Savage rifles with DBM

upstate81 · October 9, 2013, 09:45 AM

Hello all, Im just starting my search for a new rifle in .223. I originally wanted a savage weather warrior 16. Then i saw they were offered with detachable box mags. I have never really been a fan of these on centerfire rifles except the Rem 760/7600. Not to mention I have heard that savage guns with DBMs are often slightly less accurate. After seeing this i began to look at the Ruger hawkeye in SS. After talking to my father who owned one in 3006 ten years ago and all the questionable reviews on triggers and accuracy i was stumped. Then i thought why not a 20 in. heavy barrelled gun. Forgot to mention this will mostly be a target gun and range toy. However i do like being able to double duty my guns. Obviously savage has a ton of options as does remington. I am Aware of the quality of new remingtons but I have bought a 700 ADL 3006 and a CDL 243 in the past 4 years with great luck. I want to keep the price of the rifle alone under 750. I see a lot of older 700 BDL s for sale online but for the price of a new BDL or more. Any wisdom or advice is appreciated.

Brian Pfleuger · October 9, 2013, 09:57 AM

Are you looking for suggestions on other options or essentially between those two? What be your budget?

upstate81 · October 9, 2013, 10:03 AM

All suggestions would be appreciated for the rifles i have mentioned and others. I have to say the Tikka and the CZ are two guns I have ruled out already. I would like to keep my budget to 750 MAYBE 8 for the gun alone. I want real nice glass so ill save for that.

Brian Pfleuger · October 9, 2013, 10:37 AM

Well, there are Savage rifles available in .223 with the stainless barrel and much, MUCH nicer (IMO) stocks than the cheap, black plastic of the "weather warrior" series.

Ever so slightly out of your budget (isn't it always?

) at $820 from Bud's Gun Shop, is the Savage 12BVSS Varminter .223.

Also, if you really want to be creative and have a gun of your very own, you can get a Savage target action from Bud's at about $525 and order a custom barrel for around $250. You'd be looking at another $100 for a decent stock (like Boyd's). I realize that's pushing $900 but it don't hurt to throw it out there.

In regards to the DBM, it's often the magazine itself that causes the accuracy issues and I doubt it's a noticeable thing in most cases for normal shooters. I could be wrong, but I doubt you'd see any effect from the magazine unless you're shooting 1/2" MOA or less and probably then only at long(er) ranges.

cw308 · October 9, 2013, 10:42 AM

Check out Dick's Sporting goods. Rem. 700 Varmint 26"HB on sale $450. Good rifle. I would change the stock & maybe have the barrel cut down to 20" after I shot it for awile. Your wright about saving up for good glass. The scope should have more potential accuracy than the rifle, or you'll never know how good your rifle can shoot. Hope I helped in some way. Chris

upstate81 · October 9, 2013, 10:58 AM

Honestly i kinda have a feeling that ill go over my budget, thats what over time is for lol. I always thought setting up a custom gun would cost me quite a bit more having never really looked into it. On the other hand i thought the accustock from savage was decent. Atleast better than the Hogue on the 700 tactical. I could be wrong. I did handle a new 77 and it seemed like a quality weapon. So many options. Chris, my neighbor has that exact rifle in 308. Shoots great just dont wanna have to do so man y mods to get to where i wanna be. With the exception of a custom gun.

Brian Pfleuger · October 9, 2013, 11:00 AM

The black plastic accu-stock might be "decent" from a performance perspective, it's just ugly as hell and feels like a child's toy.

upstate81 · October 9, 2013, 11:07 AM

That right there is what i want to avoid. That is why the only plastic gun i own is a beater duck gun. Any thoughts on a bull vs standard barrell? I already know the differences and the prolonged string shooting. How groups open up and such. Will a heavy barrell be a real burden when i go walking around the farm?

Polinese · October 9, 2013, 11:13 AM

The upside to savage's newer DBM models is you can convert them to hinged floorplate or blind mag with little trouble. Take a look over at sharpshootersupply.com

Brian Pfleuger · October 9, 2013, 11:17 AM

My varmint gun is pretty heavy. Wood stock, big, extendable Harris bi-pod and huge 8.5-25x scope. It's not bull-barrel though. The weight never bothered me. We used to walk a perimeter that a couple hundred feet elevation and about a 3 mile circuit. I was never bothered.

On bull versus sporter or some such, it's really a barrel quality issue. Quality barrels without internal defects (stresses) don't change POI as they heat up.

I go with what I like in terms of looks and never worried much about the rest.

Here's my semi-custom Savage. It's a deer gun first and varmint second. My pure varmint gun is a bone-stock and scary accurate Ruger M77 MkII.

upstate81 · October 9, 2013, 11:20 AM

Ah good thought. I knew trigger swapping was easy thanks will do. What about shelling cash out for a used BDL in .223? I really like those and occasionally see them in a heavybarrell but seems like ill be into it for 8 and up. However it will be nicer than a savage with a plastic stock. I do worry about it being shot out due to it being a .223, which is a high volume shot type caliber.

upstate81 · October 9, 2013, 11:30 AM

I followed your thread on that great rifle. Im beginning to think maybe a standard barrelled rifle with some tweaks would be the ticket. Any thoughts about the Ruger guns? I did like them and for a price of about 650 its hard to beat. I have heard many mixed reviews.

Brian Pfleuger · October 9, 2013, 12:00 PM

My Ruger is incredibly accurate with my handloads and it always did well with factory ammo too. The only thing that's not stock is the trigger, which is a $79 Jard set at 13 ounces. I don't know much else specifically about them.

Been there · October 14, 2013, 09:29 PM

Don't overlook the Tikka models

taylorce1 · October 15, 2013, 12:01 AM

Quote:

Don't overlook the Tikka models

Except when was the last time you saw a Tikka without a DBM? OP stated he didn't want one with a DBM. The biggest turn off to me with the Tikka is that they're all long actions and only offer a 1:12 twist with their .223 rifles anymore. It isn't a total deal breaker if it's a smoking deal, but I'll buy a short action 1:9 twist rifle for the same money first.

DaleA · October 15, 2013, 12:18 AM

Quote:

the Tikka and the CZ are two guns I have ruled out already

Just curious, why no love for the CZ?

I have a soft spot for CZ because they put a set trigger on a regular old 'hunting' rifle when the general opinion seemed to be manufacturers couldn't do that because of legal reasons. As far as I know they never got into trouble over it and today others (like Savage's Accutrigger) have very nice triggers on their guns.

upstate81 · October 15, 2013, 12:39 PM

Taylorce1 hit the nail on the head with the Tikka issue. Plus the rifle just didnt feel heavy enough for me. Ah the CZ.. well honestly I have never seen one for sale in any caliber and I like to handle guns before i buy. I know nothing about them and I like to tinker with my guns and didnt know if mods and parts are readily available. Correct me If im wrong.

Rimfire5 · October 15, 2013, 05:46 PM

The Savage 12 series turns out to be a great shooter in .223 and .22-250.

October 9, 2013, 09:45 AM	#1
upstate81 Senior Member Join Date: October 20, 2011 Location: NY Posts: 801	Savage rifles with DBM Hello all, Im just starting my search for a new rifle in .223. I originally wanted a savage weather warrior 16. Then i saw they were offered with detachable box mags. I have never really been a fan of these on centerfire rifles except the Rem 760/7600. Not to mention I have heard that savage guns with DBMs are often slightly less accurate. After seeing this i began to look at the Ruger hawkeye in SS. After talking to my father who owned one in 3006 ten years ago and all the questionable reviews on triggers and accuracy i was stumped. Then i thought why not a 20 in. heavy barrelled gun. Forgot to mention this will mostly be a target gun and range toy. However i do like being able to double duty my guns. Obviously savage has a ton of options as does remington. I am Aware of the quality of new remingtons but I have bought a 700 ADL 3006 and a CDL 243 in the past 4 years with great luck. I want to keep the price of the rifle alone under 750. I see a lot of older 700 BDL s for sale online but for the price of a new BDL or more. Any wisdom or advice is appreciated.

October 9, 2013, 09:57 AM	#2
Brian Pfleuger Moderator Emeritus Join Date: June 25, 2008 Location: Austin, CO Posts: 19,578	Are you looking for suggestions on other options or essentially between those two? What be your budget? __________________ Nobody plans to screw up their lives... ...they just don't plan not to. -Andy Stanley

October 9, 2013, 10:37 AM	#4
Brian Pfleuger Moderator Emeritus Join Date: June 25, 2008 Location: Austin, CO Posts: 19,578	Well, there are Savage rifles available in .223 with the stainless barrel and much, MUCH nicer (IMO) stocks than the cheap, black plastic of the "weather warrior" series. Ever so slightly out of your budget (isn't it always?) at $820 from Bud's Gun Shop, is the Savage 12BVSS Varminter .223. Also, if you really want to be creative and have a gun of your very own, you can get a Savage target action from Bud's at about $525 and order a custom barrel for around $250. You'd be looking at another $100 for a decent stock (like Boyd's). I realize that's pushing $900 but it don't hurt to throw it out there. In regards to the DBM, it's often the magazine itself that causes the accuracy issues and I doubt it's a noticeable thing in most cases for normal shooters. I could be wrong, but I doubt you'd see any effect from the magazine unless you're shooting 1/2" MOA or less and probably then only at long(er) ranges. __________________ Nobody plans to screw up their lives... ...they just don't plan not to. -Andy Stanley

October 9, 2013, 11:00 AM	#7
Brian Pfleuger Moderator Emeritus Join Date: June 25, 2008 Location: Austin, CO Posts: 19,578	The black plastic accu-stock might be "decent" from a performance perspective, it's just ugly as hell and feels like a child's toy. __________________ Nobody plans to screw up their lives... ...they just don't plan not to. -Andy Stanley

October 9, 2013, 11:17 AM	#10
Brian Pfleuger Moderator Emeritus Join Date: June 25, 2008 Location: Austin, CO Posts: 19,578	My varmint gun is pretty heavy. Wood stock, big, extendable Harris bi-pod and huge 8.5-25x scope. It's not bull-barrel though. The weight never bothered me. We used to walk a perimeter that a couple hundred feet elevation and about a 3 mile circuit. I was never bothered. On bull versus sporter or some such, it's really a barrel quality issue. Quality barrels without internal defects (stresses) don't change POI as they heat up. I go with what I like in terms of looks and never worried much about the rest. Here's my semi-custom Savage. It's a deer gun first and varmint second. My pure varmint gun is a bone-stock and scary accurate Ruger M77 MkII. __________________ Nobody plans to screw up their lives... ...they just don't plan not to. -Andy Stanley

October 9, 2013, 10:03 AM	#3
upstate81 Senior Member Join Date: October 20, 2011 Location: NY Posts: 801	All suggestions would be appreciated for the rifles i have mentioned and others. I have to say the Tikka and the CZ are two guns I have ruled out already. I would like to keep my budget to 750 MAYBE 8 for the gun alone. I want real nice glass so ill save for that.

October 9, 2013, 10:42 AM	#5
cw308 Senior Member Join Date: September 2, 2010 Location: Plainview , Long Island NY Posts: 3,863	Check out Dick's Sporting goods. Rem. 700 Varmint 26"HB on sale $450. Good rifle. I would change the stock & maybe have the barrel cut down to 20" after I shot it for awile. Your wright about saving up for good glass. The scope should have more potential accuracy than the rifle, or you'll never know how good your rifle can shoot. Hope I helped in some way. Chris

October 9, 2013, 10:58 AM	#6
upstate81 Senior Member Join Date: October 20, 2011 Location: NY Posts: 801	Honestly i kinda have a feeling that ill go over my budget, thats what over time is for lol. I always thought setting up a custom gun would cost me quite a bit more having never really looked into it. On the other hand i thought the accustock from savage was decent. Atleast better than the Hogue on the 700 tactical. I could be wrong. I did handle a new 77 and it seemed like a quality weapon. So many options. Chris, my neighbor has that exact rifle in 308. Shoots great just dont wanna have to do so man y mods to get to where i wanna be. With the exception of a custom gun.

October 9, 2013, 11:07 AM	#8
upstate81 Senior Member Join Date: October 20, 2011 Location: NY Posts: 801	That right there is what i want to avoid. That is why the only plastic gun i own is a beater duck gun. Any thoughts on a bull vs standard barrell? I already know the differences and the prolonged string shooting. How groups open up and such. Will a heavy barrell be a real burden when i go walking around the farm?

October 9, 2013, 11:13 AM	#9
Polinese Senior Member Join Date: September 27, 2010 Posts: 949	The upside to savage's newer DBM models is you can convert them to hinged floorplate or blind mag with little trouble. Take a look over at sharpshootersupply.com

October 9, 2013, 11:20 AM	#11
upstate81 Senior Member Join Date: October 20, 2011 Location: NY Posts: 801	Ah good thought. I knew trigger swapping was easy thanks will do. What about shelling cash out for a used BDL in .223? I really like those and occasionally see them in a heavybarrell but seems like ill be into it for 8 and up. However it will be nicer than a savage with a plastic stock. I do worry about it being shot out due to it being a .223, which is a high volume shot type caliber.

October 9, 2013, 11:30 AM	#12
upstate81 Senior Member Join Date: October 20, 2011 Location: NY Posts: 801	I followed your thread on that great rifle. Im beginning to think maybe a standard barrelled rifle with some tweaks would be the ticket. Any thoughts about the Ruger guns? I did like them and for a price of about 650 its hard to beat. I have heard many mixed reviews.

October 9, 2013, 12:00 PM	#13
Brian Pfleuger Moderator Emeritus Join Date: June 25, 2008 Location: Austin, CO Posts: 19,578	My Ruger is incredibly accurate with my handloads and it always did well with factory ammo too. The only thing that's not stock is the trigger, which is a $79 Jard set at 13 ounces. I don't know much else specifically about them. __________________ Nobody plans to screw up their lives... ...they just don't plan not to. -Andy Stanley

October 14, 2013, 09:29 PM	#14
Been there Senior Member Join Date: October 1, 2013 Location: New Zealand Posts: 110	Don't overlook the Tikka models

October 15, 2013, 12:39 PM	#17
upstate81 Senior Member Join Date: October 20, 2011 Location: NY Posts: 801	Taylorce1 hit the nail on the head with the Tikka issue. Plus the rifle just didnt feel heavy enough for me. Ah the CZ.. well honestly I have never seen one for sale in any caliber and I like to handle guns before i buy. I know nothing about them and I like to tinker with my guns and didnt know if mods and parts are readily available. Correct me If im wrong.

October 15, 2013, 05:46 PM	#18
Rimfire5 Senior Member Join Date: January 2, 2009 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 923	The Savage 12 series turns out to be a great shooter in .223 and .22-250.