Identifying guns

sydneyswan · February 1, 2009, 03:47 AM

I recently inherited this muzzleloading shotgun form my grandfather and need help identifying it. I believe it was made in London, yet i cant' be sure as the words have faded. Any help would be appreciated.

sydneyswan · February 1, 2009, 05:00 AM

Here are some more pics.

Hawg · February 1, 2009, 07:44 AM

London doesn't mean anything. It probably originally said London Twist or Fine London Twist. However it is British. The crown over GP is a London Proof House definitive proof for shotgun barrels in use since 1637. The crown over V is a London inspection mark in use since 1670. It does not have the provisional proof mark in use since 1856 so it was made prior to that. Probably in the late 1840-early 1850 period.

James K · February 1, 2009, 03:50 PM

I think it probably did have a name on there, but it probably would not have been the maker. Many English guns were engraved with the name of the retailer, not the maker. Anyway, the gun is of good quality; the "fish scale" hammers and the gold inlay show that very well.

I hope I don't have to tell you not to shoot it, even with black powder. Those old twist or laminated barrels can let go any time, not only destroying the gun but possibly injuring the shooter. It is a beautiful family heirloom and deserves a prominent place of retirement on the wall or above a fireplace.

Jim

Hawg · February 1, 2009, 04:03 PM

It is a good quality gun but the gold inlay is probably brass as it is on this 1840'sh Ancion. Yeah the hammer cup has been replaced on one side. If the barrels check out ok there's nothing wrong with shooting mild bp loads out of it. This one is a shooter and handles better than any modern gun.

Dang, that pic isn't so big and fuzzy on photobucket.

Bill DeShivs · February 1, 2009, 10:19 PM

I doubt those inlays are brass.

sydneyswan · February 3, 2009, 05:14 AM

Your answers have been very helpful and I now at least know the era that it was made in. However, is it still possible to trace its roots back to its original gunsmith by looking at any unique markings.

PS
I fired this gun about a month ago with my Pa, as he wanted to teach me how to shoot a muzzleloader. I can confirm that it fired brilliantly and there were no problems with the barrels as we had it checked over by a gunsmith. It was a very unique experience and was entertaining for both my dad and a family friend, who had never seen one in action.

PPS
I will probably be submitting more firearms to be identified as I inherit them.

Hawg · February 3, 2009, 09:44 AM

Unless it as markings you haven't shown I doubt you'll find the maker unless somebody has one exactly like it and knows who made it and even then you can't be sure. Many European guns were highly ornate and many used similar designs.

February 1, 2009, 10:19 PM	#6
Bill DeShivs Senior Member Join Date: April 7, 2006 Posts: 10,979	I doubt those inlays are brass. __________________ Bill DeShivs, Master Cutler www.billdeshivs.com

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February 1, 2009, 07:44 AM	#3
Hawg Senior Member Join Date: September 8, 2007 Location: Mississippi Posts: 16,188	London doesn't mean anything. It probably originally said London Twist or Fine London Twist. However it is British. The crown over GP is a London Proof House definitive proof for shotgun barrels in use since 1637. The crown over V is a London inspection mark in use since 1670. It does not have the provisional proof mark in use since 1856 so it was made prior to that. Probably in the late 1840-early 1850 period.

February 1, 2009, 03:50 PM	#4
James K Member In Memoriam Join Date: March 17, 1999 Posts: 24,383	I think it probably did have a name on there, but it probably would not have been the maker. Many English guns were engraved with the name of the retailer, not the maker. Anyway, the gun is of good quality; the "fish scale" hammers and the gold inlay show that very well. I hope I don't have to tell you not to shoot it, even with black powder. Those old twist or laminated barrels can let go any time, not only destroying the gun but possibly injuring the shooter. It is a beautiful family heirloom and deserves a prominent place of retirement on the wall or above a fireplace. Jim

February 1, 2009, 04:03 PM	#5
Hawg Senior Member Join Date: September 8, 2007 Location: Mississippi Posts: 16,188	It is a good quality gun but the gold inlay is probably brass as it is on this 1840'sh Ancion. Yeah the hammer cup has been replaced on one side. If the barrels check out ok there's nothing wrong with shooting mild bp loads out of it. This one is a shooter and handles better than any modern gun. Dang, that pic isn't so big and fuzzy on photobucket.

February 3, 2009, 05:14 AM	#7
sydneyswan Junior Member Join Date: January 31, 2009 Posts: 8	Your answers have been very helpful and I now at least know the era that it was made in. However, is it still possible to trace its roots back to its original gunsmith by looking at any unique markings. PS I fired this gun about a month ago with my Pa, as he wanted to teach me how to shoot a muzzleloader. I can confirm that it fired brilliantly and there were no problems with the barrels as we had it checked over by a gunsmith. It was a very unique experience and was entertaining for both my dad and a family friend, who had never seen one in action. PPS I will probably be submitting more firearms to be identified as I inherit them.

February 3, 2009, 09:44 AM	#8
Hawg Senior Member Join Date: September 8, 2007 Location: Mississippi Posts: 16,188	Unless it as markings you haven't shown I doubt you'll find the maker unless somebody has one exactly like it and knows who made it and even then you can't be sure. Many European guns were highly ornate and many used similar designs.