Mini 14 and other .223s

stonewall50 · May 1, 2016, 08:20 AM

I am just wondering how many people own and regularly shoot a mini 14. How does it hold up in adverse conditions? How accurate is it for your within 500 yards? Reliability? Ease of use?

I had my interest peaked and now I'm just looking to get more info from users. Are there any rifles you might compare it too? What are some things it does well? And do you have any good reading material you recommend on it? I've done some Google on it and found this:

http://www.americanrifleman.org/arti...ruger-mini-14/

http://www.thesurvivalistblog.net/pr...h-rifle-model/

They seem to be pretty good summations. I mean I got my interest peaked when I saw these:

And I found myself wondering why they used these? I was thinking probably due to availability and so on. But are there true benefits to this rifle that go beyond "it is more reliable than the ar" meme? I'm not looking to compare it to an AR. Just looking at it as a .223 semi auto rifle and what it does well.

cliffhangernlv · May 1, 2016, 08:25 AM

I had a Mini that I bought when they first came out. It was not very accurate at over 100 yards. But it was fun to shoot. Not a tack driver but would take game with no problems. I should have kept it. The newer ones are supposed to be much more accurate. I have a Mini on my wish list in fact.

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swfan · May 1, 2016, 08:27 AM

i have a mini 14 that i bought about 5 years ago new. its accurate on iron sights at 100 yds and by that I mean I was able to hit the target and group in about an 10 inch circle on the iron sights
using a bench rest

its a very fun gun to shoot. and i like the looks over an ar15

243winxb · May 1, 2016, 08:28 AM

Article " shooting 2" groups at 100 yds. " With iron sights, no scope, 3" or smaller for me . I would hope for better accuracy with a scope and non-FMJ ammo.

Art Eatman · May 1, 2016, 08:52 AM

I traded in and out of four of the early Mini-14s. On each, I used a Weaver K-4.

Didn't have magazine problems back in the '70s/'80s--neither in function nor in costs. My day-to-day preference was the factory 10-round mag, since I could still carry the rifle at the balance point.

I generally could readily put the first three shots into 1.5 MOA. Never really cared about tight groups, as compared to my bolt-action rifles.

Uber reliable.

rickyrick · May 1, 2016, 10:19 AM

I don't mind mine... It was always accurate on the one shot groups for sure

Crazy88Fingers · May 1, 2016, 11:33 AM

I've had a Mini for years, and just recently bought my first AR. I carry an AR at work all the time, and am fairly familiar with its use. When I go to the range, however, I'm usually reaching for the Mini.

It hits steel plates (about 6" wide) at 100 yards, with iron sights, just fine. That's the most stringent accuracy testing I've ever put it through. The only malfunctions I've ever had were ammo related (hard primer, and another inserted backwards).

My only gripe, and it is a significant one, is its habit of the gas port rusting up and locking the action when not used for a while. There's been a couple of occasions where I've had to take a rubber mallet to the charging handle to get the action open. I understand a little more maintenance would easily prevent this. But I'm not one to tear a gun down after every box of ammo I put through it. From what I hear, there are stainless gas ports available now.

243winxb · May 1, 2016, 01:56 PM

Quote:

Locking the action

Had a firing pin rust into the bolt, trigger had been pulled, hammer dropped. New stainless steel model sitting in the rack. Had to take it apart to find the problem.

T. O'Heir · May 1, 2016, 02:41 PM

"...wondering why they used these?..." It's a relatively inexpensive(compared to say an HK SMG), select fire, rifle that doesn't look like a battle rifle. Just looks like a Mini-14. Its really an SR556.
500 yards is decidedly optimistic for any .223, but the Mini-14 is way over priced and inaccurate.
"...group in about an 10 inch circle on the iron sights using a bench rest..." Is ludicrous for a thousand dollar rifle. My old Plainfield M1 Carbine will shoot circles around any Mini-14. With irons and no bench.

rickyrick · May 1, 2016, 03:16 PM

Of The ones I've owned, I still own one, I never knew they had a problem until the internet.

Where the Ranch Rifle excels is in its intended use: a truck rifle. If you cold bore zero it, it will put the first three shots exactly where you intended them to go. Using good ammo will shrink groups too. It will work every time with any ammo.
You try to get MOA with Wolf ammo, you will be disappointed.

It's not Ruger's fault that the market drove the prices up. I agree, probably should be a $300 rifle. A bone stock AR should be $300 as well. The reason I value them the same is because a Ruger can be used right out of the box, they come with sights, scope rings and a magazine, many ARs do not.

Brian48 · May 1, 2016, 03:43 PM

I had a mini over two decades ago. It was an extremely reliable and fun to shoot rifle, but like many have mentioned, it was not very accurate beyond 100yds compared to an AR. A lot of this I think can be blamed on the propensity for the barrel to vibrate as it got hotter.

I had a chance to examine the newer ones and they appear to have much beefier barrels. I'm not surprised to hear the stories of how much better they shoot these days. I'd like to get another one eventually.

Mannlicher · May 1, 2016, 04:13 PM

I have been shooting this 188 series Ranch Rifle since the Nineties. It's proven utterly reliable, reasonably accurate, and has given complete satisfaction.

stonewall50 · May 1, 2016, 04:36 PM

See. From what it sounds like in experience is that the "rumor" is true. It isn't all that "accurate" after a few rounds because of heat and so on. It seems more like a semi auto hunting rifle or "ranch rifle" meant for a few shots. Not hundreds. And it is meant to work the first time. Makes sense to me.

And it seems like it still sells just fine. And the people who own them like or love them. The ones who bought it expecting a "precision semi auto battle tactical rifle" bought it without knowing this.

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turtlehead · May 1, 2016, 05:12 PM

I wouldn't mind owning one if it wasn't so expensive. And if it was more accurate. And wasn't a Ruger.

stonewall50 · May 1, 2016, 10:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by turtlehead

I wouldn't mind owning one if it wasn't so expensive. And if it was more accurate. And wasn't a Ruger.

Lol.

darkgael · May 2, 2016, 06:39 AM

I had a Mini-14 some years ago. It was reliable and fun. Not accurate enough for my tastes. It gave me about 4 inch groups at 100 yards using the irons. Sight adjustments were coarse.....iirc about 1/2" per click at 100 yds.
I gave the gun to my son. He still has it.
Pete

Skans · May 2, 2016, 07:35 AM

I have an AC556 - full auto version of the Mini-14. How well does it hold up? Well, it was made around 1982 and handles full-auto and tri-burst just fine. It has the 13" barrel, so it's no 500 yard precision shooter. Accuracy is good for 50 yards. I've never put anything other than a cheap red-dot sight on it and that sight isn't going to get me great results past 50 yards. That's just not what this particular gun is designed for.

The Mini-14 is a very hardy, reliable gun that can be made to shoot as accurate as a top-quality AR-15. Accuracy really has to do with what barrel you put on a gun. However, to get that kind of accuracy, it's all about how much money you want to invest in it. The issue is that replacing a barrel on a Mini-14 takes professional-level skill compared to replacing one on an AR15.

fourbore · May 2, 2016, 07:56 AM

Quote:

The Mini-14 is a very hardy, reliable gun that can be made to shoot as accurate as a top-quality AR-15. Accuracy really has to do with what barrel you put on a gun. However, to get that kind of accuracy, it's all about how much money you want to invest in it. The issue is that replacing a barrel on a Mini-14 takes professional-level skill compared to replacing one on an AR15.

I been thinking of trying another, this is the "last straw" post for me. Not interested.

COSteve · May 2, 2016, 11:55 AM

Mini-14 and accuracy can be divided into groups.

Group 1, Original Mini-14s with s/n's starting with 18x or 19x: All have a thin, "pencil" .560" dia. barrels that are prone to barrel heating, vertical stringing when warm, and general so-so accuracy. Barrel stiffeners such as the Accu-Strut developed in the last decade have greatly improved the accuracy capability of these rifles.

Group 2, Post 2004/5 Mini-14 with s/n starting with 58x: All have a thicker .625" dia., 18" barrel that both reduces barrel heating and virtually eliminates vertical stringing when warm. These Minis are considerably more accurate out of the box than the original "pencil barrel" versions.

Group 3, Post 2004/5 Mini-14 Tactical models with s/n starting with 58x: All have a thick .625" dia., 16", barrel that some shooters report can produce sub MOA performance with premium ammo.

Group 4, Post 2004/5 Mini-14 Target models with an adjustable harmonic balancer. This is a dedicated target model that's unique to itself.

I have a 583 series 'Group 2' type Mini Ranch Rifle and with my handloads it produces slightly over 1 MOA groups; not unusual for this class weapon with some easy to do, inexpensive tweaks. The secret is using good quality, precision ammo, just like when shooting any other rifle.

While I'm not a bullseye shooter at all, I use my Ranch Rifle to plink with and generally have fun. It's accurate enough to shoot bowling pins and clay pigeons at 200yds . . . . . . . . . with iron sights.

Yes, it has an $80.00, Accu-Strut (looks like a M14 gas system) which helps further stiffen and heat sink the barrel and yes, I have a $15 Choate hand guard that aides cooling and yes, I have a $6.00, reduced gas bushing to reduce the cycling speed and harshness and yes, I have $2.00, 1911 buffers and yes, I have a $60.00, smaller aperture, better rear iron sight, and yes, I have a $60 trigger job and yes, I thinned the front sight down from .070" to .050" wide for a more precise 'NM' like set of sights.

But all of those things cost me just over $200 and now it both looks sharp and shoots like a dream. Yep, 1¼ MOA groups at 100yds with irons. (Shot by a young expert CMP shooter at our club with better eyes as I'm 68 and like I said, no bullseye shooter.)

I've also got 3 AR15s as well including an scoped A4 version I have set up to shoot long range (400+yds) but in truth, my Mini-14 Ranch Rifle has fast become a favorite at the range or just plinking. Would I buy it again? Sure as heck I would but this one is not going anywhere!!

fourbore · May 2, 2016, 05:52 PM

Quote:

Yep, 1¼ MOA groups at 100yds with irons.

Sweet. And, those mods not near as extreme as a new barrel.

jmr40 · May 2, 2016, 06:01 PM

I've owned 2-3 over the years. When they were 1/3 the cost of an AR they made sense. I never had any reliability issues with casual shooting but they are not designed for hard combat use. They are made to be an inexpensive rifle to be kept in a farm/ranch truck or tractor for occasional shots at varmints. Some LE units and small countries military tried to use them as a cheaper alternative to AR's years ago, but most gave up on the idea. Accuracy for me was 2-3" at 100 yards. Acceptable for the money back in the 80's.

But today an AR can be had for $100-$300 less than a new Mini and most will out perform them. If I still had one and liked it I'd not sell it. But I wouldn't go out and buy a new one anymore.

CLC · May 2, 2016, 06:55 PM

I would like to see this 500 yard .223 load.

darkgael · May 3, 2016, 05:48 AM

Quote:

I would like to see this 500 yard .223 load.

A Sierra 77 grain MatchKing over 24.5 grains of RL15 or Varget from a 1-7/1-8 twist barrel.
Good to 600 yards.

Ibmikey · May 4, 2016, 05:52 PM

My Mini Tactical is fun to shoot and has tin can accuracy at 100 yards which is all i have ever asked of it. The rifle is reminiscent of my Carbine and Garand so i do enjoy sessions where informal plinking and steel shooting is paramont. It also is no AR 15 which is a easily modified reliable and accurate shooter, but then again i do not pit one against the other so each performs differently and acceptably to me. I have many AR's built for different needs and one Mini that fills a space on my shooting calendar also.

marine6680 · May 4, 2016, 11:59 PM

My friend had one several years ago.

It was a fun rifle, reliable... Never shot it at any real distance myself, so I can't speak on accuracy. Factory mags are the best, I hear lots of talk about issues with aftermarket mags.

It flings brass into next week, and can leave it banged up, so if you reload, it may not be the best choice.

The price on them is too high now, as I can get a decent to good AR for less. And the AR will likely be as accurate or more,and just as reliable. ARs are very reliable, just keep them lubed, they can get dirty as all get out if they are lubed.

If you live in a ban state, or just prefer the traditional look, then it's not a bad rifle.

May 1, 2016, 08:20 AM	#1
stonewall50 Senior Member Join Date: April 14, 2009 Location: Florida Posts: 668	Mini 14 and other .223s I am just wondering how many people own and regularly shoot a mini 14. How does it hold up in adverse conditions? How accurate is it for your within 500 yards? Reliability? Ease of use? I had my interest peaked and now I'm just looking to get more info from users. Are there any rifles you might compare it too? What are some things it does well? And do you have any good reading material you recommend on it? I've done some Google on it and found this: http://www.americanrifleman.org/arti...ruger-mini-14/ http://www.thesurvivalistblog.net/pr...h-rifle-model/ They seem to be pretty good summations. I mean I got my interest peaked when I saw these: And I found myself wondering why they used these? I was thinking probably due to availability and so on. But are there true benefits to this rifle that go beyond "it is more reliable than the ar" meme? I'm not looking to compare it to an AR. Just looking at it as a .223 semi auto rifle and what it does well.

May 1, 2016, 10:19 AM	#6
rickyrick Senior Member Join Date: March 15, 2010 Posts: 8,237	I don't mind mine... It was always accurate on the one shot groups for sure __________________ Woohoo, I’m back In Texas!!!

May 1, 2016, 11:33 AM	#7
Crazy88Fingers Senior Member Join Date: November 20, 2010 Location: WesTex Posts: 958	I've had a Mini for years, and just recently bought my first AR. I carry an AR at work all the time, and am fairly familiar with its use. When I go to the range, however, I'm usually reaching for the Mini. It hits steel plates (about 6" wide) at 100 yards, with iron sights, just fine. That's the most stringent accuracy testing I've ever put it through. The only malfunctions I've ever had were ammo related (hard primer, and another inserted backwards). My only gripe, and it is a significant one, is its habit of the gas port rusting up and locking the action when not used for a while. There's been a couple of occasions where I've had to take a rubber mallet to the charging handle to get the action open. I understand a little more maintenance would easily prevent this. But I'm not one to tear a gun down after every box of ammo I put through it. From what I hear, there are stainless gas ports available now. __________________ "And I'm tellin' you son, well it ain't no fun, staring straight down a .44" -Lynyrd Skynyrd

May 1, 2016, 02:41 PM	#9
T. O'Heir Senior Member Join Date: February 13, 2002 Location: Canada Posts: 12,453	"...wondering why they used these?..." It's a relatively inexpensive(compared to say an HK SMG), select fire, rifle that doesn't look like a battle rifle. Just looks like a Mini-14. Its really an SR556. 500 yards is decidedly optimistic for any .223, but the Mini-14 is way over priced and inaccurate. "...group in about an 10 inch circle on the iron sights using a bench rest..." Is ludicrous for a thousand dollar rifle. My old Plainfield M1 Carbine will shoot circles around any Mini-14. With irons and no bench. __________________ Spelling and grammar count!

May 1, 2016, 03:16 PM	#10
rickyrick Senior Member Join Date: March 15, 2010 Posts: 8,237	Of The ones I've owned, I still own one, I never knew they had a problem until the internet. Where the Ranch Rifle excels is in its intended use: a truck rifle. If you cold bore zero it, it will put the first three shots exactly where you intended them to go. Using good ammo will shrink groups too. It will work every time with any ammo. You try to get MOA with Wolf ammo, you will be disappointed. It's not Ruger's fault that the market drove the prices up. I agree, probably should be a $300 rifle. A bone stock AR should be $300 as well. The reason I value them the same is because a Ruger can be used right out of the box, they come with sights, scope rings and a magazine, many ARs do not. __________________ Woohoo, I’m back In Texas!!!

May 1, 2016, 08:25 AM	#2
cliffhangernlv Member Join Date: February 14, 2015 Posts: 53	I had a Mini that I bought when they first came out. It was not very accurate at over 100 yards. But it was fun to shoot. Not a tack driver but would take game with no problems. I should have kept it. The newer ones are supposed to be much more accurate. I have a Mini on my wish list in fact. Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk

May 1, 2016, 08:27 AM	#3
swfan Member Join Date: February 7, 2013 Posts: 27	i have a mini 14 that i bought about 5 years ago new. its accurate on iron sights at 100 yds and by that I mean I was able to hit the target and group in about an 10 inch circle on the iron sights using a bench rest its a very fun gun to shoot. and i like the looks over an ar15

May 1, 2016, 08:28 AM	#4
243winxb Senior Member Join Date: July 26, 2011 Location: USA Posts: 1,730	Article " shooting 2" groups at 100 yds. " With iron sights, no scope, 3" or smaller for me . I would hope for better accuracy with a scope and non-FMJ ammo.

May 1, 2016, 08:52 AM	#5
Art Eatman Staff in Memoriam Join Date: November 13, 1998 Location: Terlingua, TX; Thomasville, GA Posts: 24,798	I traded in and out of four of the early Mini-14s. On each, I used a Weaver K-4. Didn't have magazine problems back in the '70s/'80s--neither in function nor in costs. My day-to-day preference was the factory 10-round mag, since I could still carry the rifle at the balance point. I generally could readily put the first three shots into 1.5 MOA. Never really cared about tight groups, as compared to my bolt-action rifles. Uber reliable.

May 1, 2016, 03:43 PM	#11
Brian48 Senior Member Join Date: December 21, 2001 Location: Boston, People's Republic of MA Posts: 1,616	I had a mini over two decades ago. It was an extremely reliable and fun to shoot rifle, but like many have mentioned, it was not very accurate beyond 100yds compared to an AR. A lot of this I think can be blamed on the propensity for the barrel to vibrate as it got hotter. I had a chance to examine the newer ones and they appear to have much beefier barrels. I'm not surprised to hear the stories of how much better they shoot these days. I'd like to get another one eventually. __________________ Proud to have served.

May 1, 2016, 04:13 PM	#12
Mannlicher Senior Member Join Date: July 8, 2001 Location: North Central Florida & Miami Posts: 3,209	I have been shooting this 188 series Ranch Rifle since the Nineties. It's proven utterly reliable, reasonably accurate, and has given complete satisfaction. __________________ Nemo Me Impune Lacesset "The trouble with our liberal friends is not that they're ignorant; it's just that they know so much that isn't so.".........Ronald Reagan

May 1, 2016, 04:36 PM	#13
stonewall50 Senior Member Join Date: April 14, 2009 Location: Florida Posts: 668	Mini 14 and other .223s See. From what it sounds like in experience is that the "rumor" is true. It isn't all that "accurate" after a few rounds because of heat and so on. It seems more like a semi auto hunting rifle or "ranch rifle" meant for a few shots. Not hundreds. And it is meant to work the first time. Makes sense to me. And it seems like it still sells just fine. And the people who own them like or love them. The ones who bought it expecting a "precision semi auto battle tactical rifle" bought it without knowing this. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

May 1, 2016, 05:12 PM	#14
turtlehead Senior Member Join Date: October 20, 2015 Location: Phoenix, AZ Posts: 1,203	I wouldn't mind owning one if it wasn't so expensive. And if it was more accurate. And wasn't a Ruger.

May 2, 2016, 06:39 AM	#16
darkgael Senior Member Join Date: February 9, 2006 Location: Homes in Brooklyn, NY and in Pennsylvania. Posts: 5,473	Mini 14 I had a Mini-14 some years ago. It was reliable and fun. Not accurate enough for my tastes. It gave me about 4 inch groups at 100 yards using the irons. Sight adjustments were coarse.....iirc about 1/2" per click at 100 yds. I gave the gun to my son. He still has it. Pete __________________ “Auto racing, bull fighting, and mountain climbing are the only real sports ... all others are games.” Ernest Hemingway ... NRA Life Member

May 2, 2016, 07:35 AM	#17
Skans Senior Member Join Date: November 20, 2008 Posts: 11,132	I have an AC556 - full auto version of the Mini-14. How well does it hold up? Well, it was made around 1982 and handles full-auto and tri-burst just fine. It has the 13" barrel, so it's no 500 yard precision shooter. Accuracy is good for 50 yards. I've never put anything other than a cheap red-dot sight on it and that sight isn't going to get me great results past 50 yards. That's just not what this particular gun is designed for. The Mini-14 is a very hardy, reliable gun that can be made to shoot as accurate as a top-quality AR-15. Accuracy really has to do with what barrel you put on a gun. However, to get that kind of accuracy, it's all about how much money you want to invest in it. The issue is that replacing a barrel on a Mini-14 takes professional-level skill compared to replacing one on an AR15.

May 2, 2016, 11:55 AM	#19
COSteve Senior Member Join Date: September 6, 2009 Posts: 1,344	Mini-14 and accuracy can be divided into groups. Group 1, Original Mini-14s with s/n's starting with 18x or 19x: All have a thin, "pencil" .560" dia. barrels that are prone to barrel heating, vertical stringing when warm, and general so-so accuracy. Barrel stiffeners such as the Accu-Strut developed in the last decade have greatly improved the accuracy capability of these rifles. Group 2, Post 2004/5 Mini-14 with s/n starting with 58x: All have a thicker .625" dia., 18" barrel that both reduces barrel heating and virtually eliminates vertical stringing when warm. These Minis are considerably more accurate out of the box than the original "pencil barrel" versions. Group 3, Post 2004/5 Mini-14 Tactical models with s/n starting with 58x: All have a thick .625" dia., 16", barrel that some shooters report can produce sub MOA performance with premium ammo. Group 4, Post 2004/5 Mini-14 Target models with an adjustable harmonic balancer. This is a dedicated target model that's unique to itself. I have a 583 series 'Group 2' type Mini Ranch Rifle and with my handloads it produces slightly over 1 MOA groups; not unusual for this class weapon with some easy to do, inexpensive tweaks. The secret is using good quality, precision ammo, just like when shooting any other rifle. While I'm not a bullseye shooter at all, I use my Ranch Rifle to plink with and generally have fun. It's accurate enough to shoot bowling pins and clay pigeons at 200yds . . . . . . . . . with iron sights. Yes, it has an $80.00, Accu-Strut (looks like a M14 gas system) which helps further stiffen and heat sink the barrel and yes, I have a $15 Choate hand guard that aides cooling and yes, I have a $6.00, reduced gas bushing to reduce the cycling speed and harshness and yes, I have $2.00, 1911 buffers and yes, I have a $60.00, smaller aperture, better rear iron sight, and yes, I have a $60 trigger job and yes, I thinned the front sight down from .070" to .050" wide for a more precise 'NM' like set of sights. But all of those things cost me just over $200 and now it both looks sharp and shoots like a dream. Yep, 1¼ MOA groups at 100yds with irons. (Shot by a young expert CMP shooter at our club with better eyes as I'm 68 and like I said, no bullseye shooter.) I've also got 3 AR15s as well including an scoped A4 version I have set up to shoot long range (400+yds) but in truth, my Mini-14 Ranch Rifle has fast become a favorite at the range or just plinking. Would I buy it again? Sure as heck I would but this one is not going anywhere!! Last edited by COSteve; May 2, 2016 at 12:02 PM.

May 2, 2016, 06:01 PM	#21
jmr40 Senior Member Join Date: June 15, 2008 Location: Georgia Posts: 10,808	I've owned 2-3 over the years. When they were 1/3 the cost of an AR they made sense. I never had any reliability issues with casual shooting but they are not designed for hard combat use. They are made to be an inexpensive rifle to be kept in a farm/ranch truck or tractor for occasional shots at varmints. Some LE units and small countries military tried to use them as a cheaper alternative to AR's years ago, but most gave up on the idea. Accuracy for me was 2-3" at 100 yards. Acceptable for the money back in the 80's. But today an AR can be had for $100-$300 less than a new Mini and most will out perform them. If I still had one and liked it I'd not sell it. But I wouldn't go out and buy a new one anymore.

May 2, 2016, 06:55 PM	#22
CLC Senior Member Join Date: January 8, 2011 Posts: 603	I would like to see this 500 yard .223 load. __________________ In god we trust, all others must pay cash.

May 4, 2016, 05:52 PM	#24
Ibmikey Senior Member Join Date: June 1, 2013 Location: Now relocated to Texas Posts: 2,943	My Mini Tactical is fun to shoot and has tin can accuracy at 100 yards which is all i have ever asked of it. The rifle is reminiscent of my Carbine and Garand so i do enjoy sessions where informal plinking and steel shooting is paramont. It also is no AR 15 which is a easily modified reliable and accurate shooter, but then again i do not pit one against the other so each performs differently and acceptably to me. I have many AR's built for different needs and one Mini that fills a space on my shooting calendar also.

May 4, 2016, 11:59 PM	#25
marine6680 Senior Member Join Date: July 24, 2012 Location: Parker, CO Posts: 4,594	My friend had one several years ago. It was a fun rifle, reliable... Never shot it at any real distance myself, so I can't speak on accuracy. Factory mags are the best, I hear lots of talk about issues with aftermarket mags. It flings brass into next week, and can leave it banged up, so if you reload, it may not be the best choice. The price on them is too high now, as I can get a decent to good AR for less. And the AR will likely be as accurate or more,and just as reliable. ARs are very reliable, just keep them lubed, they can get dirty as all get out if they are lubed. If you live in a ban state, or just prefer the traditional look, then it's not a bad rifle.