.312 dia.); 41gr Varget; Norma Brass; CCI #34 (mil spec) primer; 2.820 OAL. 2369 fps with <2" groups at 100 yards. Shot several mule deer with this load, out to about 150 yards. Rem 180gr Core-Lokt RNSP (.311 dia.); 40.2GR Varget; Norma Brass; CCI #34 (mil spec) primer; 2.870 OAL. 2310 fps with >2" groups at 100 yards. All of my shooting with this rifle has been with the original iron sights. Notes: 1) I used the mil-spec primers because of a recommendation of a long time C&R friend of mine. You could probably use standard Large Rifle primers, but I never have with this cartridge. 2) Because of the Mausers original military sights, the POA/POI on this rifle is set to 300 meters. At 100yds POI will be just about 4in above POA - adjust your aim accordingly. 3) These loads are not maximum loads but they are not minimum either. Mid-range would be a better description. 4) And finally, I used Varget because it seems to be the one powder that is consistent with my rifles (.223/30-06/.300wm/.300wby) at the altitude and temperatures here in Idaho. You may wish to use something different, but get at least the Lyman's book to check your workup loads with.

September 28, 2006, 11:30 PM	#6
Sportdog Junior member Join Date: February 28, 2006 Location: Southwestern Michigan Posts: 369	I really want to thank all of you for the replies and information. I received way more information than I expected and really appreciate you taking the time to help me out. Again, Thanks alot!